4th Annual Top 25 Shmups of All Time! - Discussion thread

Turrican · Post by **Turrican** » Sat Apr 01, 2006 1:02 am

There - I've sent some PMs and I'm glad there has been some response already

Zach Keene · Post by **Zach Keene** » Sat Apr 01, 2006 6:16 am

Polls close 24 hours from the time of this post.

dai jou bu · Post by **dai jou bu** » Sat Apr 01, 2006 9:23 am

I voted!

Shmup of the year goes to Shoot the Bullet for me, released just in the nick of time. Everything else on my list is old.

Ceph · Post by **Ceph** » Sat Apr 01, 2006 1:39 pm

Only 4 votes for Under Defeat so far; I'd have expected more.

LSU · Post by **LSU** » Sat Apr 01, 2006 5:35 pm

Ceph wrote:Only 4 votes for Under Defeat so far; I'd have expected more.

It's undeniably a fantastic game but I'd want to live with it for a while before including it in my list. I just can't evaluate a new game against all those classics that quickly, I've only spent a fraction of the amount of time I've played on all those with Under Defeat.

But maybe others have had more time to play it since they got it and there'll be more edits before the poll closes.

There's always next time though.

Turrican · Post by **Turrican** » Sat Apr 01, 2006 6:37 pm

Some errors I noticed while reading the poll:

page 1, agony voted for Gunbird Special Edition, a compilation

page 2, angrycoder voted for Soukyugurentai twice

page 2, visuatrox voted for Zanac X Zanac, a compilation.

page 4, MovingTarget voted for Raiden Project, a compilation.

Tehkao must still specify which Salamander he voted for!

Alpolio · Post by **Alpolio** » Sat Apr 01, 2006 8:54 pm

I really wanted to vote for Shaq Fu. Because, I always have the strongest urge to pull a gun and shoot it.

Zach Keene · Post by **Zach Keene** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 7:01 am

Polls are now closed; the voting thread is here should anyone want to review it.

Thunder Force · Post by **Thunder Force** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 9:42 am

Looking forward to 2006's results. I know many hope something finally dethrones Dodonpachi... but will it happen?

Fenrir · Post by **Fenrir** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 1:24 pm

Ikaruga will smash it to smithereens

Turrican · Post by **Turrican** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 3:24 pm

Fenrir wrote:Ikaruga will smash it to smithereens

Yeah. I did a quick review of the poll, using the following criteria: I counted how much votes did get the games that were in my top 25, plus a selection of six games (Ikaruga, Strikers '45 II, Gunbird 2, DDP-DOJ, Battle Garegga and Mars Matrix) that I knew were going to score high in the list.

Of course, all this is intended as a purely indicative, since it assumes each game was voted [1].

Ikaruga got the most votes (52 circa).* Judging from what I've seen, a game will have chances to enter the top 25 if it got at least more than 20 votes...

There has been a good increment of votes for less-known games (11 Apidya voters - that should make of it the most loved western developed shmup of all times), but since the total voters pretty much doubled, this will be diluted by the "usual mainstream" votes. As a result, the definitive top 25 won't look MUCH different from the previous one.

Let's hope there's a trend change.

*this, too, isn't exactly news:

Nullstar, in the 2004 discussion thread wrote:Only one game -- not two -- received votes from at least half of voters. (It was Ikaruga; DDP missed by a smidge.)

And yet DDP was at first spot, because it was ranked [higher] by voters...

Zach Keene · Post by **Zach Keene** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 8:22 pm

Turrican wrote:errors

I've just sent out some PMs asking for clarification on those and a few others I noticed.

Turrican · Post by **Turrican** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 8:43 pm

Zach Keene wrote:I've just sent out some PMs asking for clarification on those and a few others I noticed.

Awesome! oh, Zach, when you've thought about it, could you post the official list of versions which count as separated games?
I've seen Gradius II (PCE) and Gradius II (NES) but I'm still of the opinion that they count with the arcade -unlike Gradius II MSX, of course.

Zach Keene · Post by **Zach Keene** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 12:38 am

Turrican wrote:oh, Zach, when you've thought about it, could you post the official list of versions which count as separated games?

Yeah, I'll try to get one up soon.

jp · Post by jp » Tue Apr 04, 2006 2:17 am

Yikes! I forgot to add Under Defeat.

Ah well, there's always next year.

Ceph · Post by **Ceph** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 8:42 am

Hey JP, you still haven't got all Saturn shmups?

captain ahar · Post by **captain ahar** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 3:54 pm

Ceph wrote:Hey JP, you still haven't got all Saturn shmups?

speaking of which, how long has it been since you've updated "going for the gold"?

Ceph · Post by **Ceph** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 4:26 pm

And by the way, I didn't include Under Defeat either. It seems to be a great game (solid, well crafted, fun to play, easy to get into - more games should be this way), but I felt like not having played it enough to judge it fairly.

jp · Post by jp » Tue Apr 04, 2006 6:26 pm

Ceph wrote:Hey JP, you still haven't got all Saturn shmups?

Sadly no... I got burned out on shmups about a year ago, only 9 shy of finishing my goal. About this time I started collecting other things on the Saturn for awhile, and it was during this time I bought 2 Hitachi Navi GPS HiSaturns.

But I've recently gotten back into it, as I bought Strikers 1945 and Dodonpachi last week and plan on buying 2 more this week. I hope to finish in June. ^_^

oh! Captain_Ahar,

I updated it yesterday. Hence the bold UPDATED.

Edit: Well, its not that I got burned out on SHMUPS, rather, I got burned out on shmups I don't like. I think right before I quit I bought a lot of lame stuff, and that made me get tired of buying 'em. Really and truly, if I had any concept of money I would have probably just settled for all the Tecno Soft shmups, the Success shmups, the Raizing shmups, and the Taito shmups and have been done with it (I didn't say RS because I already had it at the time). Because in all honesty, I only play RS and the Tecno Soft shmups...

captain ahar · Post by **captain ahar** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 6:52 pm

then the details are what's confusing me.

-header says 33/55
-coming up says (12)

and i thought you bought battle garegga already?

jp · Post by jp » Tue Apr 04, 2006 7:02 pm

captain ahar wrote:then the details are what's confusing me.

-header says 33/55
-coming up says (12)

and i thought you bought battle garegga already?

Eh? Guess I need to edit the page some more! Thanks for pointing that out.

Nope, I almost bought it, but I couldn't find it for a reasonable price ($70-75). Nor could I find it complete.

But I really want to save it for last.

howmuchkeefe · Post by **howmuchkeefe** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 9:59 pm

Zach - I replied to my PM about two hours ago. I hope I didn't cause you too much inconvenience!

Zach Keene · Post by **Zach Keene** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 1:19 am

I got it, and you didn't.

thesuperkillerxxx · Post by **thesuperkillerxxx** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 3:40 am

jp really needs to give up on his dream of gettin garegga last, you should have bought it long ago!!!!!!!!

leave me be I am drunk

Turrican · Post by **Turrican** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 9:13 am

thesuperkillerxxx wrote:jp really needs to give up on his dream of gettin garegga last, you should have bought it long ago!!!!!!!!

Would agree if you said this earlier. Now, if he is planning to end in June, it's close enough to allow him end with a bang.

captain ahar · Post by **captain ahar** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 2:51 pm

jp wrote: Eh? Guess I need to edit the page some more! Thanks for pointing that out.

Nope, I almost bought it, but I couldn't find it for a reasonable price ($70-75). Nor could I find it complete.

But I really want to save it for last.

scored mine for $60 (through trade, goodbye trizeal *waves as i stifle my laugh with a sleeve*)...

Ceph · Post by **Ceph** » Thu Apr 06, 2006 11:07 am

Heh, first people anticipated Trizeal would suck, then after its release they suddenly began to praize it, and now it's back to disliking it ;-D

Ganelon · Post by **Ganelon** » Thu Apr 06, 2006 12:57 pm

That's because nobody can form accurate judgments on a game in 2 weeks and trying to do so is a futile, silly effort. Only in retrospect do we realize which games we treasure most. And trends change with social differences; Soukyugurentai was once one of the most beloved shooters here but has since fallen to a respected status.

Anyway, Battle Garegga's demand has dropped recently, which means it's yielding $60-70 prices again (hell, I've seen it on Ebay for that much, with spine).

Turrican · Post by **Turrican** » Thu Apr 06, 2006 1:06 pm

Ganelon wrote:That's because nobody can form accurate judgments on a game in 2 weeks and trying to do so is a futile, silly effort. Only in retrospect do we realize which games we treasure most. And trends change with social differences; Soukyugurentai was once one of the most beloved shooters here but has since fallen to a respected status.

Soukyugurentai consistently gained positions in previous polls. This time, 26 members circa voted for it. It will probably fall some positions, but it's still quite loved. (and hey, what kind of social differences should affect Souky's popularity?)

Ganelon · Post by **Ganelon** » Thu Apr 06, 2006 1:33 pm

Well, I stand corrected then. Perhaps that wasn't such a good example. But even so, there's none of that "RDS is number 1 on the SS, Soukyu is number 2" mentality from back in 1998/99.

By social differences, I meant the fact that group thought tends to encompass individual thought (AKA indirect peer pressure). When certain individuals who formed the core of one community leave or no longer participates and is replaced by people who have other interests in mind, those new interests replace many of the older ones. And that's my belief in how games like Soldier Blade that were once so treasured by this forum have fallen into simply "good" status: because the core individuals in the trend supporting the game disappeared or no longer cared.