Your favourite iconic horizontal series

[Perikles]

Surely a similar (or identical) topic exists somewhere in the depths of the forum, but it must be several years old by now. Since members come and go, penchants/aversions change, more games are being played... a new thread doesn't seem like a bad idea.

Note that I'm just asking for your subjective standpoint, no reason to agonize over it! It would obviously help to have at least some passing familiarity with all four series, but it's safe to assume that no one has extensively/intensively played each and every main/side game of all series. Would be great to hear some explanations, too, of course.

I was not entirely certain whether I should add the Thunder Force series or not, I'm going to assume no one will protest against it, so it's there as well.

[Durandal]

Darius always stood out with its amazing visuals and soundtracks by Hisayoshi Ogura, G-Darius is probably THE best looking 3D SHMUP because of its art direction and sheer ambition, perhaps the best looking SHMUP of all time. The stage design always felt a bit shoddy due to the quantity over quality approach with the branching stages, though. But anything with beam duels gets bonus points from me

Gradius will always stand out for being the OG thanks to its cool upgrade system and great stage design, even though I prefer R-Type for the sick maneuvers you could pull off with the Force Pod

There's something to be admired in Thunder Force's simplicity, it doesn't have an innovative original weapon system or something revolutionary, but the amount of polish that went into TF3/4 from visuals, stages, and music makes the game feel whole. Like reading a classic 70's manga or something, there's no bullshit involved. Just you, and some weapons against an entire army with heavy synth metal rocking in the background

[Squire Grooktook]

Gradius has been very influential on my tastes, and its best moments are among the closest to my heart, but I find it a somewhat inconsistent series that never quite reaches perfection, and Darius ends up being the more satisfying series overall to me.

As much as I love Gradius's cover shooting and interesting stage gimmicks, I actually find myself preferring the spartan and messy but inimitably chaotic and furious level designs of Darius these days, and giant cinematic boss fights have always been my major preference as well.

R-Type I love as well, but its chessboard in space is more of an alternate flavor which I enjoy on the side, albeit one that I could never ever part with. Thunder Force series feels more like a series of tech demos with fantastic presentation to me then true well rounded classics of game design, though the 4th installment may just barely rise to the level of the other names mentioned in this list IMO.

[Kino]

No option for Cotton?

[Skykid]

No option for Cotton?

No.

Darius for me. Loved a bit of TF way back when, but Darius is a series that still captures my imagination today.

[Despatche]

Darius is a series that has a bunch of decent games, but the underlying system is a bit wack. The series traditionally tries to be bigger than it really can be, and suffers a bit for it. G and Burst try to do something about all of this. The fan favorite, Gaiden, is also a really strange game that almost doesn't work at all.

R-Type has a really great first game, a decent sequel, a weird third game, and a really great fourth game, plus a lot of good spinoffs like ImageFight and X Multiply.

Gradius is similar to the above. Really great first game, but the next few games put way too much emphasis on flash over gameplay, and they also tend to be fan favorites by some horrible stroke of luck. III is a pretty funny joke, but Gaiden is phenomenal. V isn't really a Gradius game. Parodius and somewhat-related games like Thunder Cross are great.

Thunder Force is a silly series with silly gameplay, this is a game you mostly play for aesthetic. However, it directly led to Hyper Duel and Blast Wind, as well as Gate of Thunder and Winds of Thunder, all of which are very big deals.

It's very hard to choose, but I think R-Type might win out.

[To Far Away Times]

I went with R-Type. R-Type 1 and Delta are some of my favorite games ever. I really love the Darius and Thunderforce series as well.

I'm actually not too fond of Gradius for whatever reason. (Even though I've 1CC'd a few of the games).

[Xyga]

Darius. TF second.

[AxelMill]

Darius Gaiden and G-Darius, thanks to Taito Legends 2, introduced me to the genre (if we're not counting Super Space Invaders '91, which I don't) all those years ago, and DariusBurst, merely 14 months ago, made me fall in love with it. Of course I'd vote for Darius.
Burst singlehandedly changed my life as a gamer, I'm not kidding. Length was the most important part of a game for me before, and for that reason I only bought RPGs because I was afraid I'd finish any other game in less than a week. I didn't actually play through the entirety of them most of the time, but I digress. Now I don't give a damn about a game's length, heck, I actually prefer shorter games nowadays.
Thank you, Taito. Thank you.

[Perikles]

No option for Cotton?

I sympathize with your indignation, but for the purpose of this poll I wanted only the most popular, vast and archetypical (for better or for worse) series. The Cotton series produced three-and-a-half horizontal entries (Cotton 100% is moreso a reimagination of the first game than a full-fledged original game, similar to Super R-Type in that regard) and is not nearly as well-known or emblematic as the above titles. That's no implicit statement on the quality of the Cotton games, it's just not quite fitting for the theme I was going for here - I also love quite a few other horizontal series which I omitted for this poll (Parodius, Rayxanber, the inofficial "Capcom flying man" trilogy...), I hope you (grudgingly) understand.


Anyway, as for my personal vote:

- I enjoy Darius games quite a bit, although I haven't played G-Darius or any Darius Burst after the first PSP entry yet. Solidly crafted games with a lean, elegant flow. I particularly like II and Force for their stronger focus on level design, notably Force has some unusually strong design choices in that department. I don't understand how any of the games could ever include a random element of scoring, it's a glaring problem in the first game and still problematic in later games where it is featured. There are also some structural weaknesses in the aforementioned level conception when they just repeat three or four enemy formations in a row without much of a substantial change in terrain or positioning. Not too fond of Gaiden, Twin is fairly average in every regard.

- Love the Gradius series. If I were to vote "objectively" I would probably have to go with R-Type, but the higher degree of improvisation and looping gives Gradius the edge for me. Those are the only games out of the poll where I feel compelled to revisit them over and over and over again, trying to clear yet another loop or two or three and getting a better score. I'm also astounded how much small decisions completely alter the experience: do you pick up a fourth option in II or Gaiden? If so, only at a specific spot or right away? Do you use the fourth option for a stage or two and then let the option hunter take it away? The amount of speed-ups is crucial for enabling certain strategies and techniques with the options, three speed-ups allow a lot more tricks than two, and a fourth speed-up facilitates complete screen control at the risk of crashing into terrain. I also think that the "Gradius syndrome" is more of an exception than a rule, most checkpoints in most games are surmountable with enough practice - I even looked a tiny bit into III's (AC) first loop checkpoints, I overestimated some of them, too. That's not too say every checkpoint is balanced (they're most certainly not), yet I don't believe it's as bad as some people make it out to be. I also adore the audiovisual presentation of most games.

- R-Type is a close second for me. I, II and Delta are all close to perfection for me, and III is still excellent. Not too enthusiastic about Leo (which doesn't play a lot like an R-Type game) and Final has some blatant problems even though it's not terrible, either. It's baffling just how balanced the first game is, you can use every weapon for every stage for some useful effect, it boggles the mind. II is certainly more restricted since the DNA laser is the better choice under most circumstances, but I dare say the puzzles are even more engaging. I've not seen anything as thrilling and pumping as the final stage in the second loop, that is true horror, indeed. Encapsulates everything that is great about memorizers. My only small gripe is that due to their hermetic nature it's a bit cumbersome to get back to them for better scoring. While I love multi-loop marathons I'm not keen on checkpoint-milking; I'd admit in an instant that it requires a lot of knowledge and skill to proficiently milk the two arcade games in an efficient manner, I don't want to, however. Delta is the only game I would want to revisit since the simple scoring system is also satisfying to pull off, and you only have to sacrifice two lives.

- Haven't played the first, fifth and sixth Thunder Force (or TF AC), so I'm not as familiar with this series. Hate II, indifferent towards III/Spirits, adore IV. That's not nearly enough for me to consider voting for it.

[pegboy]

I'm beyond compromised when it comes to picking out of these since Gradius was the series that got me into shmups in the first place. Life Force on the NES was basically the first shump I ever played, and will forever make me a lifelong fan of the not only the series but the genre at large. I'm also pretty certain it was the first shmup (and likely game) I ever 1cc'd when I was a kid.

Gradius III for the SNES is actually what got me into shmups as an adult when I 1cc'd it back in like 2011 I think? I went for the better part of a decade (most of the 2000s and late 90s) without playing much of anything outside of PC games and JRPGs. I did like to pick random shmups in MAME and credit feed them back when I was in college but I never in a million years thought it was possible that someone could actually beat those games on 1 credit. I didn't understand the genre at all until I was probably close to 30 years old lol.

I love all 4 of these series but Gradius will always be #1 to me.

Edit: I'm surprised there are so many votes for Darius but I'm guessing that's because it's the only series out of the 4 that is still active.

[Shepardus]

I don't think I could confidently vote for one of these over the others, considering how little R-Type and Thunder Force I've played. I would vote for Parodius if that were an option.

Darius has the best bosses of the bunch, but the least interesting stage design. I'll echo Despatche in saying that the series goes for this "larger-than-life" feeling, with varying levels of success. Ironically G.Darius pulls this off the best in my opinion while having fewer screens and stages than its predecessors - the booming soundtrack, the screen-filling beam duels, and the gigantic bosses really sell the experience. The random-value grey balls have always been terrible, especially with the distribution of possible point values (each step up is double the value of the previous, so one 51,200 grey ball can be worth more than an entire game's worth of bad or even mediocre values). Fortunately they're not as big a deal in Dariusburst since the multiplier doesn't apply to them. Darius stages are generally alright but not particularly noteworthy, especially compared to the variety and ingenuity of Gradius and R-Type stages. The focus is clearly on the bosses.

Gradius 1 is a lot of fun despite stages 5 and 6 feeling like dead space. Gradius II is also fun but I get annoyed at how often I game-over on the first three stages (they don't feel hard...). Gradius III would probably be the most amazing game ever if it didn't hate the player so much. The others are interesting but I haven't played them much (haven't played V at all, in fact).

I haven't played a whole lot of R-Type but it seems very well-made, with little to complain about unless you simply don't like the Irem style. I 1-ALL'd X-Multiply and while I thought it was very well-made, it was rather claustrophobic for my taste. Which is probably intentional, considering the atmosphere of the game, but not really what I'm looking for in terms of gameplay. If this is something you like, though, you won't find anything better than Irem's offerings.

All of these have great soundtracks and great visuals, but in very different styles.

The only Thunder Force I've played is a couple credits of Thunder Force AC, and I wasn't terribly impressed by it. I'll reserve judgment on it until I've played more of the series, but I'm not in any rush to play more of it either.

[Vludi]

Gradius for me, I vastly prefer Gradius I and II over Darius I and II and probably will prefer Gradius Gaiden over Darius Gaiden too . Good level design, extensive weapon system and options are what makes Gradius great for me (looping is always good too). I haven't played G. Darius that much but it didn't catch my attention at first (will revisit it later). I played Dariusburst a bit on the PSP, cool game but I also need more experience with it, same with Gradius V.

I don't have much experience with the R-Type series yet, but my impression is that they have a more strict strategic approach due to the pod, just like X-Multiply or Image Fight. Loop 2 are fightening though.

Not to fond into the TF series, TF2, TF3 and TFAC are fun but nothing special to me. TF4 is more polished but I still prefer other "frantic horis" like Sengoku Blade, Zed Blade or P-47 aces, will probably revisit it later.

[Mortificator]

I like every R-Type game to some degree. Of the series, this one generally has the most creative stages. It started with an astoundingly good entry and core mechanic.

I like most of the Gradius games. It's actually some of the more popular ones that I have no interest in replaying, the original Gradius and Gradius II. With this series changing the least from game to game, most everything compelling about them has been folded into more balanced entries.

With Darius, I really only enjoy Gaiden and later. This series has the most spectacular boss fights, off course.

And Thunder Force IV is the sole game in its series to grab me.

[Super Laydock]

To each his own...

But people favouring Darius over R-type and Gradius tells me there are a lot of "new" fans of the genre here, not having played the classics.

Darius Burst CS ftw but as a series Gradius (including spin offs like Parodius and Salamander) is the winner - no competition!

[trap15]

But people favouring Darius over R-type and Gradius tells me there are a lot of "new" fans of the genre here, not having played the classics.

??? Darius is from 1987, as is R-Type! Gradius is the only older one, being 1985, which is only 2 years.

[Super Laydock]

But people favouring Darius over R-type and Gradius tells me there are a lot of "new" fans of the genre here, not having played the classics.

??? Darius is from 1987, as is R-Type! Gradius is the only older one, being 1985, which is only 2 years.

I mean Darius being the only series that has gotten a recent release (and a great one btw).
One game doesn't make a SERIES great or the best per se though.

[trap15]

It's impossible to prefer a series for any reason other than it has the newest game, then? I personally prefer Darius 1 and Darius 2 to Gradius 1 and 2, and both over any R-Type game except maybe Delta.

[Perikles]

I'm beyond compromised when it comes to picking out of these since Gradius was the series that got me into shmups in the first place. Life Force on the NES was basically the first shump I ever played, and will forever make me a lifelong fan of the not only the series but the genre at large. I'm also pretty certain it was the first shmup (and likely game) I ever 1cc'd when I was a kid.

Gradius III for the SNES is actually what got me into shmups as an adult when I 1cc'd it back in like 2011 I think?

Yeah, something similar applies to me, as well. 16-bit Gradius III was a deciding factor for me to get back into the genre some years back, it was a forceful experience. Counterstopping it recently was a great closure for me, I was always coming back to the game and seeing how improved knowledge of the genre would apply to it.

Gradius III would probably be the most amazing game ever if it didn't hate the player so much.

That's a fair, apt observation. However, I do think the game gets a lot of exaggerated criticism that is probably not even based on actual experience with the game and has more to do with its infamous reputation. It has some sensible problems, but it is also chock-full of ingenious stages which highlight the value of smart option placement. I'd argue that the best stages of III are easily among the best in the series while its flaws are more mechanical/global in nature (erratic slowdowns, some questionable hitboxes) yet can be dealt with if you're willing to spend the time. You can apparently even get past the cube stage consistently without losing a life as I've learned recently, hopefully I can learn that myself!

I mean Darius being the only series that has gotten a recent release (and a great one btw).
One game doesn't make a SERIES great or the best per se though.

Albeit it's safe to assume that the on-going activity for Darius did its fair share to the great standing the series also has more than just one classic title. The first game, II, Twin and Force are all orthodox horizontal shooters and Gaiden is not far from that branch, either. It's only from G onwards that the series ventured into scoring-heavier realms. As such I don't see why someone couldn't love the Darius series for its more conventional titles, there's definitely no lack in quantity (especially if we consider the wealth of ports for the first two games as well).

[MathU]

[You can apparently even get past the cube stage consistently without losing a life as I've learned recently, hopefully I can learn that myself!

While still in shape to survive the boss rush and final stage though? I'd like to hear this one.

I would like to chime in that Gradius III has quite a few more recoverable checkpoints than I think people are probably aware of. For some of them you have to know ahead of time how they're going to affect the appearance of the option hunter later on, and possibly intentionally kill yourself during the cube rush or fire stage in order to ensure you don't get it during a section later on that all but guarantees game over.

[Perikles]

While still in shape to survive the boss rush and final stage though? I'd like to hear this one.

This amazing replay demonstrates it. One death by accidental collision with one of the cubes in loop 1, but no more deaths in this stage from loops 1 through 5 (and on/in the boss rush/fortress afterwards). I'm pretty sure the player has devised some specific procedures depending on the behaviour of the first cubes. There's probably a finite amount of possible cube sequences which means that you can memorize when it's safe to move around and when you have to take cover after observing how the first cubes react. It's evidently far from trivial and still can contain some risky manoeuvres, I'm nonetheless fairly certain that he planned it out in advance and doesn't just dodge extemporaneously.

[pegboy]

While still in shape to survive the boss rush and final stage though? I'd like to hear this one.

This amazing replay demonstrates it. One death by accidental collision with one of the cubes in loop 1, but no more deaths in this stage from loops 1 through 5 (and on/in the boss rush/fortress afterwards). I'm pretty sure the player has devised some specific procedures depending on the behaviour of the first cubes. There's probably a finite amount of possible cube sequences which means that you can memorize when it's safe to move around and when you have to take cover after observing how the first cubes react. It's evidently far from trivial and still can contain some risky manoeuvres, I'm nonetheless fairly certain that he planned it out in advance and doesn't just dodge extemporaneously.

I believe this is correct, I do think that there are a finite number of cube sequences and if you play it long enough you being to recognize which ones are the "good" and "bad" ones. It is also static which cubes in the sequence will attack you, so it's not quite as random as it looks. I forget the order now but at one point I had it memorized for the first 20-30 cubes or so, although counting them on the fly becomes difficult.

Gradius III also has the most sadistic second loop by far of any of the games, partly because if you don't get to it fully powered you might as well reset and try again. It's a sickeningly evil game in so many ways.

[Shepardus]

But people favouring Darius over R-type and Gradius tells me there are a lot of "new" fans of the genre here, not having played the classics.

??? Darius is from 1987, as is R-Type! Gradius is the only older one, being 1985, which is only 2 years.

I mean Darius being the only series that has gotten a recent release (and a great one btw).
One game doesn't make a SERIES great or the best per se though.

It could also be the absence of checkpoints in most of the series.

[Perikles]

It could also be the absence of checkpoints in most of the series.

To be fair: recovering after a death outside of the final stretch is out of the question in II (arcade), it's much worse than every Gradius/R-Type game. The first arcade Darius (or Extra) might be possible, but it's still much harder to do than to just reset and play for as long as it takes to beat the game on the first life.

[Super Laydock]

It's impossible to prefer a series for any reason other than it has the newest game, then? I personally prefer Darius 1 and Darius 2 to Gradius 1 and 2, and both over any R-Type game except maybe Delta.

Of course not. But people with no track record with other series will most definitely be inclined to favour the most recent one they enjoyed I think.

This poll is about favouring one series over another, not about hating the other series...
If Darius is your pick... good for you.
For me there is no competition.
But like I said to each his own.

[MathU]

While still in shape to survive the boss rush and final stage though? I'd like to hear this one.

This amazing replay demonstrates it. One death by accidental collision with one of the cubes in loop 1, but no more deaths in this stage from loops 1 through 5 (and on/in the boss rush/fortress afterwards). I'm pretty sure the player has devised some specific procedures depending on the behaviour of the first cubes. There's probably a finite amount of possible cube sequences which means that you can memorize when it's safe to move around and when you have to take cover after observing how the first cubes react. It's evidently far from trivial and still can contain some risky manoeuvres, I'm nonetheless fairly certain that he planned it out in advance and doesn't just dodge extemporaneously.

I believe this is correct, I do think that there are a finite number of cube sequences and if you play it long enough you being to recognize which ones are the "good" and "bad" ones. It is also static which cubes in the sequence will attack you, so it's not quite as random as it looks. I forget the order now but at one point I had it memorized for the first 20-30 cubes or so, although counting them on the fly becomes difficult.

Yeah I began to notice some fairly consistent patterns myself before I finally cleared it. I was able to develop some extra tactics besides the standard fly-to-the-bomb-power-bar-and-cross-fingers technique that just about guarantee surviving the odds when coming with a standard stock of extra ships. I notice twice in this playthrough that they encounter one of the cube patterns which can be survived by simply flying to the top left of the screen and staying there. Interesting that they decided to fly around so much during those in particular; the player must have an extra keen grasp of where tracking cubes come in a particular pattern.

[Shepardus]

It could also be the absence of checkpoints in most of the series.

To be fair: recovering after a death outside of the final stretch is out of the question in II (arcade), it's much worse than every Gradius/R-Type game. The first arcade Darius (or Extra) might be possible, but it's still much harder to do than to just reset and play for as long as it takes to beat the game on the first life.

Yeah, that's true, but with the way the shield works in Darius you're usually already doing pretty poorly by the time you lose your first life. When you lose that life, you're not 1/3 of the way to game-over as the life count would suggest, but more like 90% as far as number of hits taken goes. The difficulty of recovering just accelerates that last 10%. It's annoying if you lose your life to a terrain collision before getting the gold shield, though. Speaking of which, I'm not much a fan of Darius's powerup mechanics - I get significantly more satisfaction from the choices and upgrades presented in Gradius and R-Type. Darius's powerup system is too gradual and too linear for my liking, and I don't like the powerup dodging you sometimes need to do to avoid "upgrading" to a less suitable shot.

[Kobayashi]

Love Gradius, R-Type and Darius, all great series, but Gradius deserves the first place. The great success of the first Gradius by Konami in 1985 certainly encouraged the release of the first Darius by Taito in 1986 (by the way, the name Darius was heavily taken from Gradius, because If you delete the "G" from "Gradius" and swap the position of the letters "R" and "D" = "Darius") and also the first R-Type by Irem in 1987. I wish to make clear that independently of who came first, I consider the Gradius series, in general, superior to Darius and R-Type series, so my vote here goes to Gradius. About Thunderforce series, I put it behind the other three mentioned.

[M.Knight]

Darius is easily my favorite classic hori series. Its music is fantastic and not afraid to venture into uncharted territory, the boss designs are full of personality and (in the later installments) full of cinematic appeal while being fun to fight, the levels are numerous and each episode feels quite different compared to the others.

The ocean theme also resonates with me more than the organic oppressive atmosphere of R-Type, or Gradius' very diverse yet not always cohesive environments. Introducing me to the coolest and cutest animal (the Giant Isopod) also helps.

I agree though that the power-up dodging in Gaiden (and Burst ACEX sometimes) is annoying though. Gradius and R-Type also clearly have an edge in terms of how the importance of weapon placement is conveyed to the player. I mean, while Darius' missiles can be very useful in the first installments and the ability to shoot through walls with the wave has to be exploited, it does not seem as clever as what you can do with Gradius options or the Force Pod.

[CIT]

Quite surprised to see all this Darius love! I'm sure a couple of years ago the result would have looked very different.

Not that I'm complaining, it's a great series and I've spent a lot of time with it (1CC'd every one except for G Darius). I absolutely adore Zuntata's music as well.

Still, I had to go with R-Type. Its core game mechanic still feels fresh and interesting, the level design is masterful, and it's the most consistently quality out of the four. Add to that its dark and gloomy style — I love it!

Not the biggest fan of Gradius. When it's good, it's REAL (II, Gaiden, V) good, but on a whole the series didn't evolve enough for me. Awesome music though.

Thunder Force IV and V are absolutely awesome and few things beat the fast gameplay combined with the rocking soundtrack. On top of that TFV has the best weapon in a shooter ever. However, on a whole the series is a bit uneven (II and VI are kind of meh, and I is just too prehistoric).