Cave x Steam teaser!

[Trevor spencer]

ill be buying this day one , id ideally like to make a steam PC for my cab with various CAVE and other shooters on so i dont have to board swap

Hoping to run it through a UVC for 240p , we'll see

[mastermx]

Great news! Mushi isn't my favorite and I already own this on my J360 but I'll buy the Steam version just to show support.

I find the first two stages of Mushi Original extremely boring. The 1.5 version is much better, imo, (especially on Max); you guys that haven't tried 1.5 are in for a treat I think.

You've got me really looking forward to 1.5 that everyone has been talking about. I have never tried mushi's 1.5 version before. I just don't understand what's special about it yet, I'll need to research about this version.

[Special World]

I like Mushi and I like Mushi 1.5 but to me 1.5 feels kinda like jamming Futari's system into a game that wasn't made for proximity scoring

it's not like there's anything wrong with it but it doesn't feel entirely as cohesive as Futari Original

that being said if you don't have Mushi and Mushi 1.5 this is pretty much a no-brainer purchase imo

[Cata]

Yup, I'm down for this. Especially if we can grab that 1.5 DLC

[awry]

A short video of gameplay is here:
https://twitter.com/cavegames/status/644488658028892160

[Skykid]

Based on Mushi HD

YESS!!!!!!! Thank god it wasn't Futari, I'm sick of that game.

So much this.

"Supporting a company" is a dumb mentality.

It's not up to the consumer to support the company; it's up to the company to produce what the consumer wants. It comes back to "if you like Mushihimesama, buy this; if not, don't".

You're a customer, not a charity worker. Cave are a company, not a homeless man in line at the soup kitchen. You buying a game from Cave should be seen as a transaction, not a donation.

Do you know how many times I've said the exact same thing on this forum?

The height of ultra-consumerist folly was the 'double-dipping' for an identical port on a different platform, just to "support the developer".

I love Cave to bits, one of the greatest devs of all time - but it's up to them to deliver what I want to pay for. I bought all their PCBs, all their LE 360 releases, and then it got to a point where even heavier milks and regurgitation began.

I never want the company to go under, but they had a lengthy 360 period where they produced a total of zero new games. Output slowed right down to near dead, compared to previous years where they occasionally turned out two products in 12 months. Offering up Instant Brain was probably the nadir.

I want new shmups. Akai Katana and SDOJ were blips in the heavyweight milking - and I bought those games - but the rest of the time we were thumb-twiddling while they tried to get their act together and release new and relevant material, eventually following a business strategy that basically capsized them, and nobody agreed with.

But we live in an age of hardcore materialistic, consumerist, relief-through-retail doctrine. And a lot of people will spend just because.

$30 for Mushi 1.5? Not for me. I have it in the other room. The portability and ease of steam is attractive, but I'll buy it when the first sale appears. I wouldn't feel comfortable spending more than half that figure.

[Muchi Muchi Spork]

No you're skipping the PC ports the way lots of others like myself skipped the X360. I own most of the PCBs (owned them all at one point) and would like to have good ports of all the games to PC. Don't care to own an X360.

[Skykid]

No you're skipping the PC ports the way lots of others like myself skipped the X360. I own most of the PCBs (owned them all at one point) and would like to have good ports of all the games to PC. Don't care to own an X360.

I'm not skipping these ports, I'll just be selective and wait for price cuts. For me they're very convenient - I am in a foreign country now and don't even have my 360. There are some Cave games I would still love to finish business with.

I wanted the 360 version arrange modes and pack-in extras, so no regrets. And I don't have every PCB, so things like Pink Sweets, DFK BL and Akai Katana filled gaps.

But another $30 for the steam version? I feel they've overpriced it to be honest.

[Icarus]

$30 for Mushi 1.5? Not for me.

Wait, how much?
You can get Crimzon Clover for less than half that, and CC is the superior game in every aspect to boot.
I guess Cave really do know how to fleece their fans.

[Shepardus]

I'm not sure where people are getting $30 from, the base game is $20 and they haven't stated the price of the 1.5 DLC yet (though to be fair $10 does seem likely).

[Bananamatic]

more like crimzon clover for $10 was extremely underpriced
it's worth $20 at least

[Cee]

$20 with free dlc for pre orders would be a fair deal, otherwise forget it $30 is taking the piss.

[Squire Grooktook]

From any other place, I'd understand this sentiment...

...but this is the same forum that advised me to buy a Japanese 360 just for Cave leader-board replays. I think 15-20 dollars for the main game and 10 extra for a dlc that re-arranges the whole thing is kind of a step down from 80 dollar imports.

[Eaglet]

Yeah, I agree with you Banana.

The main problem here is that this has nothing to do with principles or a company trying to fleece their fans.
This has everything to do with the biggest fucking name in the modern incarnation of the genre actually not making fucktarded decisions and doing what they should've done years ago while at the same time opening up for the largest possible influx of new players in years.

20 or 30$ ain't shit. It's literally the price of a dinner on town. Stay in one night of the month and support the Damn genre. I can't for the life of me see how this is even an issue here.

It's a simple equation:
Steam release + economic success = more releases, more new players, more exposure for the genre and a possible future.

[monouchi]

Yeah, I agree with you Banana.

The main problem here is that this has nothing to do with principles or a company trying to fleece their fans.
This has everything to do with the biggest fucking name in the modern incarnation of the genre actually not making fucktarded decisions and doing what they should've done years ago while at the same time opening up for the largest possible influx of new players in years.

20 or 30$ ain't shit. It's literally the price of a dinner on town. Stay in one night of the month and support the Damn genre. I can't for the life of me see how this is even an issue here.

It's a simple equation:
Steam release + economic success = more releases, more new players, more exposure for the genre and a possible future.

This.

[z0mbie90]

Yeah so much this. Comeon most people pay 25-30$ for shitty indie early access games that mostly never gonna be finsihed.
People pay 60+ for the 360 version, why wouldnt they be able to take 20-30$ for a steam release. They need the money.

[Cee]

They need the money.

Not my problem they're a company so if they need money it's their duty to create desirable content, promote said content and finally charge an appropriate price the majority of those interested are willing to pay. It's a company not a charity.

[Satan]

Produce new Cave content, maintain a high standard and I'll happily give them my money - just don't try to fuck me.
If Cave put out 20 new games and DLC every year on PC I'd happily buy them all.

[Squire Grooktook]

They need the money.

Not my problem they're a company so if they need money it's their duty to create desirable content, promote said content and finally charge an appropriate price the majority of those interested are willing to pay. It's a company not a charity.

It is a charity when the genre is so niche that only hardcore fans have the slightest interest in playing it.

A shmup dev could create the best games in the universe and they'd still be struggling against bankruptcy at every possible moment.

Spoiler

Hopefully with Steam and digital distribution, things will change and they'll just be niche instead of super niche soon...

[Shepardus]

more like crimzon clover for $10 was extremely underpriced
it's worth $20 at least

Agreed, CC:WI is a steal at its current price. And besides, what does the price of Crimzon Clover have anything to do with the price of Mushihimesama? Cho Ren Sha 68k is free and it's better than pretty much every other game in existence but I'm not about to argue that all games should be free.

If you're double-dipping I can see why $20 might be a bit much for a game you already have, but if this is your first time buying and playing the game $20 is perfectly reasonable, if not low. When the game was initially released it costed more than that and it isn't any worse of a game now just because it's older.

[Special World]

I don't think anyone has an obligation to double dip on this to support the genre. I do think that anybody who doesn't already own it would do themselves a service to play it, though. I don't really like PC gaming much, and I can't see myself re-buying anything except Futari Black and/or a new game on Steam.

Neither position is some woeful indignity. If somebody who doesn't own the game asked my opinion, I'd recommend it wholeheartedly. It's a great game. I do think that Degica should just bundle all the content together for a Steam-premium $20 price though. That's a decision that would highlight a really consumer-centric ethos on their part, and would make all the games seem more rich in content.

[STG4WD]

It's a simple equation:
Steam release + economic success = more releases, more new players, more exposure for the genre and a possible future.

Works for me.

What else can the members of this forum do to push the game (and genre) when this launches?

I'm thinking like...

- Positive Steam reviews

- Twitch Streaming

- Beginners' guides

etc...

Blackbird, any other action requests??

[cave hermit]

god damn it you people will throw hundreds of dollars at PCBs like it's nothing, but suddenly $20 or so is too much?

[Zen]

This thread is turning into a real bummer, man.
Cave finally on pc (and Steam no less, with all the support that entails) and some people are airing their "issues" with a $20-$30 price tag?
There seems to be a real love hate thing going on here.
No import/region bullshit. No console nightmares (4 broken 360s here). No corp. fees for updates (remember them?) Digitally yours forever. Super accessible. Happy-happy, smiley-smiley, no?
There is an element of "fuck Cave", to all this and its not because of $20-$30.
I hate to be the that guy, who calls for a little perspective but really? . . . fuck off!
Congratulations to Blackbird and team. Finally some chaps doing, rather than bitching and moaning.

[PROMETHEUS]

I am really happy about this, I think Mushihimesama is a great choice for a first release on steam. Though Futari would be the prefered choice for many in the end, Mushi does have amazing art which I would say is slightly better overall : graphics & sound effects especially, also music to an extent. 20$ with pay-DLC sound good to me. I think it's perfect. I don't see a problem with that price, a lot of games that have a lot less work on art or gameplay/level design are sold for that price or more sometimes aren't they? You don't have to buy it if you prefer playing the game on other systems. I will buy it and likely try my hands @ultra mode. I don't know 1.5 well for having tried it only a couple times but sure sounds like something that should be available shortly after the 1.0 is released because the one grief a lot of people have against Mushi is the exaggeratingly difficult (physically) rythm button taping system for scoring which I believed was removed or simplified in 1.5 and that was just a good choice I guess!

You know, when I think of Mushi one of the sounds that remind me of its awesome general art level is the death sound of Reco. When you compare it to Futari you get the spell of Mushihimesama over Futari in atmosphere. But of course Futari is very high quality overall as well, Mushi just was a bit more exceptionnal or I should say, harmonious, in that regard.

[Special World]

god damn it you people will throw hundreds of dollars at PCBs like it's nothing, but suddenly $20 or so is too much?

I suspect everyone saying they don't want to pay $20-30 are people who already own the game. And there's nothing wrong with not wanting to throw money on top of a game you already own that you payed $90 (or even a couple thousand or whatever a pcb costs). There's no shame in that, and there's no obligation to "support" a company. We already did that when we bought the game the first time.

That being said, I don't see any reason to complain about it. $30 is a perfectly fine price, though I think a flat $20 including 1.5 would do more for expanding the game's audience and establishing Mushi as a feature-rich, full, premium game.

[Xyga]

god damn it you people will throw hundreds of dollars at PCBs like it's nothing, but suddenly $20 or so is too much?

Can't be helped, haters gonna hate whatever the circumstances. I agree they can just;

. . . fuck off!

[DoomsDave]

I'm double dipping strictly for convenience. I love Cave but agree with the argument that we shouldn't need to give them pity support. If Cave wants to stay alive, it's on them. Make something I want and I'll but it. I also pirated the 1.5 DLC because my copy didn't come with it and there was no way for me to buy it so I guess I owe them something for that.

I think $20/30 is fine but that's because I'm a fan of the game and the genre. I don't think it's a great price as a business decision though. It's too high for casuals browsing and people who have never heard of the game will just see it as some obscure Japanese arcade game and compare it to more well known shooters like Ikaruga, Jamestown, Sine Mora etc which pretty much all start at $10 and down. Eschatos is going to be $15 and that has "shiny 3D graphics." We all obviously know there's a lot more to it but casuals won't, but it's going to take some very good marketing for mushi to sell well on release.

[z0mbie90]

Im not speaking to people that already have the PCB or 360 ports. You don't have to double buy the games, It's all up to you.
But if you dont own the games, like me. I only have the DDP-DFK 360 port. I don't see 20-30$ to be expensive, I can see of you own the game that you maybe don't wanna
buy it again, but its all up to you. That's what I meant. Don't own the game? Then shut up about price, it's not that expensive for a game. Already own the games? Well shut up you don't have to buy it if you don't wanna. So stop complaining.

[Squire Grooktook]

I love Cave but agree with the argument that we shouldn't need to give them pity support. If Cave wants to stay alive, it's on them.

I agree with everything else, but I think it's important to remind people that this is simply not true.

Cave is an stg developer. That's probably the most unprofitable market to be in in the entirety of the medium. They could make the greatest games in history and still go bankrupt. It is not on them. There is nothing they can do, or at least not immediately, to make the genre more profitable.