Progressive 480p in RGB from PlayStation 2

[Seraphic]

If you have the choice pick a SFC unit without any banding.

I take it you mean be on the look out for a 1Chip-03.

I know, but the XSelect does this already.

The XSelect can turn any RGBHV, RGsB or RGBs input into RGBHV, RGsB or RGBs output?
Did not know that. Very cool!

Also, if I had a HD15 to JP21 or HD15 to MiniDin cable made I could feed all my analog sources into a XRGB-Mini from the XSELECT-D4, correct?
And with the upcoming HDMI pass-thru firmware for the Mini, seems I could also feed X360/PS3 HDMI sources into the Mini as well.
Sounds really cool, but is it a good idea?

[Fudoh]

I take it you mean be on the look out for a 1Chip-03

*I* would prefer a launch SFC over a banding-model anytime, If you check my screenshots you'll see that especially with scanlines in 720p mode on the Mini, a 1CHIP is not essential.

The XSelect can turn any RGBHV, RGsB or RGBs input into RGBHV, RGsB or RGBs output?

no, the output is fixed to RGBHV.

Also, if I had a HD15 to JP21 or HD15 to MiniDin cable made I could feed all my analog sources into a XRGB-Mini from the XSELECT-D4, correct?

do you want to use the Mini's RGB input ? I have no idea. The XRGB had problems with some systems when it's input was connected to the XSELECT's RGBHV output.

[Seraphic]

do you want to use the Mini's RGB input ?

Yes, yes I would. But since the Mini's RGB input only accepts RGBs, I would have to chain the XSELECT-D4 into Extron to convert the RGBHV to RGBs.
Should work then for both 15khz and 31khz I would think.

Does the mini allow you to mix video and audio sources? Like RGB input for video and the RCA audio jacks on the front for audio?

[Fudoh]

Should work then for both 15khz and 31khz I would think.

it should - and will - with the systems you listed, but other 16-bit systems might be more problematic.

Does the mini allow you to mix video and audio sources? Like RGB input for video and the RCA audio jacks on the front for audio?

not yet, no. If you use a cable from the Extron to the Mini, you need audio breakouts to connect to the XSELECT's audio output.

[blizzz]

I take it you mean be on the look out for a 1Chip-03

*I* would prefer a launch SFC over a banding-model anytime, If you check my screenshots you'll see that especially with scanlines in 720p mode on the Mini, a 1CHIP is not essential.

Launch model consoles have a nice image. 1CHIP consoles are sharper, but both are fine. There are also some rather bad revisions like the APU01 which drove me nearly crazy because I though the noise would be caused by PSU, cable or something else.

[Fudoh]

you're right, there're certainly terrible ones, but the question above was more like "1CHIP with banding or launch unit without banding"....

[mesmer]

One thing to note about the Extron RGB units: Not all of them remove the sync information from the green line. So if you are trying to do PS2 480p RGB with a monitor that does not support SoG, an Extron RGB unit will get you a csync signal (or H and V), but not necessarily clean the green signal. This might be ok if your non-SoG monitor "clamps on the back porch" (trying to remember viletims words there), but not all do that. If your monitor does not, you will still get a green tint on your screen.

Read those spec sheets carefully!

Example of what to watch out for:

Sync
Input type RGBHV, RGBS, RGsB (does not strip sync from video)

[jdubs]

Sorry to dig up this old(er) thread, but...

I'm thinking about a slim PS2 and was wondering if the following would work for both 15khz and 31khz output:

PS2 video output via SCART to a SCART to BNC Adapter to an Extron SS200 (strips sync off green) into my PVM-20L5 multi-sync monitor via RGBS from the SS200?

I've used the SS200 for sync combining with 480p signals from my 360 and MAME pc to great effect, already, and it SHOULD work, I think, in the above setup, too. Here's the spec sheet on the Extron:

http://www.extron.com/product/product.aspx?id=ss200

Any input would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks,
Jim

[Fudoh]

doesn't the PS2 work with all three resolutions (240p/480i/480p) on the 20L5 through a component connection ?

[jdubs]

doesn't the PS2 work with all three resolutions (240p/480i/480p) on the 20L5 through a component connection ?

The L5 works fine with component (that's how I have my WII hooked up), but would like to optimize video quality if possible. I know component is "close" to RGB but not right on top of it, image-wise....

-Jim

[Fudoh]

in theory, yes. But do you actually see any difference on the L5 ?

[jdubs]

in theory, yes. But do you actually see any difference on the L5 ?

Yeah, fair enough - probably not

But, I'm thinking they might be REALLY close if the RGB is RGsB. You're adding sync to color lines which component is also doing, right?

-Jim

[BazookaBen]

But, I'm thinking they might be REALLY close if the RGB is RGsB. You're adding sync to color lines which component is also doing, right?

-Jim

Dude, stick with component. Going through a processor just to get RGBS will just add noise to your signal.

Especially at 480p with the playstation in RGB color mode. Your monitor already does the job of pulling sync from the green line, and it's made by Sony.

[BuckoA51]

Bit of a thread necromancy but this should work:-

http://www.keene.co.uk/electronic/keene ... SBBOX.html

Expensive at £70 but easy plug and play and doesn't need raw sync input of course.

[werk91]

Another user here uses the Extron RGB 192 with the Sync Strike, but since the XSync-1 already has RCA audio output, it would be okay to use the 190FV I think.

Sorry for bumping an old thread. I'm going to be getting an Extron 192 to make use of the H-Shift. In theory a Scart to BNC (RGBS) cable should work to get the output of the Extron on a LCD TV with Scart right ?

The cable I have in mind is this one wired for "Output" :

Male RGBS break-out SCART to 4 x BNC .

I will be using also the Sync Strike and take the audio out of it. Since my attempts at using the screw terminals of the Sync Strike ended up in various problems I think this is a good way to go back to Scart and keep the local monitor output of the Extron 192 for connection to the GBS 8200.

Provided that both of those outputs on this Extron are active at the same time. Also why are those plastic screw terminal blocks the Extron range of hardware uses for power so hard to find ?

[FinalBaton]

My question concerns my monitor, but also the sync-on-green signal of the ps2's 480p rgb output, so I guess it kinda fits here *shrugs*


- Do the NEC monitors (XM/XV/XP - 29/37 etc)accept sync-on-green?

The below manual page hints at it, but I just really really want to make sure. Anyone tried this? I don't have a 480p ps2 game to try this

[BuckoA51]

This cable is a neater alternative to the sync strike and works great - https://www.retrogamingcables.co.uk/sca ... rch=extron

[werk91]

This cable is a neater alternative to the sync strike and works great - https://www.retrogamingcables.co.uk/sca ... rch=extron

The thing is I already have the sync strike and I want to connect the output of an Extron back to Scart enabled TV to make use of 1. the sync stripped signal 2. the h shift.

Last few times I tried ordering that cable (before I decided to get the sync strike) it kept saying out of stock and not letting me place the order too. I've ordered the one I linked to and I'm bidding on a Extron 190F so soon I'll know if it works. According to this it should:

SCART CONFIGURATION - OUTPUT
(For use with up-scalers which output R-G-B & SYNC via BNC connectors, or VGA to RGB down scalers such as the Extron range) Pin 2 - Audio Right (Output) Pin 6 - Audio Left (Output) Pin 20 - Composite video (Output)

[Fudoh]

The thing is I already have the sync strike and I want to connect the output of an Extron back to Scart enabled TV to make use of 1. the sync stripped signal 2. the h shift.

bit of an overkill, just to use a H-shift function. Doesn't your TV offer that on its own (through the service menu) ?

The cable works, but it does not provide a switching voltage. Many TVs require this though and won't switch into RGB mode unless pin 16 is provided with a power supply.

[werk91]

Fudoh, the other main thing I'm after is not swapping cables between the HDTV and the CRT monitor..
The normal menu has H shift only for the VGA input, how do I access the service menu?
The switching voltage on pin 16 is something I completely forgot about ><. Maybe I'll be lucky and it'll all work, otherwise at least the cable is easy to return. This setup is starting to be too expensive and I'll think about doing something completely different if I hit a block again

[werk91]

The thing is I already have the sync strike and I want to connect the output of an Extron back to Scart enabled TV to make use of 1. the sync stripped signal 2. the h shift.

bit of an overkill, just to use a H-shift function. Doesn't your TV offer that on its own (through the service menu) ?

The cable works, but it does not provide a switching voltage. Many TVs require this though and won't switch into RGB mode unless pin 16 is provided with a power supply.

I found this method of drawing power from the V sync : voltage from vsync



Could I possibly do this with the V sync BNC output of the Extron ?

[werk91]

Received the Extron unit and the cable yesterday, plugged it all in, Extron LED lights up green but all I get is a blank white,greyish picture on both Scart TVs.. I was reading on that Scart pin 16 and it seems there's a few options to drive it with 1v-3v so that my TV switches to RGB.

I will try the V sync from the syncstrike with two 100 ohm resistors again ( worked with the other cable I tried to hack ) first. If that doesn't work then I could try the same with the V sync BNC from the Extron. Some guides also seem to suggest using a +5V line from a USB cable connector. In hindsight I wish I just purchased the UMSA from ArcadeForge and be done with it but after investing in the cable and the Extron I want to try to make it work. Worse case scenario I will have to return the cable to RGC and get the UMSA.. but hopefully I can avoid spending more.

I also found another person who suggests that there is no need to bother with voltage and resistors at all if you just loop Pin 20 to Pin 16 on the Scart?? If this is possible does it mean that the Composite Sync signal carries voltage too? Any help will be very appreciated.

[Fudoh]

what I don't understand about the idea of supplying the switching voltage using the v-sync output is that the v-sync obviously drops to zero when there is nothing present on the screen. I would expect the TV to switch back to composite a lot when there are screen transitions or similar sync drops.

Composite video peaks at 1V at best, so I don't see how would work. A battery is still an easy solution.

[werk91]

The V sync method worked for me okay with some scenarios.. It was only the Wii that didn't sync properly. The new diagram I found recently suggests a capacitor between the resistors which I haven't tried either.

What you're saying about the composite signal is what I thought too.. I read about it here where there's a lot of discussions on that particular topic: http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=77370.0

As noted earler, I have a lot of success simply bridging SCART pin 20 (sync) -> SCART pin 16, and doing away with the 5v to pin 8 and the resistor bridge from pin 8 -> resistor -> 16 altogether. Simpler, neater, works (most of the time).

The battery solution is one I encountered too but I'm after something a bit more long lasting. Maybe a standard 5V 1A PSU ?

I have to decide whether I'm modding this cable or going for the UMSA solution as once I solder on it I doubt that RGC will accept it for refund The money I could get back from the cable purchase will roughly cover the UMSA minus the shipping from Germany.

[Unseen]

what I don't understand about the idea of supplying the switching voltage using the v-sync output is that the v-sync obviously drops to zero when there is nothing present on the screen. I would expect the TV to switch back to composite a lot when there are screen transitions or similar sync drops.

The idea of the RGB switch signal on the SCART connector was to allow an external device to add an overlay to a composite video signal, so the TV must be able to switch on a per-pixel basis. VSync works because it will always be high during the active parts of the image and the parts where it isn't aren't shown on screen anyway.

[werk91]

I will have to try to get the voltage from the V sync tonight with this Scart to BNC cable then. Dreading the same result with the Wii like before but hopefully it'll work.

Does anyone know how likely it is for a VGA to 5 BNC cable to be faulty? I got one from my office just to play a bit with the Extron 192F and there's nothing on the green channel no matter what I do. Hopefully I haven't got a faulty Extron as it was listed as brand new and looks it too.

[Fudoh]

I got one from my office just to play a bit with the Extron 192F and there's nothing on the green channel no matter what I do. Hopefully I haven't got a faulty Extron as it was listed as brand new and looks it too.

just switch around the plugs. E.g. connect the red BNC connector to the green output. This way you can easily if it's the cable or the interface.

[werk91]

what I don't understand about the idea of supplying the switching voltage using the v-sync output is that the v-sync obviously drops to zero when there is nothing present on the screen. I would expect the TV to switch back to composite a lot when there are screen transitions or similar sync drops.

The idea of the RGB switch signal on the SCART connector was to allow an external device to add an overlay to a composite video signal, so the TV must be able to switch on a per-pixel basis. VSync works because it will always be high during the active parts of the image and the parts where it isn't aren't shown on screen anyway.

Unseen, have you used the V sync to get 5V to Pin 16 before and if yes which method : 2 x 100 Ohm resistors or the chain of 1 Ohm resistor to 1N4148 to 100uF capacitor to 100 Ohm resistor ?

I got one from my office just to play a bit with the Extron 192F and there's nothing on the green channel no matter what I do. Hopefully I haven't got a faulty Extron as it was listed as brand new and looks it too.

just switch around the plugs. E.g. connect the red BNC connector to the green output. This way you can easily if it's the cable or the interface.

If I connect green from extron to red BNC what colour should the display show ?

[Fudoh]

If I connect green from extron to red BNC what colour should the display show ?

red. Output doesn't really matter. You're connecting to the RED input of your display, so whatever this channel receives is shown as red.

If you connect only ONE of the three RGB plugs, you can test all three cables (by changing the cable connections) and all three output ports (by changing the output port)

[werk91]

I figured what you meant soon after posting my reply It seems I won't be doing it anyway as I just tried the cable with a multimeter and there's nothing on the green cable Glad its not my Extron unit. On ebay there's two types of those cables : with 4 BNC and with 5. Does the 5 one do the job of the 4 one too ?