Racketboy "Defining Shmups" Article - IT'S UP!

[BulletMagnet]

Okay - Gunbird has been added in, the 1940 segment has been reworded, and the Gradius section now contains a quick reference to Scramble. Have at you!

[Hagane]

Could nitpick a bit, but overall it's pretty good.

[BulletMagnet]

Could nitpick a bit

You might as well do so now, as I'm hoping to submit this thing to RB soon...all that's left is a good Rando-ing before it goes out.

[Shatterhand]

Well, if we can nitpick...

Zanac wasn't Compile's first shmup. Far away from it. Before Zanac there was Guardic, Final Justice, Gulkave, A.E. and Borderline. Maybe others I can't remember right now.

To be quite honest, I am not completely sure Guardic was released before Zanac (Zanac was released in November 86, all I know Guardic was released in 86, but I don't know the month... chances are it was released before), but all the other games surely were released before Zanac.

Edit: Oh yeah, also Exa Innova.

[BulletMagnet]

Zanac wasn't Compile's first shmup. Far away from it.

I am aware of this - when I referred to the game as "where it all began" I meant the "Compile style" with which most of us are familiar. I can see how that might be misconstrued though, I'll hafta reword it.

[Hagane]

You might as well do so now, as I'm hoping to submit this thing to RB soon...all that's left is a good Rando-ing before it goes out.

Well, if I can nitpick then I still think you put a "memorizer" label on it (ie. "takes the first game’s combination of layout memorization and aggressiveness"); it requires as much memorization as most games in the genre.

It also makes it seem as if you need to memorize the layout and where everything comes out to effectively use charge attacks ("slow but powerful charge attacks", "having a well-placed charge ready"), which isn't really true for Gunbird or Psikyo in general (could be for Sengoku Ace, but Charge attacks are pretty useless there). Just watch this replay by saucy: http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLD0B95A1D91924821 . Yuang's CA is so fast that you don't really need to know everything that may come out beforehand; you see something scary, you destroy it on reaction.

I disagree with Gunbird 2's system further encouraging close combat: making melee attacks consume power bar is a bit detrimental to the idea IMO; I think they got it right in Dragon Blaze where melee doesn't cost anything and only charge attacks require power bar.

Anyways, you don't really have to patch things up if you don't want to, I think the article is good as it is.

[Randorama]

all that's left is a good Rando-ing before it goes out.

I got a verb all for me?!

I am crazy busy, how can I help in 2 mins?

[BulletMagnet]

Well, if I can nitpick then I still think you put a "memorizer" label on it (ie. "takes the first game’s combination of layout memorization and aggressiveness"); it requires as much memorization as most games in the genre.

I know that not everyone agrees with me on this characterization, but for whatever it's worth I find Psikyo stuff, almost without exception, a good deal more reliant than most "modern" shooters on previous experience when it comes to pure survival (scoring's another story), for the reasons I listed - yes, you need to do some memorization in most any shmup (and in Psikyo games this is somewhat limited by the random stage order), but the game's just not set up in a way that allows for the same amount of successful "reaction" dodges as its contemporaries (especially once the rank is up, as has been stated by the forum's foremost font of wisdom, who is likely on his way here to smack me around as we speak - some of the late-game patterns shown after the 3-minute mark are doozies). Of course, the bomb delay factor (especially in Gunbird 1) doesn't help either.

Just watch this replay by saucy: http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLD0B95A1D91924821 . Yuang's CA is so fast that you don't really need to know everything that may come out beforehand; you see something scary, you destroy it on reaction.

Yuan-Nang is an exception of sorts to the rule for the first game (which is why most players use her) - everyone else's charge attack is much slower to ready itself. If you want to get any use out of, say, Ash's or Valnus's charge attack, you'd darn well better pick your opportunities very carefully (especially with Valnus, as he needs to get in close), or else find yourself overwhelmed by popcorn, especially in later levels.

I disagree with Gunbird 2's system further encouraging close combat: making melee attacks consume power bar is a bit detrimental to the idea IMO; I think they got it right in Dragon Blaze where melee doesn't cost anything and only charge attacks require power bar.

I can see your point here, though I'm not nearly as irritated by the power meter thing (melee attacks don't drain all that much of it; charge attacks, on the other hand...) as I'm happy that said attacks can finally be activated instantaneously across the board. Guess that's more a personal preference thing, though I'm pretty certain that you see a lot more special attack use overall in the sequel than in the first (outside of Yuan-Nang)...maybe you know of a replay or two that can prove me wrong on this?

Anyways, you don't really have to patch things up if you don't want to, I think the article is good as it is.

Appreciate the sentiment, but I do want to try my best to make sure that anyone who wants to take a bit of time to contribute to the article is represented to at least some extent; I'm nowhere near knowledgeable enough to consider myself a lone ambassador to the rest of the gaming world for the genre, which is why I try to get others involved in putting together the finished product.

I got a verb all for me?!

You bet - not only that, if a "standard" Rando-ing goes on too long it's officially dubbed a "Rant-o-rama."

I am crazy busy, how can I help in 2 mins?

*insert cheesy joke about suiciding to lower rank*

Just pop in a comment or two whenever you have a chance to give the article a look - you don't need to do it all at once. As I said, I'm willing to delay submission for a bit to make sure the thing (mostly) passes muster with anyone interested enough to comment.

[Randorama]

You bet - not only that, if a "standard" Rando-ing goes on too long it's officially dubbed a "Rant-o-rama."

Ok, I want this verb in dictionaries by 2020, let's lobby for it as much as we can anyway:

Just pop in a comment or two whenever you have a chance to give the article a look - you don't need to do it all at once. As I said, I'm willing to delay submission for a bit to make sure the thing (mostly) passes muster with anyone interested enough to comment.

Ok, Here's the list of suggestions and queries I come up with, when reading the current draft.
I think that the article is very fine and covers all relevant angles. Hopefully, if you can cover the query number 0 below, it could possibly be one of these encyclopedia-like entries that readers can pick up and use to buy titles they really need to play.

Comments!

A. General

0. QUERY: What's the intro of this piece? Why you wrote it in the first place? I'd like to give feedback on that, so that we can rest assured that the reader knows why he's reading the article.

1. SUGGESTION: You may want to shorten sentences here and there. Some sentences are quite long, given that in my articles I aim at a 20-words length, for ease of reading.

I use stylewriter software for this purpose, which you can get online for a trial, and you may buy if you find it useful (...or else, ahem).

2. SUGGESTION: Just to rando the piece a bit, typo- and spell-checking before submission (see also below).

3. QUERY: Well, where's Sokyugurentai?! *shakes angry fist* I think that, if you can add two sentences in the Xevious paragraph, you would get the 100% destruction rate for this sub-type.

B. Specific comments

1. SUGGESTION: "Xevious" paragraph: I would add the names Raystorm and Raycrisis when you mention the sequels to Rayforce, so the readers can eventually get these titles after reading your article.

2. SUGGESTION: "1940" paragraph: I would argue that 1941 is closer to both 1941 and 1943 than it seems. It has a energy bar that can be levelled up, rotating power-ups. It does play like a more modern, fast-paced version of 1942.

3. SUGGESTION: "1940" paragraph: I would

4. QUERY: "Tatsujin/Truxton" paragraph: Isn't Tatsujin a 1988 title, rather than a 1989 title? I am wondering if the wikipedia entry is wrong. I am sure that I never saw this title before 1989.

5. SUGGESTION: "Gunbird" paragraph: You may want to mention (early on) that the main refugee from Video System was Shin Nakamura. I can't recall of other refugees.

6. QUERY: "Gunbird" paragraph: I remember that one can power down via collision in Gunbird 2. Am I having a false memory? (Not impossible)

7. QUERY: :"Don Pachi" paragraph: could you, perhaps shouldn't you, mention that the hyper system in Dai Ou Jou is connected to the rank system?

That's it, I think.



No, hold on.

Something is wrong. I can smell it. It's, like, a feeling in the mouth, maybe in the liver, perhaps in the colon.

Too much Martell Cognac with the in-laws yesterday night? (Of course, wtf, but also)

Is it a disturbance in the force? (No, hold on, I hate star wars)

It is...

8. RANT-O-RAMA: "Battle Garegga": please add: "Battle Garegga is the truth. Ever." line. And a pic of Yagawa dressed like a high-RANK priest

Ah, I feel better.

[ChainsawGuitarSP]

You forgot to mention the secret to Psikyo's success.

A little game called Aero Fighters...!

[BulletMagnet]

What's the intro of this piece? Why you wrote it in the first place? I'd like to give feedback on that, so that we can rest assured that the reader knows why he's reading the article.

I did intend to do a short intro for the article, though up until now I've focused solely on the individual entries themselves, as they're the part I need the most help with: I'll cook up an intro for the next revision, though I don't think RB wants anything too fancy in that department.

You may want to shorten sentences here and there. Some sentences are quite long, given that in my articles I aim at a 20-words length, for ease of reading.

Yeah, that's one of my bad habits...I tried to fix that a bit during my previous reworking, I'll see if I can push it a bit further.

Just to rando the piece a bit, typo- and spell-checking before submission (see also below).

I'm usually pretty good at catching that sort of thing, but a few stragglers always manage to slip through - did you notice any errors in particular that need fixing?

Well, where's Sokyugurentai?! *shakes angry fist* I think that, if you can add two sentences in the Xevious paragraph, you would get the 100% destruction rate for this sub-type.

I like Souky as much as the next guy, but I'm not sure it really belongs in a "defining"-type article...for awhile it was frequently cited as "the second-best Saturn shmup after RSG", but that's about as "big" as I can ever remember it being (and nowadays a lot of people would probably argue with both ends of that statement). Maybe I'm missing something about its larger place in genre history?

"Xevious" paragraph: I would add the names Raystorm and Raycrisis when you mention the sequels to Rayforce, so the readers can eventually get these titles after reading your article.

Hm...eh, wouldn't hurt, I suppose.

"1940" paragraph: I would argue that 1941 is closer to both 1941 and 1943 than it seems. It has a energy bar that can be levelled up, rotating power-ups. It does play like a more modern, fast-paced version of 1942.

Yeah, that segment needs a bit of rewording, I'll hafta spruce it up.

3. SUGGESTION: "1940" paragraph: I would

Was this an accidental partial repeat of the previous suggestion, or is it a separate item that got erased by accident?

"Tatsujin/Truxton" paragraph: Isn't Tatsujin a 1988 title, rather than a 1989 title? I am wondering if the wikipedia entry is wrong. I am sure that I never saw this title before 1989.

Both Wikipedia and KLOV list the release date as 1988, so I musta screwed up there - will correct.

"Gunbird" paragraph: You may want to mention (early on) that the main refugee from Video System was Shin Nakamura. I can't recall of other refugees.

Hm...off the cuff do you recall exactly what Nakamura's role was for those games (Programmer? Director? Producer?)? I might be able to squeeze in a quick reference to him if I knew that...

"Gunbird" paragraph: I remember that one can power down via collision in Gunbird 2. Am I having a false memory? (Not impossible)

Yup, powering down works the same way in the sequel - I didn't specifically mention it in connection to the latter game, but meant to suggest that it was carried over. Was that not clear enough?

"Don Pachi" paragraph: could you, perhaps shouldn't you, mention that the hyper system in Dai Ou Jou is connected to the rank system?

I tried to allude to that in calling the Hyper "powerful but risky"...can you think of a better way to put it?

8. RANT-O-RAMA: "Battle Garegga": please add: "Battle Garegga is the truth. Ever." line. And a pic of Yagawa dressed like a high-RANK priest

So let it be Rando-ed, so let it be done!

You forgot to mention the secret to Psikyo's success.

Taisen Hot Gimmick?

Seriously though, I did make a quick mention of Video System, maybe I can also wedge Aero Fighters in there (then again, did they do much else?).

Thanks again for the help all, I'll keep chipping away at this in the meantime.

[ChainsawGuitarSP]

(then again, did they do much else?).

... Giving the 2P side completely different ships instead of a pallete swap? a (chance-driven) TLB? point based stage progression in addition to the random ones? gimmicky shot-types like Volk's aimable chopper?

[BulletMagnet]

Well, when I said that I meant "did they develop much else of note aside from Sonic Wings", but the stuff you mention is notable...that said, did any of it get carried forward into the Psikyo era?

[ChainsawGuitarSP]

Oh uh, not much else I can think of besides Rabio Lepus. That gave you a melee attack and had ammo-based secondary fire (homing missiles!). I don't think any of the stuff I mentioned was carried over, since the sequels weren't developed by team Psikyo.

[Randorama]

More Rando-ing:

I did intend to do a short intro for the article, though up until now I've focused solely on the individual entries themselves, as they're the part I need the most help with: I'll cook up an intro for the next revision, though I don't think RB wants anything too fancy in that department.

Ok, with one or two well-placed sentences you would get a perfect intro, e.g. "This article presents a list of shmups that defined the genre and, as such, should be in the gaming library of every fan".

I'm usually pretty good at catching that sort of thing, but a few stragglers always manage to slip through - did you notice any errors in particular that need fixing?

None found, but you can check one more time just to be paranoically sure

I like Souky as much as the next guy, but I'm not sure it really belongs in a "defining"-type article...for awhile it was frequently cited as "the second-best Saturn shmup after RSG", but that's about as "big" as I can ever remember it being (and nowadays a lot of people would probably argue with both ends of that statement). Maybe I'm missing something about its larger place in genre history?

Yes and no. It was crazy popular in the day (double port!), had an epic style with great music and graphics, and would deserve a quick mention in the "Xevious" paragraph, at most.

Was this an accidental partial repeat of the previous suggestion, or is it a separate item that got erased by accident?

Gah, accidental deletion. I wanted to say: how about you dedicate a full, distinct paragraph for the Strikers games?

Hm...off the cuff do you recall exactly what Nakamura's role was for those games (Programmer? Director? Producer?)? I might be able to squeeze in a quick reference to him if I knew that...

Mostly designer on Gunbird, I can't remember his name on Sengoku Ace (he must have worked on that, though, judging by the style).

[Gunbird 2] Was that not clear enough?

I misread something, so no prob on this.

I tried to allude to that in calling the Hyper "powerful but risky"...can you think of a better way to put it?

"powerful but risky, since its usage increases the overall rank in the game (like in Garegga)"?

[Hagane]

AFAIK, Shin Nakamura designed Sonic Wings and Rabio Lepus, then moved from Video System and founded Psikyo, where he directed / designed most games.

I know that not everyone agrees with me on this characterization[...]

Personally I think Psikyo games in general actually give more room for reaction, at least in the first loop, than most games. The reason is that most patterns are aimed at you, so a quick tap to the side gets you through most first loop stuff. There are some exceptions (ie: Strikers 1945 II with its non-aimed, blazing fast boss patterns -that still can be tap dodged but are nowhere near as intuitive as in other games) but generally the strategy of "killing big stuff fast, tap dodge the popcorn's aimed shots" works quite well. Harder than it sounds of course but it's nowhere near as memorization heavy or impossible as most people not familiar with these games think.

I'm working on a general "avoiding Psikyo bullets" for my future Sengoku Blade guide to hopefully help people who have this kind of problem.

Yuan-Nang is an exception of sorts [...]

Most people use her because she's obviously powerful (mostly use her for her bullet cancelling ability) and easier to learn. But Valnus, even though it takes a lot more to charge his shot, is even more powerful then she is. Basically, anything he touches with his charge shot is toast. If you stick to using charge shot almost exclusively you rarely have to dodge tough patterns, and you can start charging the next CS while the current one is being released, shortening charge times significantly.

The other characters aren't that effective because they are there for the sake of variety more than balance; the game is clearly designed with Yuang and Valnus on mind. You'll see that there is at least one hard hitter in most Psikyo games, and usually that/those character/s are the highest scoring. Jane in Sengoku Ace, Aine and Katana in Sengoku Blade (that kind of repeat the Yuang/Valnus archetype), X-36 in Strikers 1999, Aine again in Gunbird 2, Quaid in Dragon Blaze, etc.

maybe you know of a replay or two that can prove me wrong on this?

I don't have a replay for Valnus, but since he plays a lot like Katana in Sengoku Blade (slow but super powerful charge shot) you could watch this replay, most stuff still applies to Valnus

http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XMTUxNzg3Mjg4.html

Note how he usually kills big (and screen filling popcorns when needed) enemies as fast as possible, and dodges most bullets with small taps or sweeps, due to most bullets being aimed.

Of course second loops change everything and you need more planning and thinking when going for score (shooting at all is very risky since most enemies release suicide bullets). And still you can do pretty well in some games by tapping and killing only the most important enemies.

As an aside, I think memorization in general is a misused term. Rather, most good games require strategy and learning to do well in them, and raw memorization only applies to stuff like old Rockman games, that have spots that will most likely kill you the first time around, but require no skill to be overcome in future runs.

Even though most people here seem to associate bullet hell games with reactive play, the fact is that nearly every single game in the genre requires some learning to avoid the hardest spots, even if you don't play for score. Unless you want every game to be like Deathsmiles played survival-style (ugh), you'll have to learn your patterns. More than fast reactions (which are indeed useful at some spots), what you need to do well in shooters are good strategies and the manual dexterity to execute them. Psikyo games are no different than most Cave or Raizing games in that regard.

Sorry for the tl;dr post by the way

[BulletMagnet]

Yes and no. It was crazy popular in the day (double port!), had an epic style with great music and graphics, and would deserve a quick mention in the "Xevious" paragraph, at most.

I'm still hesitant on this one...I personally wouldn't consider it to have crossed the line from "well-regarded" to "iconic" in the same way that Rayforce has. Anyone else want to weigh in on this?

I wanted to say: how about you dedicate a full, distinct paragraph for the Strikers games?

That was the way it was originally set up before the Gunbird segment was added in, but now that a Psikyo game has its own entry I don't think it's as necessary.

Mostly designer on Gunbird, I can't remember his name on Sengoku Ace (he must have worked on that, though, judging by the style).

AFAIK, Shin Nakamura designed Sonic Wings and Rabio Lepus, then moved from Video System and founded Psikyo, where he directed / designed most games.

Anybody have a link to screenshots of the games' end credits or the like? I'll hafta look around a bit...if I can't find any hard evidence I'll probably just call him a "designer" and be done with it.

"powerful but risky, since its usage increases the overall rank in the game (like in Garegga)"?

That sounds a bit wordy to my ears...for an article like this I don't think getting too super-specific is necessary, especially in a section like Donpachi's where you need to fit several games in.

generally the strategy of "killing big stuff fast, tap dodge the popcorn's aimed shots" works quite well.

To properly execute the first part of that equation, though (especially with a slower character like Valnus), you need to know where and when the big guys are going to appear (and in the case of bosses, which points are safe to rush in), and have taken the time to charge a power attack to nail them as soon as they appear, or else find yourself mired down in their patterns (or worse, point-blanked by them as you attempt to rush in a bit too late). What you say later on about the games being specifically tailored for particular character types also, I think, speaks to the somewhat exacting nature of the design and the need to follow a certain path to succeed - not as harsh as DDP chaining, no, but also less optional.

I don't have a replay for Valnus, but since he plays a lot like Katana in Sengoku Blade (slow but super powerful charge shot) you could watch this replay, most stuff still applies to Valnus

Maybe my eyes are playing tricks on me, but Katana's charge shot seems a lot faster to activate than most of the original Gunbird's cast, especially Valnus...I haven't played Sengoku Blade too extensively, but I do recall not feeling nearly as constrained using Katana's charge shot there, as it could be activated much more quickly when needed. Again, maybe a third party's opinion is needed here...either way, at least for the first Gunbird, I still think the moniker of "slow but powerful" generally works for how charge shots are applied (though not, as you note, quite as starkly as in Sengoku Ace), though as the paragraph notes the sequel changed that.

As an aside, I think memorization in general is a misused term. Rather, most good games require strategy and learning to do well in them, and raw memorization only applies to stuff like old Rockman games, that have spots that will most likely kill you the first time around, but require no skill to be overcome in future runs.

I guess it depends on how "strict" your definition of "memorizer" is...I certainly didn't mean to insinuate that Psikyo games are totally dependent on rote learning (which is why I listed memorization as part of its "mixture") or that the rest of the genre is totally independent of it, but I still maintain that Psikyo's games, especially when compared to many of its contemporaries, lean decidedly further in that direction to at least some degree, and that this tendency is part of what defines their work. I don't even think that this is necessarily a "bad" thing, just that it lends itself to certain individual preferences, the same as anything else.

I don't mean to make this a bigger issue than it needs to be, but personally I find it difficult to "place" Psikyo without it. Again, anyone else who wants to get in on this, feel free to offer an additional point of reference. We'll nail this down yet!

[Hagane]

To properly execute the first part of that equation, though (especially with a slower character like Valnus), you need to know where and when the big guys are going to appear (and in the case of bosses, which points are safe to rush in), and have taken the time to charge a power attack to nail them as soon as they appear, or else find yourself mired down in their patterns (or worse, point-blanked by them as you attempt to rush in a bit too late).

Not really, if you play properly you will always have a charge shot ready no matter what, even with Valnus. This doesn't mean that you have to know exactly where the big enemies are beforehand; it means you should be using charge shot always, as your primary weapon.

Even though Valnus' CS has a lengthy charge time, that only matters for the first CS. You can start charging your next charge shot as soon as you release the shot button. And you can execute a CS as soon as your character flashes and you hear the "charge ready" sound, not just after Valnus ends his "ready" animation. If you do the charge shots properly, you can release one after the other with very little lag between each one, so you always have a ROCKETTO PANCH!!! ready

As for bosses, Yuang Nang can dive through a lot of their patterns by "thrusting" forward with her staff, while Valnus can use his longer range to greet them with a nice punch to the face with little risk and work from there against a heavily wounded boss.

Of course with successive playthroughs you'll find optimal strategies for every boss (thanks to this thread I started playing GB seriously and, for example, you can kill the stage 4 boss before he even gets a pattern out with a few well placed charge shots). Which doesn't mean that the game will destroy you unless you carefully memorize every enemy entry point and every boss safe spot, as many believe.

What you say later on about the games being specifically tailored for particular character types also, I think, speaks to the somewhat exacting nature of the design and the need to follow a certain path to succeed - not as harsh as DDP chaining, no, but also less optional.

The game doesn't have a hard coded "path", but has a defined style and there are some characters that will obviously benefit from it more than others. You can use those characters and score better, but the rest of the cast can survive well even if they won't make such good scores. Nothing bad with that, as the other option would be to make homogeneous ships / characters so everyone does well. Which would be boring and would indeed make things "less optional"

Maybe my eyes are playing tricks on me, but Katana's charge shot seems a lot faster to activate than most of the original Gunbird's cast, especially Valnus[...]

Katana's charge time is roughly the same as Valnus', and just like him she can "hide" charge time by holding the shot button again just after you release a CS. The attack animation is long enough to save you a lot of charge time for your next attack. I feel that Katana deals more damage than Valnus though; she can even kill some bosses with little more than a single CS.

In Gunbird, not all charge shots are powerful really... worst offender is Marion's. Looooooong charge time and pitiful damage. She kind of sucked in that game.

I guess it depends on how "strict" your definition of "memorizer" is[...]

The problem I have is that you don't see people using the "memorizer" label for, say, Ketsui or DDP DOJ. Be for their hard to dodge patterns (which in the case of the first game can get just as fast as Dragon Blaze's) of for their scoring systems, they need a lot of learning and practice to do well on them.

Of course this isn't a bad thing; a game has to either be completely random or extremely easy to avoid "memorization", but I feel a good portion of this forum reserves the label for games they don't really get or like or whatever. Every good game in the genre is a mixture of execution, strategy and a bit of reactions.

Could you specifically point why Psikyo's games seem more memorization heavy to you than a hard game by Cave, Raizing or any other developer? Because I don't buy that bullet hell games rely more on reactions. Maybe for easier modes or patterns you can use your reactions alone, but you definitely need lots of credits, good strategies and such to beat the bosses and 1CC/ALL them (and even more to score well), just like in Psikyo games.

Maybe most people got hit by the insta-death laser at stage 8 in Strikers 1945 II and decided to write off all Psikyo games as memorizers?

Oh, and I found something else that I didn't notice before: Gunbird (and Sengoku Ace) don't have "auto-power downs". This is a common misconception, but power downs in those games (and I believe it's the same in Aero Fighters) happen only after a set amount of released shots, not time. This means that, as long as you don't meet the "shot limit" you won't power down no matter how much time passes. In Sengoku Ace you could get around this by simply limiting you shots and having power ups around (they are plentiful in that game by the way), but in Gunbird charge shots either don't waste ammo or only count as one shot, making them a non-issue, at least for Yuang and Valnus.

[Ed Oscuro]

Souky: The nail that sticks up gets hammered down, doesn't it?

I think that you can't possibly define shmups without touching on the cultural touchstones. Like EGM reviews. Multi-moving spectaculars of the graphical to hit you in the jugular!

[BulletMagnet]

For a lot of the more specific stuff I think we really need a few other people to weigh in with their perspectives at this point, but I will try to summarize this one:

Could you specifically point why Psikyo's games seem more memorization heavy to you than a hard game by Cave, Raizing or any other developer?

Well, first off I ought to reiterate that I'm talking purely in survival terms here. That said, in a nutshell I'd name the larger hitbox and faster bullets as the main culprits, as they make the game feel more like a Raiden or Toaplan game than a Cave or Raizing title, at least to me - in a DoDonPachi or Battle Garegga (or even a Ketsui) you're granted at least a moment or two to "feel" your way through most patterns and enough leeway to weave around on reaction, regardless of which enemies onscreen you prioritize, but in a Strikers or Gunbird you pretty much had better have a bomb ready if you find yourself in a less-than-optimal position after the first level or two (and in the earlier games you'd better account for bomb delay too). Again, the specific degree varies from game to game, but on the whole I find myself needing more rote learning to get anywhere in a Psikyo title - as you say, every shmup requires "practice and learning" to master, but there are different types of practice and learning, and to me Psikyo's brand of it has as much in common with its ancestors as with its contemporaries.

Of course, that's just my take, and I don't want the article to reflect only that, but I also don't want to write something that I don't feel I understand or appreciate fully.

Oh, and I found something else that I didn't notice before: Gunbird (and Sengoku Ace) don't have "auto-power downs". This is a common misconception, but power downs in those games (and I believe it's the same in Aero Fighters) happen only after a set amount of released shots, not time.

Duly noted, I'll reword that.

[Hagane]

I think you just don't have the right mindset when playing Psikyo games, so they seem much harder / unfair than they actually are. If you try to play them reactively to dodge patterns then yeah, I can see where your complaints may come from. But if you try to incorporate "Psikyo basics" then I'm sure most of the stuff you have a problem with will go away.

Larger hitboxes aren't really a problem since you won't be going through intricate bullet mazes (even in Dragon Blaze, bullets are there mostly to limit movement rather than for you to wade through them). You have to tap or sweep most of them, so larger hitboxes work fine. Most bullets are dodgeable on reaction; deaths come mostly from not being careful with your taps / kills and getting trapped as a result rather than eating a super fast bullet to the face.

I don't really see the difference between a bullet hell game (that might give you the impression of giving you more time to react, but in fact you'll eventually get screwed without a concrete plan at the hard spots) and a Psikyo game when it comes to learning / memorization.

[xbl0x180]

One thing that is as important as the gameplay, level design, scoring, etc. is the music. A shoot-'em-up has to have catchy music to keep up with the pace of the on-screen action

Touhou looks damn ugly. It's a shame it has to be mentioned along the others.

[BulletMagnet]

I think you just don't have the right mindset when playing Psikyo games, so they seem much harder / unfair than they actually are.

Maybe the key to this is in this phrase somewhere - can you come up with a decent way to phrase exactly what the "Psikyo mindset" is, as compared to the Cave or Raizing one?

[BulletMagnet]

Giving this a bump, just to make sure I get all possible input before making my (hopefully) final edits...

[Hagane]

Maybe the key to this is in this phrase somewhere - can you come up with a decent way to phrase exactly what the "Psikyo mindset" is, as compared to the Cave or Raizing one?

Like I said before, dodging should always be your B plan. I think that sums it up pretty well. You mostly need to play aggressively rather than reactively.

This is contrary to most bullet hell games, where you are mostly dodging difficult patterns (and usually their scoring systems emphasize this with mechanics such as grazing, chaining, etc, that require not killing enemies as soon as they appear).

One thing that is as important as the gameplay, level design, scoring, etc. is the music. A shoot-'em-up has to have catchy music to keep up with the pace of the on-screen action

Touhou looks damn ugly. It's a shame it has to be mentioned along the others.

Some Touhou games have excellent music though.

[BulletMagnet]

Okay, I've attempted to implement most of the latest set of suggestions, and am hoping to apply one last layer of polish before sending this off to RB - let me know if there's any other work that still needs doing.

[BulletMagnet]

One more bump - post now or forever hold your peace!

[saucykobold]

Great article, but I noticed a minor mistake at the start of the Raiden section. The original game's title screen indicates a 1990 release date.

Though developer Seibu Kaihatsu had flirted with the scrolling shooter once or twice before, it wouldn’t succeed at carving out a lasting niche for itself until 1989, when the first entry in the series proper arrived.

[Despatche]

I'm interested in where 1989 came from.

Oh, and I found something else that I didn't notice before: Gunbird (and Sengoku Ace) don't have "auto-power downs". This is a common misconception, but power downs in those games (and I believe it's the same in Aero Fighters) happen only after a set amount of released shots, not time. This means that, as long as you don't meet the "shot limit" you won't power down no matter how much time passes. In Sengoku Ace you could get around this by simply limiting you shots and having power ups around (they are plentiful in that game by the way), but in Gunbird charge shots either don't waste ammo or only count as one shot, making them a non-issue, at least for Yuang and Valnus.

I KNEW IT

Very helpful, thank you.

[ChainsawGuitarSP]

I'm interested in where 1989 came from.

Obviously he had Fire Shark in mind when writing that. And yeah, Turbo Force is the only Nakamura game where your shot power continually drains.