the best players on shmups.system11.org are....

[Shepardus]

I would nominate Perikles. I've never in my life seen someone destroy so many games as quickly as he has. He is literally clearing games on a daily basis, and with very good scores on top of that. Nobody on this forum even comes close to his output.

I wanted to say the same thing. He mostly plays older games so his achievements tend not to get as much recognition as those in CAVE and (Yagawa) Raizing games, but his proficiency is clear. And even though he says he's no good at more "modern" games, I'm sure he's got the skills to do great at those too if he really wanted to - he's already shown his skill at transitional 90s games like V-V and Strikers 1945 (during TRP-STGT). Few people pick up and master games at the rate he does, and in my mind the ability to learn quickly is one of the greatest skills to have.

[copy-paster]

I nominate Seahawk, his Parodius Da! arcade and Gradius III clear amazes me enough. The second is pegboy, his GIII with wait off and Salamander 2 ALL clear OMG!

[Rossyra]

I'm sure SuperPang derives no pleasure from his collection at all.

He has scores posted on AO by the way.

[Sakurei]

I nominate Chum

You people don't know but he's better than almost all of you. He has 'em mad dodging skills and some of his Great Fairy Wars scores are better than anything most people will ever get on this forum.

I like Chum.

EDIT: I was told and quickly confirmed chum is already on this list. So I guess this post is obsolete. Maybe, just maybe, I should have read the list and not just assumed he wasn't on there because he primarily plays 2hu.

[ProjectAKo]

chum is great at RPGMaker games

[CloudyMusic]

You people don't know but he's better than almost all of you. He has 'em mad dodging skills and some of his Great Fairy Wars scores are better than anything most people will ever get on this forum.

Chum has accomplished enough things in enough games that it's obvious even to people who know nothing about Touhou that he's an outstanding player. He gets a great deal of respect around here.

[yorgje]

i nominate zengeku

[Nameschonvergeben]

I nominate yorgje

[Jaimers]

A vote for me is a vote to make shmups great again.

[DMC]

China.

[The Armchair General]

I nominate myself because my mummy told me that im special and ive 1CCed a 2hu game on lunetic which is harder then futari ultra according to youtube comments.

But in all seriousness, I nominate Saucykobold because he has the community record for having the most community records (I think). Also his Raiden and Raiden II skills are amazing.

EDIT: replaced 'western' with 'community'.

[Captain]

I'd like to nominate Captain

Pros: Great justice, Gramar gud yes, Take off (your clothes)

Cons: Pay attention to backward

Spoiler

Jk I nominate BIL

[rjosal]

But in all seriousness, I nominate Saucykobold because he has the western record for having the most western records (I think).

Who has the Japan record for having the most western records?

[Nameschonvergeben]

But in all seriousness, I nominate Saucykobold because he has the western record for having the most western records (I think).

Who has the Japan record for having the most western records?

they're disqualified for not being scrubs

[pegboy]

ProjectAKO also deserves a special mention for his WORLD record on Sonic Wings 2. I believe he is the only non-Japanese player to own such a distinction (correct me if I'm wrong please).

[ProjectAKo]

But in all seriousness, I nominate Saucykobold because he has the western record for having the most western records (I think).

Who has the Japan record for having the most western records?

They took our record on fucking PIT FIGHTER. Why didn't anyone stop them? That's supposed to be our piece of shit game.

ProjectAKO also deserves a special mention for his WORLD record on Sonic Wings 2. I believe he is the only non-Japanese player to own such a distinction (correct me if I'm wrong please).

LordBBH has Shock Troopers (not really a shmup)
Gemant has Aliens (not really a shmup)
Chum has some of fairy wars records
Some guy took the extra stage WR in th8, somehow
Jaimers (and gimebe?) maybe have some WR in some mode of Eschatos? I don't really pay attention to new games.

That's all the others im aware of. But yeah apparently no one has gotten a "classic" shmup WR from gamest like sonic wings 2. And the reasons for that are 1) People are mostly playing super competitive games which the score is near impossible to beat, like Garegga. Taking a WR in these is gonna be almost impossible because they have 10 years of effort dumped into them. And 2) Most people aren't putting in that much effort.

If you check a site such as http://www.north-wind.ne.jp/~yoshino/ch ... D%EC%90%ED you can see the progression of Japanese scores over the years. In sonic wings 2 it took 12 months for them to get the WRs, and sure enough, with mame practice which is a little more efficient, it 'only' took me 10 months. In order to beat a WR you are probably gonna have to put in around the same amount of time as the holder put in, ESPECIALLY if you have no information on how it was gotten, like is the case with old games. That could mean 10 years for a garrega or cave score.

[Shepardus]

ProjectAKO also deserves a special mention for his WORLD record on Sonic Wings 2. I believe he is the only non-Japanese player to own such a distinction (correct me if I'm wrong please).

There are a couple others (NTSC-J w/ MMP Harahara, chum and Sakurei w/ their Touhou records, gimebe w/ Eschatos Original Hard), but it is rare, yes.

[KevinDDR]

Pretty sure Abschüssig has (or at the very least, recently had) the WR for Homura as well.

[ProjectAKo]

He did, but it was taken back after awhile. And Kino almost has the Cotton Boomerang score but I'm not sure if he gave up yet.

If people play lesser known games, the scores are not impossibly strong. They're also better games usually. (scientific fact)

[chum]

Cactu has the WR for EoSD, considering that Ichizoku is a pretty well known cheater at this point.

I've considered him a cheater for years due to his nonsensical playing and stiff, unskilled movements (hints at savestates use) not befitting of a player reaching such a score. there was a find in his replays that pretty much confirmed it if anyone ever had doubts. Since Cactu is just barely second place, that technically makes him the WR holder.

I consider him and Zil the most remarkable players, at least, when considering only mastery towards 1 game (PoDD in Zil's case). Getting solid scores in multiple games is one thing, a good deal of skill goes into doing such a thing over and over, but mastering one game is entirely different matter, a much more difficult process, so in most cases, players I consider most accomplished, have pushed one or several games past what can be considered "normal". Subjective, sure.

Both of them are absent.

I'm not sure about CAVE games, I've heard Pazzy's DOJ score is really good, but I'm not informed enough to tell. I can tell, however, that there are no Psikyo or Raizing scores that are at at that level of accomplishment on system11, possibly aside from KET's Chitta score.

[Eaglet]

possibly aside from KET's Chitta score.

Well no shit seeing as he's the wr holder.
Have a hard time seeing anyone outside of Japan ever getting a Chitta G.

As AKo mentioned earlier; with Garegga, all wr players have been at it since the 90's. That's at least 16 years of time playing the game.
They're all ridiculously high but Gain in particular is something I could never see anybody aside from Kamui beating. The mere thought is ridiculous.

[chum]

I thought the WR was G.79.

Also you shouldn't put someone like Kamui on a pedestal. It's been proven time and time again that new players can pop up and achieve unthinkable things in unthinkably little time. Remember that Kamui's work doesn't exist in a vacuum. Someone's 16 years of work means a new player has a lot of work already cut out for them. The theory is all teamwork after all.

[Eaglet]

From what I know, KET is the Chitta guy.

True, but in a game so based on knowledge and experience, both being the most skilled and knowledgeable gives you an upper hand that's too great to take over.
And honestly, if you don't see Kamui's standing with the game is this you need to play it more. For anyone with some experience you'll see just how big a difference in level it is. I could never bring myself to that level.

[chum]

From what I know, KET

Ahh. I meant just the highest score submitted on the forums.

And honestly, if you don't see Kamui's standing with the game is this you need to play it more. For anyone with some experience you'll see just how big a difference in level it is. I could never bring myself to that level.

My point is that doesn't matter as much as you say. She's not the only talented, capable or intelligent player. Such players can pop out from anywhere and it's more a question of how many are willing to put thousands of hours into Garegga (and playing Gain). Intellect is most important for an innovator, the more you can adopt from others, the more you can rely on time and effort to eventually reach a similarly deep understanding. Skill is complementary, and I doubt Kamui is the only super-skilled player ever...? I don't know Garegga, no, but I have seen enough for videogames on the whole to have faith in my opinion.

In addition, I'm wondering how long you expect these games to last. Is the fire gonna die out soon? If you assume that they're going to be alive for many, many years to come, then there are no immortal WRs... to my knowledge.

[Eaglet]

And that was kind of my point. There's probably something like sub 10 people in the world that can get a G with Chitta.


I do agree with that in general, but this game is pretty unique in that respect. And as long as Kamui plays it there's nobody that's gonna be able to come close.
The leap ahead is just too great.
I think all games that don't have a score cap and some RNG (so a theoretical "max" is almost impossible to achieve) will survive competitively for as long as people play them. Kind of their charm imo.

[vvv_stg]

My point is that doesn't matter as much as you say. She's not the only talented, capable or intelligent player. Such players can pop out from anywhere and it's more a question of how many are willing to put thousands of hours into Garegga (and playing Gain). Intellect is most important for an innovator, the more you can adopt from others, the more you can rely on time and effort to eventually reach a similarly deep understanding. Skill is complementary, and I doubt Kamui is the only super-skilled player ever...? I don't know Garegga, no, but I have seen enough for videogames on the whole to have faith in my opinion.

It's possible, but think about how little is the number of players who are both talented and dedicated, even in Japanese arcades. What is the chance that one of them will fall in love with playing Garegga as Gain in particular?

There are a lot of much weaker records in some very prominent games which still hold after many years because nobody got around to give them more attention than the most recent WR holder.

[chum]

Don't forget that in terms of time commitment, newer players have an advantage over older ones. As the bar rises and new information comes to light, new players will naturally become better quicker.

We'll just go around in circles if we let this one go on, I think. I see what you are both saying, I just don't think beating Kamui or anyone else sort of like her for a different game would be a totally hopeless pursuit.

I'm guilty of idolizing players myself sometimes but still they are human too and can be challenged

[Bananamatic]

I'm guilty of idolizing players myself sometimes but still they are human too and can be challenged

true, gus is pretty challenged

[Eaglet]

I think the first part of your argument is actually false, at least for this particular game.
Garegga is a game where tiny little details matter in a way that doesn't exist in a CAVE game.
Because of the randomness of the game (and what happens if you deviate even slightly from a planned route) you're gonna have to practice for an endless amount of different situations.
Because of this; the person who's put in more physical hours (qualitative of course) will ALWAYS have the advantage.

What I mean is that I would agree with you generally, but in the case of Garegga, we're talking about a person who's made it their life's work and pushed it harder than anybody's pushed any other modern stg.
If you can't see this difference you need to educate yourself more about the game.

[chum]

Sigh.

I'm disappointed. So you are also putting Garegga on such a pedestal. I'll reverse your statement, educate yourself more about other games. You sound obsessed, to be honest, and seeing you treat me like an idiot puts me in a pretty foul mood. I've played games that requires more and deeper on the fly thinking and actions than Garegga, easily. Different games have different quirks. so you should look at them as objectively as possible, this includes, for example, the amount of options given in actions and variables during gameplay, and the depth of each randomly generated situation, or the slight differences during each moment. You seriously think this is completely unique to Garegga...?

When considering such matters, you are only right that Garegga is different from every other game, but that is because every game is different from every other game.