Manic (in spirit) '80s arcade shooters.

Rob · Post by **Rob** » Wed Jun 27, 2007 10:17 pm

Necessary qualities:

-fast action, preferable focus on dodging bullets (not erratic clump of enemy hitbox)
-small-ish ship/character hitbox

Bonus:
-a scoring system beyond enemy = 200 pts., though not required

For me, I count

*Gun.Smoke
*Juno First

What do you say?

CIT · Post by **CIT** » Wed Jun 27, 2007 10:26 pm

Omega Fighter

Damocles · Post by **Damocles** » Wed Jun 27, 2007 11:30 pm

Dangerous Seed

szycag · Post by **szycag** » Wed Jun 27, 2007 11:47 pm

Stargate?

Dale · Post by **Dale** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 12:27 am

szycag wrote:Stargate?

This would be my top pick as well.

Squirrel · Post by **Squirrel** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 12:31 am

I Third Stargate.

exquisite_torture · Post by **exquisite_torture** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 12:35 am

Dangar

TVG · Post by **TVG** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 3:32 am

Toaplan games, they're just proto manics.

stanski · Post by **stanski** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 7:33 am

Fire Shark

MikeB · Post by **MikeB** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 10:47 am

Starforce.. definitely Starforce

Rob · Post by **Rob** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 11:13 am

So far I think I agree with Omega Fighter.

CMoon · Post by **CMoon** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 11:18 am

I think the scoring thing is the real catch. The 80's weren't really about deep scoring mechanics.

Post by **Shatterhand** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 12:32 pm

when I read the topic's title, the first thing that came to mind was Omega Fighter.

stuminator · Post by **stuminator** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 6:40 pm

What about 1943? It also does have somewhat of a scoring system (hidden items, 100% destruction bonus on bosses).

While many won't consider it a true shmup, Robotron is definitely one of the more hectic games out there.

PC Engine Fan X! · Post by **PC Engine Fan X!** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 6:47 pm

stuminator wrote:What about 1943? It also does have somewhat of a scoring system (hidden items, 100% destruction bonus on bosses).

While many won't consider it a true shmup, Robotron is definitely one of the more hectic games out there.

It was cool to see/hear Eugene Jarvis speak about his Robotron 2084 PCB game developement at the 2006 California Extreme show -- a once-in-a-lifetime event that wasn't to be missed (I still have it on MiniDV tape for posterity)...

I heard that Dave K. attended this Mr. Jarvis CAX special guest talk event as well..... ^_~

PC Engine Fan X! ^_~

Rob · Post by **Rob** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 8:18 pm

I was afraid 1943 would be mentioned. I don't think I was clear enough in the first post. Games like 1943 and then side-scrollers like R-Type are the opposite of what I'm getting at. 1943's hitbox is too big, too much emphasis on planes dancing around until they hit you. Scoring bonuses in modern games aren't so much "shoot around screen until bonus randomly appears." That's a pretty brainless 80s scoring element.

And while Toaplan's games like Fire Shark would eventually come to be steps in the right direction, I don't think they were there at the time. I'm thinking of mostly early 80s-85 here. I wouldn't even count the original Raiden, since checkpoints are a mood killer.

Add:
-simplified power-up system, no checkpoints required

Turrican · Post by **Turrican** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 8:23 pm

Rob wrote:I'm thinking of mostly early 80s-85 here.

You just halved the period of interest...

Rob · Post by **Rob** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 8:27 pm

It's not my fault, the developers did it. And Omega Fighter is still a good example, from '89 (?).

Turrican · Post by **Turrican** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 9:04 pm

That was just to say that I'm not sure if I get this thread's focus - going by your description, I would've mentioned Toaplan stuff too - not all Toaplan, let's say the Twin Cobra spawns.

If you concentrate on the '80-'85 period however it's harder to make names.

Anyway, I don't even think that focusing on dodging and having a smaller hitbox "paved the way" for the "right" way of manics... The defining moment of manicness is to have the screen literally filled by bullet patterns. Sure, maybe it could be argued that they generated from Toaplan's approach, but they became something on their own, I guess...

Rob · Post by **Rob** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 9:18 pm

I think there are "manic" shooters (which I define just by intensity and speed of action) and bullet hell. The latter can be relaxing to me and not so fast or intense. People will disagree, but I think DOJ is relaxing. Mars Matrix is closer to both.

Somewhere mid-80s the genre lost focus from arcade-like fast action to something I'd describe more as console-like: more scenery gimmicks, unnecessary power-ups, slower action, etc. Then there's plain bad, annoying games like 1943. I think in the early 80s there wasn't much of a choice but to keep things simple, which encourages manic-style design. Bullets instead of giant fireballs or whatever.

Turrican · Post by **Turrican** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 9:23 pm

Rob wrote:Somewhere mid-80s the genre lost focus from arcade-like fast action to something I'd describe more as console-like: more scenery gimmicks, unnecessary power-ups, slower action, etc.

Yeah, the Renaissance of the shoot'em up. Too bad it didn't last.

-Bridget- · Post by **-Bridget-** » Sat Jun 30, 2007 8:03 am

Rob wrote:I think there are "manic" shooters (which I define just by intensity and speed of action) and bullet hell. The latter can be relaxing to me and not so fast or intense. People will disagree, but I think DOJ is relaxing. Mars Matrix is closer to both.

Somewhere mid-80s the genre lost focus from arcade-like fast action to something I'd describe more as console-like: more scenery gimmicks, unnecessary power-ups, slower action, etc. Then there's plain bad, annoying games like 1943. I think in the early 80s there wasn't much of a choice but to keep things simple, which encourages manic-style design. Bullets instead of giant fireballs or whatever.

I might agree with the "relaxing" part for DOJ.......

.....if that game didnt HATE ME SO MUCH.

I could say that about Mushihime, though, maybe.

Well, everything aside from Ultra mode; I can handle the levels in that, but the bosses beyond the 1st will still eat my face (in part due to the STUPID WEAK PS2 SLOWING DOWN AND SPEEDING BACK UP).

I can see what you mean, though, at least.

Giga Wing also sorta has that effect on me.

Frederik · Post by **Frederik** » Sat Jun 30, 2007 10:02 am

Agreed, Omega Fighter was MILES ahead of its time.

ROBOTRON · Post by **ROBOTRON** » Sat Jun 30, 2007 10:08 am

ROBOTRON

"In the year 2084, man created the ROBOTRON...a robot so superior to man, they decided the human race was inferior and took over."

rawr...it went something like that.

Others:

Phoenix
Berserk
Amidar
Stratavox
The Galaga's

CMoon · Post by **CMoon** » Sat Jun 30, 2007 12:59 pm

Was Omega Fighter arcade only? I've never heard of the game before.

Macaw · Post by **Macaw** » Sat Jun 30, 2007 1:44 pm

CMoon wrote:Was Omega Fighter arcade only? I've never heard of the game before.

Yes it was.

And its the Ketsui of the 80's.

shinsage · Post by **shinsage** » Sat Jun 30, 2007 7:16 pm

uh...

Last Duel.
I dunno.

szycag · Post by **szycag** » Sun Jul 01, 2007 9:27 am

Not entirely related, but I thought of this thread when I watched the video

Die Hard for the NES

Now that's some early bullet hell @_@

http://gametrailers.com/player/21083.html

Davey · Post by **Davey** » Sun Jul 01, 2007 6:42 pm

Rob wrote:Juno First

Thanks for reminding me about this game, I forgot about it ever since last year's STGT (which was also the first time I heard about it).

What's the general strategy? Don't shoot anything until the multiplier thing shows up, then blast away? That seems to yield the most points, and with extends coming every 100,000 points, it seems like it would work pretty well if you don't suck (I've only managed to score in the 200,000's so far).

Rob · Post by **Rob** » Sun Jul 01, 2007 9:09 pm

Davey wrote: What's the general strategy? Don't shoot anything until the multiplier thing shows up, then blast away?

That's exactly what I did, but I haven't played in a while.

shmups.system11.org

Manic (in spirit) '80s arcade shooters.

Manic (in spirit) '80s arcade shooters.

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