Gameboy Advance RGB NTSC

[blizzz]

No progress that I'm aware of. There's a page on the bug tracker for this: https://code.google.com/p/swiss-gc/issues/detail?id=120

[bobrocks95]

Since the patching for the disc was basically a quick hack, it might be a while before it works from the SD slot. But hopefully soon, as I'd never have to switch Gamecube discs again (play all my GC games on the Wii)!

[Kyle]

I wonder if we could start a collection for the dev. I'd throw $20 at this.

[Arasoi]

.

[Xan]

I'm looking to get a SGB2, can anyone tell me how it compares to this 240p GBP solution (for original GB games obviously)?

[bobrocks95]

It won't have the occasional frameskip, it will have custom borders, and sound quality will probably be better. It's better all around, except for the unfortunate lack of GBC support.

[blizzz]

The refresh rate of Gameboys (both original and advance) is said to be 59.7275 Hz. The SGB runs at ~61.17fps and the SGB2 runs at ~61.09fps. source

I can confirm that there is stutter on the SGB2 on a CRT, as you would expect from the numbers.

I've seen the numbers for the Gameboy Player somewhere, but I can't find them at the moment. I think it was 59.94 Hz in 480i/p and a bit lower in 240p mode. Would be nice if someone could find them.

[bobrocks95]

That's interesting, running at the SNES' clock rate makes sense. I've never seen a soul complain about frame drops on the SGB2 during normal play though, whereas there's tons of complaining about the Gameboy Player. I would think it would be much more pronounced, since it's further off than the Gameboy Player.

Either way, you'd still get custom borders/SGB-exclusive features for games that had them, and better sound quality (supposedly the GBP takes analog audio generated by the GB hardware in it, converts to digital to interface with the Gamecube, then converts back to analog for output).

[Xan]

Well, how many people outside of Japan do have SGB2s as compared to GBPs?

The exclusive borders on SGB/SGB2 are definitely a nice touch, always found it silly the GBP omitted those (not as silly as having to load a boot disc however...). Another advantage is that it's pretty much usable right away, while for the GBP either a GBA with link cable or an expensive Hori Digital controller is needed; as good as it is otherwise, I find the GC pad useless for GBP usage.

[bobrocks95]

Another option would be to buy this adapter to make the GBP experience a bit closer to the SGB's (since you have to use it for Color and Advance games): http://www.raphnet-tech.com/products/sn ... /index.php

[Sixfortyfive]

When I try to launch it it says "Failed to find necessary functions for patching" and I only get a black screen. Any ideas what I'm doing wrong?

You ever find a fix for this issue? I'm getting the same when I try to load an ISO for the GBP start-up disc (US console, US ISO).

This might have to wait until my mom can mail me my old disc...

[blizzz]

No. It seems like Swiss would need an update to start the iso without the original disc.

[Sixfortyfive]

I had some time to kill today, so I decided to test the timing differences on various GB hardware myself.


Stuff used:
- US SNES-101 w/ JP SGB2
- US GCN w/ US GBP (running at 480p)
- US GBA
- US Super Mario Land


Stutter:

- The Super Game Boy 2 repeats a single frame at regular intervals. Every 161st frame is a duplicate of the one that precedes it.

- The Game Boy Player also repeats frames, but more erratically and severely. About 4 to 5 seconds will play normally, then there will be a burst of 5 to 8 duplicate frames in less than half a second.


Overall speed:

- The Super Game Boy 2 runs at 100.188% the speed of the Game Boy Advance. This means that if you start the same game on the GBA and the SGB2 at the same time, and then play them in the exact same manner, you'd finish on the SGB2 slightly faster. I've heard that the SGB1 is much less accurate and runs considerably faster.

- The Game Boy Player runs at exactly the same speed as the Game Boy Advance. If there is a difference, the GBP is still more than 99.999% accurate to the GBA's speed.

(I'd be interested in knowing if the GB/GBC run at a slightly different speed than the GBA, but I no longer have an old GB to test.)


Input lag:

- I don't have the means to actually measure this, but the lag on the Game Boy Player definitely seems more pronounced than that of the Super Game Boy 2.

[Xan]

I got my SGB2 in, and testing with Mega Man 1 I thought the stutter was quite bad, but it seems in that case it is game related. With Metroid 2 it only happens every few seconds as expected. Can't notice the speed difference really.

For classic GB games (sans those with good custom GBC palettes), compared to GBC/GBA based solutions, an advantage is perhaps being able to select color patterns on the fly, and not just on startup. That way it's easy to determine which pattern is appropriate, and also possible to switch patterns per level (blue in Ice Man stage, red in Fire Man stage as an example). From what I know there aren't that many color hacks for GB games yet, so this is probably the best solution for the time being.

[blizzz]

Took some screenshots today from the GP Player in 240p mode. The output rate was 59.83Hz if I remember correctly. Not too far away from the 59.73Hz of an original GBA.









A couple more pics here if anyone is interested: https://blz.la/rgb/gallery.html

[Smashbro29]

Took some screenshots today from the GP Player in 240p mode. The output rate was 59.83Hz if I remember correctly. Not too far away from the 59.73Hz of an original GBA.



A couple more pics here if anyone is interested: https://blz.la/rgb/gallery.html

Maybe they could make a cheat code that allows widescreen? GBA is technically widescreen.

I'd like widescreen Gameboy player with the game taking as much of the screen as possible while maintaining the proper ratios.

[bobrocks95]

Doing some quick calculations, those pictures are 20 pixels off from being 3:2, which is the ratio of the GBA's screen. I don't remember ever hearing anything about the GBP being the wrong aspect ratio, it looks fine to me...

[Smashbro29]

Doing some quick calculations, those pictures are 20 pixels off from being 3:2, which is the ratio of the GBA's screen. I don't remember ever hearing anything about the GBP being the wrong aspect ratio, it looks fine to me...

It's the correct ratio but I'd want the correct ratio in widescreen.

I'd be able to make the important part larger.

[Ed Oscuro]

It's the correct ratio but I'd want the correct ratio in widescreen.

I'd be able to make the important part larger.

I am confused by your posts. Correct ratio but not? What's the important part?

[Smashbro29]

It's the correct ratio but I'd want the correct ratio in widescreen.

I'd be able to make the important part larger.

I am confused by your posts. Correct ratio but not? What's the important part?

This is what I get for posting after my bedtime.

Right now the software only allows a 4:3 picture, I think it would be beneficial to somehow hack in a 16:9 mode so we can have the actual game part of the screen be bigger and more prominent.

[Xan]

If I recall this correctly, Gamecube is limited to outputting 640x480. If it would output 720x480, the GBA's 240x160 output would actually fit perfectly... of course integer scaling would only be possible in 480i/480p modes.

[bobrocks95]

Yeah, the Gamecube uses anamorphic widescreen, so any widescreen games were just rendering more in the same resolution, which TV's then stretch into what appears to be a widescreen picture (which works nicely, but the resolution is still 4:3). It wouldn't be possible to change that unfortunately.

[Smashbro29]

Yeah, the Gamecube uses anamorphic widescreen, so any widescreen games were just rendering more in the same resolution, which TV's then stretch into what appears to be a widescreen picture (which works nicely, but the resolution is still 4:3). It wouldn't be possible to change that unfortunately.

I knew that, anamorphic is fine if it's done right.

[blizzz]

You're right, the aspect ratio is 20px off in the pictures. Maybe Nintendo compensated for some overscan on CRTs that stretch the picture a few percent horizontally?

The picture is 467x320px big by default. It should be 480x320px. If you want to make it bigger, the next integer step would be 700x480 / 720x480. This is (obviously) too big for 3:2 mode and Nintendo would also have to abandon the border. In anamorphic 16:9 they could have made the game 540x480px big, but this would only work on widescreen TVs that display the whole picture. 99% of the TVs of that time wouldn't be able to show the whole game on screen.

[Smashbro29]

You're right, the aspect ratio is 20px off in the pictures. Maybe Nintendo compensated for some overscan on CRTs that stretch the picture a few percent horizontally?

The picture is 467x320px big by default. It should be 480x320px. If you want to make it bigger, the next integer step would be 700x480 / 720x480. This is (obviously) too big for 3:2 mode and Nintendo would also have to abandon the border. In anamorphic 16:9 they could have made the game 540x480px big, but this would only work on widescreen TVs that display the whole picture. 99% of the TVs of that time wouldn't be able to show the whole game on screen.

But I was thinking if someone managed to do some cheat code trickery we could nix borders altogether, make anamorphic 16:9 and make the game as big as possible while retaining the aspect ratio.

Focus on the important part, you know?

[blizzz]

But then you would need 480i/p and you wouldn't get scanlines. At that point you could also just use an emulator and get a sharper picture, less input lag and no framerate conversion.

[Smashbro29]

But then you would need 480i/p and you wouldn't get scanlines. At that point you could also just use an emulator and get a sharper picture, less input lag and no framerate conversion.

I've had a PS1 game do fake widescreen in 240p before.

I think it was Pac-Man World.

[blizzz]

There's now an alternative to the Game Boy Player Start-up Disc: http://www.gc-forever.com/forums/viewto ... =37&t=2782

The input delay isn't great, but it claims to remove the stutter and has no forced border.

[Thomago]

Great prospects! Everything is better than the original!

[bobrocks95]

Hmmm, 2-3 frames of lag is awfully high. The stutter is barely noticeable to me in 240p, I think I'll stick with the original disc.