Is Mushihimesama worth buying?

GaijinPunch · Post by **GaijinPunch** » Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:25 am

you probably can't, even with a HDTV.

You definitely can't with an HDTV. It will look arguably worse.

RGC · Post by **RGC** » Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:45 am

Zebra Airforce · Post by **Zebra Airforce** » Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:48 am

GaijinPunch wrote:
you probably can't, even with a HDTV.
You definitely can't with an HDTV. It will look arguably worse.

I tried this out on a friends flat screen lcd hdtv. Whew, ugly! The bullets were especially blurry. There was also a very tangible controller lag.

evil_ash_xero · Post by **evil_ash_xero** » Sat Nov 03, 2007 8:22 pm

Funny how Cave can't port their own games woth a shit.(if I am correct about Mushi being ported by Cave)

s/m

Erinu · Post by **Erinu** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 2:11 am

RGC wrote:Yeh, get that beast rigged up to a good Sony RGB monitor.

One other thing, Mushihimesama is simultaneously the most rewarding and frustrating game I've played in a long time, a long time </kenobi>. Hope you find the same - distribute the stress.

What's so special about Sony monitors? Can you recommend any?

Seriously. I'm very, very close to going and purchasing a supergun followed by a Mushihimesama PCB. If there's a possibility of making the PS2 version look better on a monitor, do let me know. Currently I'm using component on a CRT.

I thought PS2 looked bad via VGA?

Lili-Xiang · Post by **Lili-Xiang** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 3:12 am

evil_ash_xero wrote:Actually, i'm sorta interested in Halo 3. I've never played a single one!

s/m

Same here, but I only tried out Halo 1 in a game store with some guy once.

Anyway, for the topic; is that game ever going to come to the U.S. or is it the
fact that the USA is incompitent with it's technology?

Necronopticous · Post by **Necronopticous** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 3:29 am

Before this school quarter I had been dying to play Mushihimesama, but I simply had no means to. Amazingly, my school arcade got it in and I've been playing it like crazy since. It's quickly become my favorite shmup, and I give it the highest recommendation.

I still have yet to play Futari, but I would really love to. Again, I live in America and we get no shmup love out here.

Triple Lei · Post by **Triple Lei** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 5:05 am

Necronopticous wrote:Before this school quarter I had been dying to play Mushihimesama, but I simply had no means to. Amazingly, my school arcade got it in and I've been playing it like crazy since. It's quickly become my favorite shmup, and I give it the highest recommendation.

I still have yet to play Futari, but I would really love to. Again, I live in America and we get no shmup love out here.

Er... do you go to Cal Poly Pomona?

Necronopticous · Post by **Necronopticous** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 5:12 am

Arvandor · Post by **Arvandor** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 5:33 am

Necronopticous wrote:Again, I live in America and we get no shmup love out here.

You should feel insanely lucky to have a Mushi cab o_O That's the coolest thing I've ever heard of. The only thing near me, WAS a Zero Gunner machine, but that arcade got killed. Now the best arcade is a 45 minute drive, and only has old (yet awesome) stuff like Raiden 2 and Strikers 1945.

iatneH · Post by **iatneH** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 6:22 am

Zebra Airforce wrote:I tried this out on a friends flat screen lcd hdtv. Whew, ugly! The bullets were especially blurry. There was also a very tangible controller lag.

I doubt that is controller lag, more likely to be the display that is lagging. Plugging your console into a HDTV does not suddenly cause your controller to become laggy. But I guess the effect is the same in the end, the game knows you've been hit by a bullet but the screen tells you the bullet is still a small distance away.

I tried playing beatmania IIDX on a plasma and it is nearly impossible to get perfect hits.

Zebra Airforce · Post by **Zebra Airforce** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 6:29 am

iatneH wrote:
Zebra Airforce wrote:I tried this out on a friends flat screen lcd hdtv. Whew, ugly! The bullets were especially blurry. There was also a very tangible controller lag.
I doubt that is controller lag, more likely to be the display that is lagging. Plugging your console into a HDTV does not suddenly cause your controller to become laggy. But I guess the effect is the same in the end, the game knows you've been hit by a bullet but the screen tells you the bullet is still a small distance away.

I tried playing beatmania IIDX on a plasma and it is nearly impossible to get perfect hits.

Yes yes, you're right. I was being lazy

Nuke · Post by **Nuke** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 8:21 am

LUNardei wrote:ghghghhbrrrr

Yeah, I see your point. It's exactly how the scoring system works.

Necronopticous · Post by **Necronopticous** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 8:26 am

Arvandor wrote:You should feel insanely lucky to have a Mushi cab o_O That's the coolest thing I've ever heard of.

Yeah, I do.

I honestly couldn't believe my eyes when I saw it after coming back from Summer break. I knew we were on the right track when we got DoDonPachi recently, but damn, getting Mushihimesama totally obliterated me. I kind of freaked out a little.

Arvandor · Post by **Arvandor** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 9:58 am

Necronopticous wrote:I knew we were on the right track when we got DoDonPachi recently

I hate you.

LUNardei · Post by **LUNardei** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 10:27 am

Nuke wrote:
LUNardei wrote:ghghghhbrrrr
Yeah, I see your point. It's exactly how the scoring system works.

Nope, it's my reaction to the high level criticism in this topic

PROMETHEUS · Post by **PROMETHEUS** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 1:57 pm

jpj wrote:
sikraiken wrote:Maniac/Ultra/Arrange mode scoring in the game is garbage
i know a lot of people find it hard to admit that it's broken. when the top maniac score with an autofire circuit is 1.6 billllllllion points higher than the best score on a normal set-up, it's fair to say that there's a big issue.

mmmh... I'm curious about this ~

It's not necessarily bad to have a rhythm base scoring system is it ? It means it rewards the player for his hand speed / accuracy / rhythm.

SUPER ANALOGY : In a first person shooter, you have to be able to aim really well to play well, and you would get insanely better results if you used an aimbot program (that automatically and instantly aims at your opponents for you). It doesn't mean that aiming is stupid and doesn't take skill... (because it's not stupid and it does take a lot of skill)

So what's wrong about having this kind of system in Mushihimesama ?

jpj · Post by **jpj** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 2:55 pm

wouldn't it be better if aimbot programs didn't exist at all then?

seriously though, the scoring system and chaining is so GOOD, so AMAZINGLY UNIQUE, and generally FANTABOLOUS........ that they completely changed it for the sequel.

all the other cave sequels expanded the originals scoring systems, often in interesting ways, but a lot of the core mechanics were the same. but for mushi, they went back to the drawing board.

it's fair enough if people like it. but even cave saw they needed to ditch it

PROMETHEUS · Post by **PROMETHEUS** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 3:59 pm

maybe they thought they had perfected this type of scoring system in Mushihimesama and figured they had to make something very different if they wanted the sequel to feel like a sequel and not a remake ;]

I'd like to know what the top Japanese players say about this.

jpj · Post by **jpj** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 4:42 pm

i wouldn't say they perfected it, because it's so far from perfect...!

it's funny, i think sometimes if a person has convincd themselves of something, they find it hard to accept anything else.

mushi was a very popular game. they wanted to make a sequel, and make more money from the IP. they retained the style, and ditched the system.

dodonpachi was extremely popular. they wanted to make a sequel. they retained the style .... and added hypers.

but look, just cos a game has flaws, doesn't mean it's not fun to play

PROMETHEUS · Post by **PROMETHEUS** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 5:36 pm

I'm not saying that's what I think. I have only played under 10 credits of Mushihimesama so I know next to nothing about it. I just want to understand what you guys don't like about the scoring system, because I'm interested in playing this game in the future.

Don't they ever interview the best players to ask them what they think about the games ? I'd sure love to take a look at that. Dunno where to look though @_@

sikraiken · Post by **sikraiken** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 5:54 pm

I'll just quote something that kotaro from the cowboy.ikaruga.co.uk forums said:

"He said to me that the 2.6billions was reached with the creation of a particular button configured with a pc software, and using a bug of the game...

this special autofire is setted to realesa a very high seguence of bullets with the laser on!!This rapid, I think from what I've read from Him is this:
(A+B)+ but He said that Swy is the only one that undertsand it and can did it!I have to speak with him one of these days...I know other good players but they don't know this tecnique very weel... "

It's stupid when a game has nearly two to three times the score if you use these stupid autofire techniques vs. if you don't. Ultra definitely should have just used normal mode's scoring. The difference in score from non-auto to special auto wouldn't have been that great.

Nuke · Post by **Nuke** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 5:57 pm

LUNardei wrote:
Nuke wrote:
LUNardei wrote:ghghghhbrrrr
Yeah, I see your point. It's exactly how the scoring system works.
Nope, it's my reaction to the high level criticism in this topic

Which is exactly how the scoring system works

Fortunately I'm one of the rare breed of old school shmupers who don't care that much about score.

LUNardei · Post by **LUNardei** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 6:32 pm

PROMETHEUS wrote:So what's wrong about having this kind of system in Mushihimesama ?

I'll tell you more. Technically speaking this game is just awesome. The study required to get better in any single "hot spot" of any level is lovely. And you also have variety: stage 1 is without laser, stage 3 is a full chain, in stage 5 you can score a lot even in the fist part and so on.

If it's not enough you can watch the dvd and find stuff like formation on stage 3 and a suicide to change weapon. Was this scoring system really that awful? Lol. It's one of the deepest I've ever seen. You can say it's not your cup of tea, but honestly I wouldn't go beyond this point...

Nuke wrote: Fortunately I'm one of the rare breed of old school shmupers who don't care that much about score.

Fortunately?

sikraiken wrote:It's stupid when a game has nearly two to three times the score if you use these stupid autofire techniques vs. if you don't.

Play default.

sikraiken wrote:Ultra definitely should have just used normal mode's scoring. The difference in score from non-auto to special auto wouldn't have been that great.

Yes but... Who really cares about that difference? Ultra it's fine as it is, original-like it would have been quite boring.

Aghzgh, baited

PROMETHEUS · Post by **PROMETHEUS** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 6:45 pm

ye I don't really see the point about the difference between autofire and not autofire either, like my SUPER ANOLOGY shows it doesn't necessarily means it sucks ! ^Ô^

so just consider autofire as a cheat, or if you prefer just always play with autofire and if you want to compare scores with people, compare with people who use the same configuration as you... ?

jpj · Post by **jpj** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 6:54 pm

going back to your anaology then, what if only one person has an aimbot?

sikraiken · Post by **sikraiken** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 6:57 pm

LUNardei wrote:
sikraiken wrote:It's stupid when a game has nearly two to three times the score if you use these stupid autofire techniques vs. if you don't.
Play default.

Play default, and still deal with the auto fire garbage, except without a machine doing it for you. No thanks.

LUNardei wrote:
sikraiken wrote:Ultra definitely should have just used normal mode's scoring. The difference in score from non-auto to special auto wouldn't have been that great.
Yes but... Who really cares about that difference? Ultra it's fine as it is, original-like it would have been quite boring.

Quite boring? It's still a reasonably difficult game. A higher end of game bonus for lives and bombs left would have been more suitable, on top of using the original mode's scoring system. And I care. That's what matters.

A potentially good game broken by it's stupid scoring system.

Twiddle · Post by **Twiddle** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 6:57 pm

hahaha prometheus did you seriously compare autofire to aimbotting

you're pretty retarded tbqh

LUNardei · Post by **LUNardei** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 7:16 pm

ghghhhhbrrrrr

Necronopticous · Post by **Necronopticous** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 7:39 pm

You guys are crazy.

I find the multi-counter and counter banking system used in Mushihimesama to be extremely fun and original. It is a system that encourages players to learn and dodge difficult patterns rather than bombing out, and, like DoDonPachi, discourages the immediate dispatching of enemies. It establishes a clear distinction between the scores of those players who do not have the skill, patience, or knowledge to attempt high-scoring runs, and it greatly rewards the ones who do.

Mushihimesama's scoring system has all the things a good system should have, and more. I don't know how you could call a system like this "broken."