Shmup Related Questions That Don't Deserve a Thread

[ACSeraph]

I like most of Psikyo's games, the first Gunbird is beautiful, Sengoku Ace is stylish and very accessible, and Sengoku Blade is also really epic.

[Kollision]

I'm convinced I'll never be able to get into a vertical STG...all the games I seem to be able to get into and able to clear are horizontals. Can someone recommend an easy to get into vertical shmup for me? I've tried dragon spirit and the bombing element seemed like too much to adjust to for me (paired with the vertical orientation). I'd really prefer a game without a chaining element to learn the ropes. Thanks in advance!

Rapid Hero.

agree with trap
I have recently cleared it with very little effort
it's a cool game, nice dodging fun without too much of a hassle, kinda like Psikyo without rank

[EmperorIng]

In your opinions, which port of Kyukyoku Tiger/Twin Cobra is more enjoyable, or playable - i.e. the "better port" - MD/Genesis or PC-Engine? Arcade accuracy is not the issue here, but rather, what carries the "feel" of the game into its new format the best?

[dink]

I like most of Psikyo's games, the first Gunbird is beautiful, Sengoku Ace is stylish and very accessible, and Sengoku Blade is also really epic.

Oh yea. I massively <3 Tengai / Sengoku Blade. respect.

[dink]

In your opinions, which port of Kyukyoku Tiger/Twin Cobra is more enjoyable, or playable - i.e. the "better port" - MD/Genesis or PC-Engine? Arcade accuracy is not the issue here, but rather, what carries the "feel" of the game into its new format the best?

I like both games for different reasons, each version has its quirks & benefits and there are too many of them to list. Sometimes I like to play the md version, others I like the pce version. Each seems to have different music. The pce version has shot sfx, but seems to have less vertical screen realestate. the md-version seems less visually detailed, but it doesn't take away from its playability at all. My opinion: get both

[LordHypnos]

Add Triggerheart Exelica to my earlier list of games that have no enemy collision damage. Vasara-style collision, specifically (bounce-away from aerial enemies)

The complete list:

No Samurai / Sengoku Ace? It's partial (item carriers, the rival ninja subbosses, not zako) but still in there.

Okay, will do. I remembered crashing into enemies and dying in Sengoku Ace. What are rival ninja subbosses...? it's been a while since I've played. Maybe I'll just go ahead and boot up MAME and check it out

Also Sol Divide

How does it work in this one? Do you just power down like in Gunbird?

I've played Dragon Blaze and like that game. Besides that, what are the best games by Psikyo?

Other people have suggested good choices, but don't forget about Zero Gunner 2! The rotation mechanic makes it pretty different from earlier games (apart from Cannon Spike), though it still feels very Psikyo. Most of the pre Dragon Blaze stuff plays pretty similarly, mechanically, apart from minor tweaks such as how secondary weapons charge and GB2 having a melee and a charge attack for each character rather than one or the other.

You can kind of see the gameplay gradually change over time, so it's probably a good idea to check out later ones (like Gunbird 2) in addition to earlier ones (like Gunbird).

[endoKarb]

Also Sol Divide

How does it work in this one? Do you just power down like in Gunbird?

There's no penalty for touching enemies in Sol Divide, unless they are attacking. You can pass through smaller enemies, while bigger ones block you way.

If you touch a big enemy from behind or from an awkward angle, it does this weird thing where it throws you back toward the left edge of the screen at an high speed. Looks pretty silly.

Most of the pre Dragon Blaze stuff plays pretty similarly, mechanically, apart from minor tweaks such as how secondary weapons charge and GB2 having a melee and a charge attack for each character rather than one or the other.

This is only true to a point. Older Psikyo games are a lot rougher compared to their more recent output, often having no scoring system, poorly designed second loops, weird pacing, no real "dodging" (not in a danmaku sense of the word) and being frequently more unfairly punishing then actually challenging. Of course that can be part of the charm depending on one's taste.

[LordHypnos]

Most of the pre Dragon Blaze stuff plays pretty similarly, mechanically, apart from minor tweaks such as how secondary weapons charge and GB2 having a melee and a charge attack for each character rather than one or the other.

This is only true to a point. Older Psikyo games are a lot rougher compared to their more recent output, often having no scoring system, poorly designed second loops, weird pacing, no real "dodging" (not in a danmaku sense of the word) and being frequently more unfairly punishing then actually challenging. Of course that can be part of the charm depending on one's taste.

I agree with this, but I think they are mechanically similar in the sense that you're dealing with a shot, a bomb, and some sort of charge and/or melee attack. Additionally there's design factors like relatively short levels and multi phase bosses (and this stays consistent all the way to ZG2). You can see them tweaking the gameplay and level design outside of that, though, for sure. This is why I think that it's important to try multiple games (particularly looking at later as well as earlier ones) in spite of the fact that they might on the surface feel very similar.

[BIL]

In your opinions, which port of Kyukyoku Tiger/Twin Cobra is more enjoyable, or playable - i.e. the "better port" - MD/Genesis or PC-Engine? Arcade accuracy is not the issue here, but rather, what carries the "feel" of the game into its new format the best?

Never played the PCE version, but FWIW... I have Toaplan Shooting Battle and an ongoing love/hate with the MD port. It really doesn't play like the AC at all, on account of the brutally crash-zoomed playfield. It has a much more dramatic effect than the "fake tate" of ports like Same Same or Slap Fight's. Enemy formations that'd scroll into view upscreen now appear right in your face, fast bullets flying (st2's opening gunboat area is a dramatic example). On one hand it makes things very intense and spontaneous-feeling, on the other it tends to enforce brute memorisation not found in the AC version. Much easier to get broadsided by stuff you'd have been able to anticipate and plan around in AC. Thankfully, it avoids the cardinal sin of chopped ports by keeping offscreen enemies inactive until they're in view (unlike, say, FM Towns Hishouzame, where you're constantly exchanging fire with unseen enemies in the phantom space above your monitor).

I've bought, sold and am now considering buying it again... there is a unique raw appeal in its nose-to-nose terror, especially with the astonishingly violent explosion SFX and beefed-up soundtrack. It's undoubtedly a port brutalised into something else entirely, though. Booting up TSB afterward feels downright civilised. ^_~

[Perikles]

In your opinions, which port of Kyukyoku Tiger/Twin Cobra is more enjoyable, or playable - i.e. the "better port" - MD/Genesis or PC-Engine? Arcade accuracy is not the issue here, but rather, what carries the "feel" of the game into its new format the best?

I'd have to go with the MD port. It's a refreshingly brutal game that doesn't respect your feelings at all, extremely claustrophobic boss fights included. On the flip side, checkpoint recovery is much more balanced than in the PCE port, and so is the final boss. If you die against the final boss in the PCE port it gets nail-bitingly tough to come back, especially on higher loops; and not in a desirable manner in my opinion. MD Kyuukyoku Tiger is very sportsmanlike in its ferociousness, it takes pride in wiping you out over and over again, whereas the PCE port is not nearly as tense most of the time, but gets downright cheap once it kills you off once. And as BIL was saying, the MD's soundtrack and sound effects are great!

[BIL]

Had to let MD Tiger (and SFC Gradius III) back into my collection after your recent posts, Perikles. Refreshingly brutal should've been its cover blurb.

Also, best explosion sound effects in the genre. Concussive. Letting the blue spread rip on a pack of zako choppers is like frickin bubblewrap. Helluva power chord + kick drum sound as well, Tecno Soft-rivalling. Same sound guys (GRC) who worked on Battle Mania 2, I believe.

Yuge: I can tell you what I think Uemura's most representative work is.

Uemura: Which? TSUGARU? (laughs)

Yuge: Yeah, that's the one. Its the best. (laughs)

ESPECIALLY MD VER

The whole MD soundtrack is so goddamn rugged.

[Perikles]

I feel honoured that I was able to convince a delicate connoisseur like yourself, that sweetens my day indeed.

To incorporate at least something relevant regarding the topic: what the hell where the developers of Legion (PCE CD) thinking when they made that final stage? The hit detection is all kind of wonky and the bullets are literally too fast to be properly dodged (you either have to kill the enemies before they get a chance to fire or you have to have a shield in order to tank the damage), and they actually thought it'd be a good idea to sandwich you in tight corridors with way too many enemies and constant laser beams, all the while those doors open and close? I've cleared some tough 16-bit shooters, but this is borderline unbearable. If you die near the beginning of the stage your credit is pretty much done for - all your hard work in vain because of some ludicrous design choices. I'm going to have a lot of fun figuring out this prick of a stage.

[xxx1993]

I don't know if asking a question about Metal Slug is related to shmups, but not counting the Metal Slug Wiki, is there proof that Metal Slug 5 is chronologically the final installment of the series? How are 6 and 7/XX prequels?

[copy-paster]

I don't know if asking a question about Metal Slug is related to shmups, but not counting the Metal Slug Wiki, is there proof that Metal Slug 5 is chronologically the final installment of the series? How are 6 and 7/XX prequels?

Because for it's new bad guys and the dissapearance of General Morden and his Rebel Armies

MS6 takes place between 3 and 4
MS7 takes place after 4/5 ?

[xxx1993]

I don't know if asking a question about Metal Slug is related to shmups, but not counting the Metal Slug Wiki, is there proof that Metal Slug 5 is chronologically the final installment of the series? How are 6 and 7/XX prequels?

Because for it's new bad guys and the dissapearance of General Morden and his Rebel Armies

MS6 takes place between 3 and 4
MS7 takes place after 4/5 ?

I heard that Metal Slug 6 takes place after Metal Slug 3 and that Metal Slug 7 takes place after 4 and before 5... Is that true?

[NineThousand]

I'm new at Shmups and I've been playing Daifukkatsu black label and futari on and off.

In Daifukkatsu black label I tend to play Type A and I can't seem to find playthroughts of people playing with Type A,
why is that?

[Squire Grooktook]

Does everyone have a list of the differences between World and Japan versions of R-Type Leo? IIRC there was more to it than just option control and checkpoint handling?

[Skykid]

Does everyone have a list of the differences between World and Japan versions of R-Type Leo? IIRC there was more to it than just option control and checkpoint handling?

I think that's everything.

[xxx1993]

I don't know if asking a question about Metal Slug is related to shmups, but not counting the Metal Slug Wiki, is there proof that Metal Slug 5 is chronologically the final installment of the series? How are 6 and 7/XX prequels?

Because for it's new bad guys and the dissapearance of General Morden and his Rebel Armies

MS6 takes place between 3 and 4
MS7 takes place after 4/5 ?

I heard that Metal Slug 6 takes place after Metal Slug 3 and that Metal Slug 7 takes place after 4 and before 5... Is that true?

Well, no one's going to tell me if Metal Slug 5 really is the final installment?

[Pretas]

Well, no one's going to tell me if Metal Slug 5 really is the final installment?

There's no official timeline, but going on developer comments and basic observation of what transpires in each game, it's probably 1 -> 2/X -> 3 -> 6 -> 7/XX -> 4 -> 5.

[xxx1993]

Are you sure? Is that what the developers really said?

[Skykid]

^ Don't take this the wrong way, but why do you care? Metal Slug isn't exactly known for its intricate plotting. It's just bearded hostages and a bunch of alien cannon fodder.

It's not a shmup either.

[pokemon123]

going to sound dumb but besides suicide bullets do the loops of ketsui actually have any different bullet patterns?

[Shepardus]

You mean between the first and second loop, or between omote and ura loops? Between the first and second loops the difference should be obvious but I'm not sure about omote and ura, they look about the same to me except for the suicide bullets.

[pokemon123]

yep omote and ura. hmm well that's okay I guess.

[Bananamatic]

ura has faster bullets from everything

[DestroyTheCore]

How do I deal damage to the boss during the 2nd stage of Ginga Force? Destroying the groups of robots that go down the screen only decreases the life gauge from time to time.

[Giest118]

How do I deal damage to the boss during the 2nd stage of Ginga Force? Destroying the groups of robots that go down the screen only decreases the life gauge from time to time.

The light drones, when you shoot them, will shine light on the boss briefly. That light is what damages the boss (because you're trying to break its stealth, basically).

So basically don't destroy the lights, just "switch" them.

[xxx1993]

^ Don't take this the wrong way, but why do you care? Metal Slug isn't exactly known for its intricate plotting. It's just bearded hostages and a bunch of alien cannon fodder.

It's not a shmup either.

I just wanna know, because at first I thought they were rumors. But the chronology is confusing. Also, I do consider Metal Slug and Contra to be shmups, even though it's mostly on foot.

[Skykid]

^ Don't take this the wrong way, but why do you care? Metal Slug isn't exactly known for its intricate plotting. It's just bearded hostages and a bunch of alien cannon fodder.

It's not a shmup either.

I just wanna know, because at first I thought they were rumors. But the chronology is confusing. Also, I do consider Metal Slug and Contra to be shmups, even though it's mostly on foot.

They're not shmups, they're Run & Guns. Different genre.