The Nintendo 64 thread!

[null1024]

How many of you guys have played on a real N64?

(raises hand)

I think though it is one of those systems that can benefit a lot from emulators-- and I'm usually one to insist on the opposite! Crisp edges, high resolution, and in some cases I've noticed a much higher framerate for some reason (I guess the emulator is cranking at full speed and most games are coded not to care..?). Try Rush 2049 on an emulator. Very impressive.

(raises hand)

N64 emulation is far better than actual hardware. The nature of HLE means that loads of hardware functions that take quite a while to perform on hardware are executed nearly instantly in emulation. Also, higher resolution and all that jazz. And things like Rice Video and hires textures.

Yeah. Not much reason for me to own that dark grey lump, other than the fact that there are quite a few visual quirks that go along with emulation [like Sin and Punishment being completely unplayable with onboard/lower end video cards under emulation due to the screen going one color].

[Skykid]

How many of you guys have played on a real N64?

Never played on anything else.

[Ed Oscuro]

How many of you guys have played on a real N64?

I have like four and I play them all at the same time

Also http://www.retrocopy.com/forumthread/41 ... lator.aspx

My main beef with the emuz is that they make the blur factor out the wazoo. Also the little line of visible pixels outside the black mask in Project64 is both interesting and annoying. Think I'll go try out this fast version and see if it does anything for Aidyn Chronicles

[BrianC]

I have played on a real N64 and I still play it occansionally. I just picked up Star Fox 64 for it recently.

[louisg]

I have played on a real N64 and I still play it occansionally. I just picked up Star Fox 64 for it recently.

That's a good one. I still haven't beaten it, and I have no excuse! I should pick it back up. You should post your impressions of it here

[Marc]

Still got mine, with about two dozen games.

Now I think of it, I remember enjoying WipeOut far more on N64 due to the pad. And I've just remembered that I own Mario Golf, which shits over every other golf game ever, and to which I become dangerously addicted every time I play again. Goodbye Christmas.

[BryanM]

I should take this moment to mention that the company that does the Mario Golf games was the same one responsible for SHINING FORCE. And also Golden Sun, if you're into that kind of thing.

By that, I mean they're a pretty good game development company. Even if they seem a little Golf-crazed these days. (Everybody's Golf, their bastard child version of the Mario Golf series (despite coming first and probably the reason they got the gig in the first place), seems just as beloved btw. I'm not gonna lie - the trailer that includes the guy getting pissed off and biting his club is the only thing that's made me ever want a Vita.)

You can get really far with simply understanding "pacing" - that making the player wait to do anything is the death of fun. What's-his-face's slightly disparaging remarks about Fire Emblem show they're aware of this throughly.

[Obiwanshinobi]

I should take this moment to mention that the company that does the Mario Golf games was the same one responsible for SHINING FORCE.

Interesting. I knew Shining Force was not really produced by Sega, but now I wonder if the same people didn't work on the golf minigame in Super Monkey Ball. Monkey Golf is, like, REALLY good. Haven't played any golf simulation sice the last century, and it just worked for me.

[louisg]

You know, I need to try Mario Golf one of these days. I keep hearing great things about it, but then I keep thinking, "Well, but it's just golf". But then again, I liked the Neo Geo golf game a lot, and I thought I wouldn't like fishing games and dug Sega Marine Fishing.

Is the N64 Mario Golf still the best one? And what about stuff like Mario Strikers or Tennis? Are those similarly high quality, or just a corny cash-in?

[EmperorIng]

Strikers (the original) is a pretty fun, bare-bones soccer game with mario characters - though unblockable supershots can get annoying, I suppose you can say it's your fault for letting your opponent pull one off in the first place. The sequel added in a lot more items and gimmicks to make it more "Mario" but that came at the result of less balance in the gameplay. I would say Toadstool Tour on the GC is my personal favorite Mario Golf outing, as well. But the n64 one is pretty good as well.

[BrianC]

Is the N64 Mario Golf still the best one? And what about stuff like Mario Strikers or Tennis? Are those similarly high quality, or just a corny cash-in?

I actually like the GBC one the best due to combining Golf with RPG elements. I love Hot Shots, Mario Golf GBA, and the N64 game, though I actually prefer the GBC one over GBA since it keeps the mechanics simple. Mario Tennis GBC, N64, and GCN I found to be good as well, though I heard the latest 3DS one isn't that hot.

By that, I mean they're a pretty good game development company. Even if they seem a little Golf-crazed these days. (Everybody's Golf, their bastard child version of the Mario Golf series (despite coming first and probably the reason they got the gig in the first place), seems just as beloved btw. I'm not gonna lie - the trailer that includes the guy getting pissed off and biting his club is the only thing that's made me ever want a Vita.

Camelot only did the first Everybody's Golf/Hot Shots Golf. All of the others are done by Clap Hanz. Personally, I like some aspects of the original Hot Shots Golf (namely the mini golf) better than the N64 Mario Golf. Camelot's recent games include Mario Tennis Open on 3DS and Golden Sun DS. As far as I know, the last Golf game they did was We Love Golf on the Wii. Mario Tennis on 3DS seems to be pretty mediocore from what I read and tried of it (played a bit of it on an in store demo).

[Ed Oscuro]

I have played on a real N64 and I still play it occansionally. I just picked up Star Fox 64 for it recently.

That's a good one. I still haven't beaten it, and I have no excuse! I should pick it back up. You should post your impressions of it here

Impressions: Polygonal

I actually should go back and try it again. It looked like one of the most impressive games at the time. Remember it came with a bigger box than the other games (for the Rumble Pack I think - Majora's Mask had a similar bigger box release alongside the regular-sized version as well, but possibly Japan-only).

[EmperorIng]

I actually bought an expansion pack solely for Majora's Mask. Speaking nostalgically, it was the first game I was ever hyped for.

[trap15]

Majora's Mask = greatest LoZ.


Come at me, OoT bros.

[Skykid]

Majora's Mask = greatest LoZ.

Come at me, OoT bros.

I always agreed with this, but I respect the fact it's too hardcore for some people to digest.

Pussies.

[null1024]

I have played on a real N64 and I still play it occansionally. I just picked up Star Fox 64 for it recently.

That's a good one. I still haven't beaten it, and I have no excuse! I should pick it back up. You should post your impressions of it here

Impressions: Polygonal

I actually should go back and try it again. It looked like one of the most impressive games at the time. Remember it came with a bigger box than the other games (for the Rumble Pack I think - Majora's Mask had a similar bigger box release alongside the regular-sized version as well, but possibly Japan-only).

Star Fox 64 is easily one of the best rail shooters I've played. I should probably buy the 3DS update of it, I have the N64 version on Virtual Console. Haven't had an actual N64 cart of the game in forever, it got stolen along with a lot of my other N64 stuff [like my Expansion Pak, gaaaah] when my brother took it to some friend's house.

[louisg]

Hey Skykid:

Oh, so Sin and Punishment 1 vs. 2. We never got into that. They're both good I suppose, but I think 1 is a tighter game. I liked it a lot as a scrolling Cabal-style game, and when they added that other axis of movement in, I felt like it made it actually a little more generic somehow, like it became Space Harrier with aiming. Which isn't bad-- I love Space Harrier-- but I think S&P1 was more distinct before.

There's no issue for me as far as playing with the Wiimote-- I actually wish there'd been more FPSses and such on Wii, because I think aiming with the controller is actually quite natural. I usually brace the arm holding the Wiimote over the arm holding the nunchuck so that it doesn't get fatigued, and that works very well.

But what I didn't like about 2 was that I felt like it was more drawn out. Some levels were great, like the first couple (not counting the training level). But then you get some fillerish parts like the second half of the sky castle level and its boss which is literally a bunch of boxes that occasionally open and fire. Since it's so long, there's also a lot more repetition in the enemy waves. Some of the bosses took way too long, like the dolphins. In S&P1, they reigned in the Treasureisms a little, and I think it was for the best. By contrast, in the first game, the only part I thought was dull was that subway part.

And, this is just aesthetic, but I don't like the lighting that they used on a good portion of the game. It's too glow-y, and makes me want to squint. It also makes the graphics look more dull than they should, which strangely makes it look lower tech and more washed out. When possible, I prefer clean lines in my graphics. I did think the water tunnel looked very good, as did the first half of the sky fortress level, and some of the bosses were impressive looking.

Finally, isn't the first game less checkpointy? But that's from memory; maybe it's not.

This should probably be spun off into its own thread, but what'd you like about S&P2? I'm looking for a reason to go back to it and finish it.

[Skykid]

But what I didn't like about 2 was that I felt like it was more drawn out. Some levels were great, like the first couple (not counting the training level). But then you get some fillerish parts like the second half of the sky castle level and its boss which is literally a bunch of boxes that occasionally open and fire. Since it's so long, there's also a lot more repetition in the enemy waves. Some of the bosses took way too long, like the dolphins. In S&P1, they reigned in the Treasureisms a little, and I think it was for the best. By contrast, in the first game, the only part I thought was dull was that subway part.

I agree with all of this. Tbh my biggest issue with 2 is also that it's just too damn long. The Treasurisms, as you noted, are in mass effect, and it's bloated as a result. I'd argue the first is drawn out too, but not in the same league.

I love the interface of the second, it's so beautifully married to the wiimote and nunchuk. The freedom of movement and firing is like Space Harrier but far evolved. There's a hugely dynamic element to the way you make full use of the screen space. The first is more static since gravity is in effect - and I understand why that's also considered a good thing - but I just like the way you can spring off the ground at any moment, use your dodge to clean up the screen and pinpoint instantly the targets you want to rebound incoming projectiles back at. It's quite balletic when you're in the flow.

I admit to being a bit seduced by the cinematic nature of 2: it's just so bold and exciting. Kind of like an endless set piece. I love the way Treasure just create any scenario they can think of, no matter how wild, and then stuff them with scoring intricacies that involve playing each section and boss in a particular way to squeeze more and more out of your multipliers and bonuses.

Problem is, 2 definitely takes the piss in regard to one-sitting game length. I'd love a directors cut that excises a couple of stages and a handful of bosses, and chops some of the others down, perhaps combining them together. I think 45 minutes would be optimal. And the last boss is a bit of a wally.

To that end it's not a perfect game, but love so much about it (and in it) it's easily one of my favourite original titles of the current gen.

I should also note, Obiwanshinobi, you're not invited to this conversation.

[louisg]

Yeah, I agree that Sin and Punishment 2 has some better set pieces, though so far I haven't seen anything quite as thrilling as the carrier part in the first game. Maybe I'll pick it back up soon and play through it-- I think I called it quits halfway through the haunted forest level.

On a related note, I went back to Star Fox 64 and beat it on a mostly-hard course, including Aquas. It's really good! My only problem with it is that it's pretty easy even as rail shooters go. There's a lot of replayability because of how they did the branching. I'm sure there are still a few more things to discover that I haven't found.

One thing I have to say is that, due to the controls to do loops and split-Ses, it's one of the few space games with free-flight parts I've ever played where I feel like I'm doing more than just endlessly going in circles. I think it adds a lot of good strategy, and helps keeps things fast.

It also makes me wish Geist Force had seen the light of day, and the home port of Planet Harriers released-- there are precious few decent rail shooters out there. I'm not sure why the genre is so unloved, especially during the 32-bit era when systems were up to the task.

And seriously, Starfox Assault? What a let-down. That was such a perfect opportunity to make a fluid, fast, beautiful Starfox game and they blew it. I hope Nintendo makes another one, but that doesn't seem likely.

So if you branch at Corneria that's as hard as the game gets? I guess the game probably *is* as hard as it could be and still remain fair, given that the framerate is fairly low. Already it gets to be a little cheap in a couple spots where the fighting is especially dense.

Wait, I just noticed there's a medal system It looks like whoever owned the game before me is totally clobbering my score. (I beat it with total hits 778, 5 ships in reserve, though Peppy and Slippy bit the dust on the second-to-last level).

[XoPachi]

I still have my Pikachu N64. Got all the goods. Turok, Extreme G, Jet Force Gemini, Perfect Dark, gold Zelda carts, Mario for days, Winback, Starfox. I have a good few of the "staples" of the system. Ones people really like that I don't have are most Rare titles and F-Zero. But I feel I don't need it if I have GX.

[MOSQUITO FIGHTER]

[lovecraft]

I have good, intact memories of that system... Enough to keep it with my favs :

- Mario 64
- Castlevania 64 (YES! it's in 3D and blurry, but still a good Castlevania, and quite more entertaining than the PS2 ones!)
- Mystical Ninja 1 & 2
- Mario Kart 64
- Diddy Kong Racing
- Star Soldier (nice one by Hudson)
- Dezaemon 3D (excellent shmup editor)

[trap15]

I need to do this at some point

[Ed Oscuro]

I spent a minute with 1964 Ultrafast V3 - terrible video options (aspect ratio isn't maintained when selecting 1920x1200) and the characters in Aidyn Chronicles tend to render without all their textures on, so they look black. The controller is odd...I had to leave Y-axis inverted but I also had to invert the Xbox 360 triggers for no apparent reason. The rendering issues are a killer, though - it's a shame because the game runs so much better at 200MHz.

[Jonathan Ingram]

I spent a minute with 1964 Ultrafast V3 - terrible video options (aspect ratio isn't maintained when selecting 1920x1200) and the characters in Aidyn Chronicles tend to render without all their textures on, so they look black.

The emulator must be self-aware, no doubt about it. It doesn`t want you to play that awful game.

[BrianC]

Slightly off topic, but I was watching an episode of Big Bang Theory and I was surprised to see Sheldon talking about playing Super Mario 64 on an emulator.

[Drum]

I still have my Pikachu N64. Got all the goods. Turok, Extreme G, Jet Force Gemini, Perfect Dark, gold Zelda carts, Mario for days, Winback, Starfox. I have a good few of the "staples" of the system. Ones people really like that I don't have are most Rare titles and F-Zero. But I feel I don't need it if I have GX.

X has definite advantages over GX - better music (butt rock), no broken/exploitable snaking physics, the X cup.

[trap15]

no broken/exploitable snaking physics

At least it doesn't have this absolute riot http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KknctBMvv5I

[Ed Oscuro]

no broken/exploitable snaking physics

At least it doesn't have this absolute riot http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KknctBMvv5I

And I thought Castlevania 64 levels were vertigo-inducing. That would have given me nightmares. Even playing it the right way...playing the "wrong way" looks like "video games for the Old Ones"

I spent a minute with 1964 Ultrafast V3 - terrible video options (aspect ratio isn't maintained when selecting 1920x1200) and the characters in Aidyn Chronicles tend to render without all their textures on, so they look black.

The emulator must be self-aware, no doubt about it. It doesn`t want you to play that awful game.

Self-aware but lacking in intelligence, obviously.

The game isn't perfect (it's an RPG after all, and hews much too closely to the "you must wait in turn" convention with long battles for my liking) but I don't think I should take a bunch of guff for liking it despite its faults. Once you get past the admittedly lulzy intro the story has some interesting turns and there's quite a lot of customization and depth possible.

[null1024]

no broken/exploitable snaking physics

At least it doesn't have this absolute riot http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KknctBMvv5I

GX time trial runs are fucking normal compared to X.
X's much more broken than GX. I still love it to death.