Prelude to the Apocalypse

[BryanM]

As jank and inefficient our public schools are, they at least have managed to drive the illiteracy rate into the ground. Capitalist paradise Burkina Faso, where the French Banks ruled (and probably still do, haven't looked into the direction things are going since they've deposed their malevolent dictator who deposed their benevolent dictator), had for-profit schools for the longest time and the worst literacy rate in the world.

My illiterate uncle who's circling the drain right now comes to mind. (A life of alcoholism catching up to him finally, perhaps.) Which is related to BM's exhausted cry of "why aren't our old people learning?"

How would they learn? The only avenues of education possible for this demographic are the television, the radio, and their kids. When the media portrays a certain sort of reality to people, it's crippling. That's what shocks me about CNN letting Bernie Sanders on all the time these days - why are they doing that? It's against their interest. Is their hubris so huge they don't think they can be taken down?



> Which is related to BM's exhausted cry of "why aren't our old people learning?"

In my younger days I used to feel the same exact sort of exasperation at the commentary of David Brooks. Every week he'd contort to defend whatever republicans were doing that week, and it increasingly became more and more absurd. "Why isn't this guy a democrat already?!"

Brooks has the remarkable ability to make himself sound like a reasonable person, on the surface. But once you've observed it for long enough, it becomes obvious that it's an act. He's got a paycheck and that paycheck is to make the GOP a palatable choice for normal people to support. (This is a major reason the establishment doesn't like Trump. He doesn't do this necessary game of play pretend.)

[GaijinPunch]

The property tax in the Chicago area is NUTS! You can get major savings if you move to something like the Midwest or the South on average (but lol on Texas).

Yes, but the actual value of the homes are about half of what they are on the coasts. As I stated, "the housing costs are reasonable" so dollar for dollar we won't get pounded as hard. This is how people get priced out of gentrified neighborhoods. I know people in NYC whose housing tax is crazy, even though they paid a reasonable price for their place. That's gonna hurt.

Winners:
Big businesss

of course

Those who have children for tax purposes (bigger tax credit)

Actually don't people w/ 3+ kids get fucked? Not read up - going off of what a colleague told me.

No student loan payment or high medical bills

I don't follow. This is America. There will always be high medical bills.

Losers:
Those who have high student loan payments and medical bills (20+ crowd, yepppp)

This is probably the most unforgivable thing in there. But, it's a good plan. The Republican Party's whole modus operandi is to make poor people stupid (not one of them has said anything less than "this will save everyone money") so they vote these dip shits in that vote against their economic interests. What better way than to turn them away from education. It's all about God w/ a lot of those voters anyway, so not that much work.

If this bill pass I will expect more people in the North to move more to the South in order to take advantage of cheaper taxes. Still sucks since I enjoyed my time in Rural New England, but the tax cost and the cost of living is more than double than what I get in Florida.

The administration will be gone before we see that... these aren't things that push people out immediately. Places like Illinois you may see (it has it's own disasters to worry about regardless of administration, and everyone knows it). But NYC, Cali... the cost of living is high, but the salaries are high too. If that starts to shift, it will be bad news for the states, but it's basically like trickle down economics. It was a load of shit from the start but there was no empirical evidence until it was too late.

Want to know what's funny? My dad lives in a mostly retirement area in Northern FL. His county has a high percentage of retirees, and they get major breaks on property taxes. Most of the retires complain about why they are
paying taxes for schools when they don't have children in the system (as usual, schools get their funding from Property Taxes).

I plan on totally retiring abroad somewhere... I figured I would when I repatriated, and the way things have been going the last few years keep pushing me there. If Japan continue on its trajectory for another 20 years I should be able to buy a house in the Tokyo suburbs for a song.

[Obscura]

The "tax bill" is secretly a "make people on the coasts actually pay for the shit they vote for themselves at a local level" bill, which is good.

"Deduct your state/local taxes from your federal taxes" is fucking insanity -- it means a state can give itself an expensive new program, raise its local taxes to pay for it, and end up with the rest of the nation paying for that expensive program. States shouldn't be able to vote themselves freebies at the expense of other states like that.

Yeah, now that we can't write off state taxes I'm sure the spending will all be roped in and John Q Taxpayer won't get butt fucked in some urban dictionary worth sex position involving a state and the federal govt.

Why the hell should California effectively be able to force people in Texas to fund stuff that it does at a state level?

Oh no, California voted themselves a bunch of expensive programs, and it turns out they're going to have to pay for them instead of forcing other people to pay for what they voted for themselves! How terrible! The only downside is that this is sure to cause California's economy to get even shittier and cause even more of them to move down here to Texas and inflict themselves upon us.

[Domino]

Yes, but the actual value of the homes are about half of what they are on the coasts. As I stated, "the housing costs are reasonable" so dollar for dollar we won't get pounded as hard. This is how people get priced out of gentrified neighborhoods. I know people in NYC whose housing tax is crazy, even though they paid a reasonable price for their place. That's gonna hurt.

Agreed, but Chicago is a shithole in general. I had rich family members moved to the area and I'm was like nope. The government in the area suck, too many assholes I know from the area.

Actually don't people w/ 3+ kids get fucked? Not read up - going off of what a colleague told me.

I don't believe so. They are planning to increase the tax credits for those with dependents. So if you have children your refund will be better.

I don't follow. This is America. There will always be high medical bills.

Currently you can apply the cost of your medical bills towards your taxes (so you can pay less on federal taxes). Here's the current rule:

The IRS allows you to deduct qualified medical expenses that exceed 10% of your adjusted gross income for the year. ... If you or your spouse were 65 years or older or turned 65 during the tax year you were allowed to deduct unreimbursed medical care expenses that exceed 7.5% of your adjusted gross income.

If the GOP Tax Pass becomes law, that will go away. For those who are able to pay their medical expenses and is above 10% of their gross income, then that's a tax benefit that is going bye bye.

This is probably the most unforgivable thing in there. But, it's a good plan. The Republican Party's whole modus operandi is to make poor people stupid (not one of them has said anything less than "this will save everyone money") so they vote these dip shits in that vote against their economic interests. What better way than to turn them away from education. It's all about God w/ a lot of those voters anyway, so not that much work.

Be careful of putting a group of people together. It is like saying all followers of Islam want to kill Americans (when this is not true).

From living in the south, there's a group of people who do not want government to interfere with their lives. As long as they have someone who is like them representing them, that's where it counts. Look at Roy Moore...

The administration will be gone before we see that... these aren't things that push people out immediately. Places like Illinois you may see (it has it's own disasters to worry about regardless of administration, and everyone knows it). But NYC, Cali... the cost of living is high, but the salaries are high too. If that starts to shift, it will be bad news for the states, but it's basically like trickle down economics. It was a load of shit from the start but there was no empirical evidence until it was too late.

I agree that salaries are high, but a lot of the benefits get eaten up by taxes. If someone makes 100k in NYC (and also lives in NYC), that's about almost 40k per year that goes bye bye to taxes (city for working in NYC, state, federal). I used to live in NYC, people travel very very far in order to get an affordable place to live. It's so bad now in NYC that there's a middle class apartment lotteries that the city gives out to residents who are middle class. Rent in the city is high, which unless you are really rich with a high salary, or get assistance from the city, you are screwed. Or unless you want to travel very far each way to get into the area, which gets tiresome very fast.

I plan on totally retiring abroad somewhere... I figured I would when I repatriated, and the way things have been going the last few years keep pushing me there. If Japan continue on its trajectory for another 20 years I should be able to buy a house in the Tokyo suburbs for a song.

Do it, might as well give up your citizenship in order to save taxes.

[BryanM]

Moore up 49% to 43% over Jones. 71% of Alabama Republicans say the allegations against Moore are false; 92% of those people say Democrats are behind them

He's +3.2 on the RCP average.

[Rob]

Doubt it. There aren't enough bigots and racists here to make you feel welcome. And seriously dude, just drop it. Your attempts have moved from laughable to pitiful; this isn't even trolling. You come off more as desperately needing to find validation for whatever you believe in, than to get any point across, and it's starting to wear thin.

You are such a fragile creature. It was a joke. Also, it looks like that is adjacent to Tonto National Forest, which is where I'd actually want to be if Phoenix wasn't much too far south for my tastes.

[BulletMagnet]

Oh I know, that's why I did a on my statement. This might be the only time we will agree on anything politically BM.

Apologies, at this point my sarcasm-o-meter's well and truly fried.

Why the hell should California effectively be able to force people in Texas to fund stuff that it does at a state level?

Because, to re-use the two states you mentioned, Texas already forces California to pay for the stuff it doesn't fund itself, because it relies on the federal government to fill in the gaps (y'know, the one it always supposedly wants to stay out of its business), and thus California ends up paying more to the feds than it gets back, while Texas comes out ahead. Earlier someone mentioned a chart to that effect, and here it is, though for the record Texas isn't among the worst offenders.

[Rob]

@Rob - As I said, I'm pretty much done with you so long as you say stuff like this,

(taking one out of Master Zen's playbook here)

while the rest of us are left waiting ad infinitum for your own "clarifications" on the UN wants to destroy white people, this document proves it

"The rest of us" = you, but here is a snip of the article that triggered the exchange that led you to believe that I said the above (phew, I wonder why I'd been ignoring this up until now...):

“It’s not that,” Gambino replied. “It’s just for Christians, the culture of America that we’re a part of is sort of being usurped.”

“Why does it matter?” Ghouri asked. “Why do you have to feel superior? Are we forcing them to speak another language or do another thing? No. You do whatever you want to do. We are living in a growing and thriving community and we are going to do what we want to do.”

“It can make some people uncomfortable is all I’m saying,” Gambino said.

He says that he feels his culture is being "usurped" and that he ("some people") feels "uncomfortable". You mocked this guy for expressing this. Once more:



Whether or not you'd like to draw a tiny line between an international organization "exploring" "replacement migration" and where we are at in the West today is up to you. You don't have to think there's anything nefarious going on or that our government knows what it's doing - that's fine. But what is happening to our culture is not in his mind and I think he is perfectly justified in feeling uneasy about it.

or American attitudes towards the Irish haven't changed since the Declaration was signed,

This is the argument you shifted to. The claim that you made and would need to prove is that the Irish were not "the right kind of European" when they had been immigrating in significant numbers for 300 years, were never denied citizenship or any rights that I'm aware of, etc. You had a folk song. I'll take the Declaration. I think what you're trying to argue is that some Irish were discriminated against at some point somewhere and therefore all discrimination against any group at any point is invalid (?). If so, I completely disagree.

here in the USA the definition if "American" has always been, and will always continue to be, as relative and fluid as any concept you could possibly think of.

Not "always been". In recent times it has come to mean nothing. That is the problem.

Enjoy the tax cut while you continue to bravely focus on the real source of our problems.

As horrible as you think the tax plan is, it is not something we are stuck with forever.

...Hope I get a passing grade on my homework and can now get some straight answers to simple questions when I ask them.

[BryanM]

Earlier someone mentioned a chart to that effect, and here it is, though for the record Texas isn't among the worst offenders.

One thing for everyone to keep in mind (since it's easy to be lazy and fall into a team vs team mentality in this stuff) is that charts like this are more an illustration of the distribution of income inequality than anything else. The income tax falls heaviest on those who make a lot of money from a wage, not capital. (Which is why I guess the current bill doesn't cut it nearly as much as I was expecting them to - it's really a minor gift to the capitalist's lieutenants. The real meat is always reserved for Daddy himself.)

If you were to do this county by county, it'd tell a very very very different story. Most of California would be just as much a moocher as Alabama, because most of the state is an agricultural plantation state. Not every place is San Jose, LA, or San Francisco. Not every place is a nest of working class millionaires.

[Rob]

murderers on death row have a stronger sense of justice when it comes to pedophiles than evangelical voters.

CREEPY UNCLE JOE. I have not been following the pre-election gossip about Roy Moore closely, but didn't most of you guys help put Joe Biden in the White House?

[BryanM]

I know what you're thinking of doing. From time to time I've had that impulse myself.

Don't do it. Walk past the dog turd. Do not look directly at it. Do not hit that reply button.

Some of you have complained about the shittiness of this thread.

It's only as shitty as you make it. Don't pick up and lick the shit. There's nothing constructive in doing so. Move on by. Like a normal person.

[Rob]

From time to time I've had that impulse myself.

What you've had are called sperg-outs, not impulses. All I'm doing is giving my opinions. I'm sure you'll be fine.

[Mischief Maker]

Instead of touching the poop, I shall post this funny 20-second video of yet another time Libertarianism collided with reality:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vIkC0JTzRvU

"Why aren't the other hands up?" Because they're not going to use the corporate tax cuts to invest in their workers, silly! They're going to use the extra money for stock buybacks. Because that inflates the value of their own stock options and gets more money into their own personal pockets. Long-term health of their company or the economy be damned! This is completely predictable because that's how the incentive structure works.

The fact that these Wall Street Journal Editors and Gary Cohn were delusional enough to even ask this question while cameras were running indicates that they're more true believers in this horseshit then cynical con men.

Libertarianism is the Scientology of politics.

[Rob]

Rob said that non-"whites" are genetically inferior based on eugenics pseudoscience

These are entirely your words and ideas, not mine. Please do not say "Rob said" and follow that with defamatory things fabricated in your mind.

Mischief Maker: do you remember when you kept righteously flipping out over books you hadn't read and tried to skewer me for saying something I didn't say, but seemed to forget that you wholeheartedly recommended a book that actually does make this statement with groups reversed. A refresher:

Almost all studies of child development emphasize the role of childhood stimulation and activity in promoting mental development, and stress the irreversible mental stunting associated with reduced childhood stimulation. This effect surely contributes a non-genetic component to the superior average mental function displayed by New Guineans.

That is, in mental ability New Guineans are probably genetically superior to Westerners, and they surely are superior in escaping the devastating developmental disadvantages under which most children in industrialized societies now grow up.

Wow. When said about some primitive tribe, acclaimed by you. Maybe fake me needed to add a "probably".

Libertarianism is the Scientology of politics.

You've got economic theory all wrapped up, you're 'science dudes', environmentalists and so much more - truly the Renaissance men of our times. Maybe a bit of humility and self-awareness.

[Zen]

Well, I choose to see this for what it is. Sublimation of Love.

We are at the very least, making progress.
If my calculations are correct, we are somewhere between Denial and Anger.

Valhalla awaits!

[Mischief Maker]

The only thing I'm curious about is whether he stumbled on that out-of-context quote tonight on some message board or blog then rushed back here all giddy to throw it in my face, or if he's always had it in his back pocket and is bringing it out tonight because I indicated BryanM has finally convinced me to stop engaging and... the poop... it wants to be touched!

[Rob]

Man who attacked 2 women sentenced to 35 years; case attracted attention of immigration officials

Deported 12 times.

Martinez admitted he was guilty of sexually assaulting a 65-year-old woman July 24 after entering her Northeast Irving Street apartment through an open window, threatening her with a metal rod, tying her up with scarves and socks, punching her then escaping with her car.

Hours later, authorities said, he attacked another woman at knifepoint as she was leaving work and walking to her car in a parking garage on Northeast Halsey Street. He forced the 37-year-old woman into her car, but she got out. He then tackled her to the ground and repeatedly bashed her head into the concrete before taking her car, Girt wrote in a probable cause affidavit.
...
He has been arrested on various crimes in three states.

But remember, Trump is a racist.

out-of-context quote

lol. I recall it being somewhere around (the bottom of?) page 21. It's unambiguous. He even has some theories as to how these people became smarter than Westerners, which is of course true.

[Mortificator]

You're not very convincing at pretending to be outraged by rape. Have you finally stopped wandering around outside with plastic ties, trying to end your celibacy?

[brokenhalo]

Man who attacked 2 women sentenced to 35 years; case attracted attention of immigration officials

Wow, what a horrible crime that could only be committed by one of those evil brown people. We should round up all of them and.....omg.....no way.....WHITE AMERICAN sentenced to 35 years for raping a 6 year old girl and trying to abduct a 10 year old.

This is just terrible. There are so many illegals in this country doing horrible things that now they are corrupting the "pure as the driven snow" White Master Race.

Or maybe all sub-groupings of people contain a few fucked up people and you probably shouldn't judge the many by the actions of the few.

Question for you, Rob. The guy was deported 12 times. Assuming you were in a position of authority, what would you have done to prevent this man from committing a crime on United States soil?

[Rob]

Anti-Trump logic:

-we already have crime and therefore

-we must also live with additional crime committed by people who have been deported 12 times, should not be here for any reason and especially not given sanctuary

[gameoverDude]

Wow, what a horrible crime that could only be committed by one of those evil brown people. We should round up all of them and.....omg.....no way.....WHITE AMERICAN sentenced to 35 years for raping a 6 year old girl and trying to abduct a 10 year old.

This is just terrible. There are so many illegals in this country doing horrible things that now they are corrupting the "pure as the driven snow" White Master Race.

Or maybe all sub-groupings of people contain a few fucked up people and you probably shouldn't judge the many by the actions of the few.

Question for you, Rob. The guy was deported 12 times. Assuming you were in a position of authority, what would you have done to prevent this man from committing a crime on United States soil?

The condition of being fucked-up doesn't discriminate. What will building a wall fix? Zero. As for Martinez, it's clear 12 deportations didn't do jack shit. This has nothing to do with immigration or race. He broke the law in the USA and should be dealt with by its own authorities. Sticking him in prison is better than deporting him a 13th time. Deporting him would leave him at large, with a chance of crossing the border again.

So in the cases of Christian & Martinez, the respective perp is away for 35 years. Whatever. It's still not harsh enough. Life in prison without parole is what they both deserve.
Kidnapping, armed robbery, and rape should be considered as grave as murder. Attempted murder? It's still murder. You really shouldn't let a murderer off any easier just because their victim survives.

[Rob]

What will building a wall fix? Zero. ...
Deporting him would leave him at large, with a chance of crossing the border again.

Do you understand that a significant wall (not a chain link fence or something a small man can straddle) at the border would prevent many people from crossing the border?

As for Martinez, it's clear 12 deportations didn't do jack shit.

It is clear that this strategy of letting people come and go as they please does not work, yes. Time for a new approach.

[brokenhalo]

What will building a wall fix? Zero. ...
Deporting him would leave him at large, with a chance of crossing the border again.

Do you understand that a significant wall (not a chain link fence or something a small man can straddle) at the border would prevent many people from crossing the border?

I didn't realize that the parts of our border that were fenced only had 2 foot high chain link fences that small men could straddle.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DLVdi14ECCc

Oh wait, they are actually pretty high and guys just climb right over them. So let's spend $22,000,000,000 on a bigger badder wall. Let's hope that our southern neighbors don't obtain some sort of terrorist training video on how to deal with walls.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NgV63l9khBQ

[Rob]

So let's spend $22,000,000,000 on a bigger badder wall.

Sounds like a bargain. There are examples around the world of how well "bigger badder" walls work. If we can pay for repeated deportations, extra police work, trials and incarceration, in addition to non-violent system leaches, we can do a wall. Why are people so opposed to keeping Americans safe? Is it really just about the cost? I really don't understand that one.

Compare the wall in your video to the prototypes:



No one is going to be shimmying up or down walls like these. There are currently also stretches without any wall or ramshackle barriers that you can see here.

[brokenhalo]

I'll let you google "airplanes" "drug catapult", "drone delivering contraband", "drug tunnels", "explosives" and "construction equipment". for yourself. A wall will accomplish precisely jack and shit.

[BryanM]

I'll let you google "airplanes" "drug catapult", "drone delivering contraband", "drug tunnels", "explosives" and "construction equipment". for yourself. A wall will accomplish precisely jack and shit.

brokenhalo.

Do you think a human being is incapable of knowing that ladders exist?

Do you think a human being can really believe it is okay for a 30+ year old man to stalk and have sex with ~14 year old girls because Joe Biden sniffed some kids?

Do you think a human being capable of registering on an internet forum and typing words into a text box can be that fucking retarded?

Of course not. It is a low quality bait.

As punishment for touching the poop and spreading it all over the place, I want a three paragraph minimum length essay on your stance on healthcare and whether or not the democratic party requires reform by purging it of corporate puppets or not.

Thanks in advance.

the poop... it wants to be touched!

Of course it does that makes it purrrr.

weaboo.system11.org is a really weird place to attention whore. Why not just start a yootube or twitch stream and be as famous as sargon of newjesusland or bittney venti?

Too much effort I guess. Lazy.

[Rob]

Bryan, please tell us again how envious you are of things other people have.

[BryanM]

13 minutes.

[brokenhalo]

Do you think a human being capable of registering on an internet forum and typing words into a text box can be that fucking retarded?

We have a president Donald Trump now. I don't put anything past anyone anymore. We live in shit world now. Somehow, the guy on the right gets to have a job where he ruins the country, instead of being tarred, feathered and marched off of a cliff for being such a smug, pompous and dangerous piece of shit.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-gSqS-3QYj0

[Mischief Maker]

...aaand MSNBC fired Sam Seder based on Weird Mike Cernovich's drummed up controversy.

In case you don't know who Weird Mike is, here's a hilarious primer by Vic Berger.

Also keep in mind that this guy lives off alimony from his successful lawyer ex-wife.