XRGB-mini Framemeister

[BuckoA51]

So why do people mod their Component cables to VGA and combine the signal to RGB then?

Because the component inputs on the mini are poor.

For the record I got the Extron+Sync Strike working perfectly, all it took was to use an external PSU with it. I still see the discoloured band on the left of the screen sometimes, so I guess it's just something some PS2s do.

Also, I've been extensively testing an affordable transcoder (Component to VGA) and been pleased with the results so far, will do a full write up soon. It's RGBHV output though so you still need to sync combine it to use it on the mini.

[Raidenpt]

Hello Guys

i got a heavy Problem i got the mini and i plug my consoles to it (ps2/gamecube and megadrive) and the image is a jumping all over the place as if it was a heavy sync problem :s

I updated the firmware and stuff, have the right RGB cables (gamecube is the oficial RGB pal one) i even tryed mess with the sync levels but its not working.

So what im i doing wrong here?

[darcagn]

How does the mini react when fed component via the RGB21 input?
Exemple a PS2 connected via SCART, with "Component Video out" set to "Y Cb/Pb Cr/Pr".
I guess it just doesn't work... or could it be taking 480p from there by detecting a component signal?

As far as I know it just won't work as there would be no sync signal.

So why do people mod their Component cables to VGA and combine the signal to RGB then?

I may have misunderstood your original question--if you mean what happens if you plug in a normal, unmodified RGB SCART cable when the PS2 is set to Y Cb/Pb Cr/Pr, then you do get a picture, it's just that the colors are completely wrong (very green looking).

[Konsolkongen]

I have a question about a PAL 1CHIP SNES: does the onboard S-RGB amp offers a C-CYNC signal on pin 18? Can this be wired directly to the AV port instead of Composite and thus have a better output? Or is this only applicable to NTSC units?

Late reply. It does. I'm not sure it's pin 18 on all of them though. There are some variations in the RGB encoders.

You should probably add a resistor or other passive components to the line though, to bring the signal closer to normal.

I have it connected directly without any components, which is probably a bad idea, but I did the mod a long time ago. It works fine, but as far as I know there's no visual improvements by doing this.

[Shuco13]

So why do people mod their Component cables to VGA and combine the signal to RGB then?

Because the component inputs on the mini are poor.

I've heard of that several times. But how can sacrificing 480p component resolution for SCART be a better option then?
I'm sorry for all those questions, I know this topic was talked about over and over but since I can't find any complete write-up about it I can't seem to understand it.

[Fudoh]

But how can sacrificing 480p component resolution for SCART be a better option then?

you misunderstood. It's just a format issue. You can feed 31khz through RGBs to the Mini. "Going Scart" in this case doesn't mean going 15khz.

[TheShadowRunner]

But how can sacrificing 480p component resolution for SCART be a better option then?

you misunderstood. It's just a format issue. You can feed 31khz through RGBs to the Mini. "Going Scart" in this case doesn't mean going 15khz.

Hmm I'm so confused right now (I don't have a mini yet to actually try myself) ^^;
Fudoh, are you saying the mini will accept 480p as RGBs through its front RGB input?
The scenario I'm wondering about is the following:
- JPN PS2, with "Component Video out" set to "RGB" (internal PS2 setting)
- PS2 is connected to mini's front RGB input using official EURO scart cable SCPH-10142
- a game supporting 480p output is used, like Resident Evil 4.
In this case the mini is able to process the incoming RGBs 480p signal?

[Fudoh]

Fudoh, are you saying the mini will accept 480p as RGBs through its front RGB input?

yes, that's the prefered connection for your Dreamcast.

In this case the mini is able to process the incoming RGBs 480p signal?

no, because unfortunately the PS2 does output RGBs while in 15khz mode, but RGsB (that's RGB with three signal lines and sync on green) while in 31khz mode. So it's a little more complicated and you have to convert RGsB to RGBs first.

[TheShadowRunner]

no, because unfortunately the PS2 does output RGBs while in 15khz mode, but RGsB (that's RGB with three signal lines and sync on green) while in 31khz mode. So it's a little more complicated and you have to convert RGsB to RGBs first.

Arg I see, would you know if this a software or hardware limitation on the PS2 side?
Finding a way to force the PS2 to directly output RGBs in 31khz/480p mode would be ideal..

[Shuco13]

I see, now things are getting a bit clearer. But for the sync combiner: Why does it always have to be VGA-to-SCART? Is there no Component-to-SCART?

[Fudoh]

Is there no Component-to-SCART?

now you're mixing things up. When you say "component" and you only mean a component cable (but a RGsB signal), then sure, this works as well (but gives you trouble with the sync line on 15khz RGBs signals), but when you mean component signal (as in YPbPr) then you would need an active transcoder as well to convert from YUV to RGB in the first place.

[Floob]

Ok, so the XRGB mini has arrived from eBay seller in Japan (to me in UK), now to see how the picture differs to using RGB out straight into SCART on my LCD TV.

This is the PSU and EUR SCART I bought separately.


This is the mini I just received


Here is an RGB pic (JPN MD 8 Pin DIN to SCART) that I have at the moment with no mini, ignore the moire effect added by my iPhone

[CkRtech]

Did one of you guys post some images of the inside of the framemeister at one point? I am trying to find those, but I guess my keywords aren't picking up the post. No luck (so far) on Google, either.

[TheShadowRunner]

no, because unfortunately the PS2 does output RGBs while in 15khz mode, but RGsB (that's RGB with three signal lines and sync on green) while in 31khz mode. So it's a little more complicated and you have to convert RGsB to RGBs first.

Actually that could be a great new mini feature, if a signal is detected on the unit's front RGB21 sync pin -> expect RGBs, otherwise if no signal detected -> expect RGB w/ sync on green.
Certainly the mini would be technically able to do that?
Or does the sync pin still outputs something, noise or whatever, while a RGsB signal is passing through?

[Floob]

Can anyone help with this problem - I'm hoping I'm just doing something daft?

I have a SCART lead like this out of the JPN MD (60Hz) (I'm in the UK.)
http://www.retrogamingcables.co.uk/sega ... -lead.html

this goes into this adapter with built in sync stripper
http://www.retrogamingcables.co.uk/mico ... ipper.html

The end of that goes into the XRGB Mini. And the mini uses HDMI to my LCD TV.

The OSD works fine on the Mini and I've updated the firmware to 1.11 and set it to English.

But when I power the MD on, I'm just getting "No Input" shown

Any ideas why?

[austin532]

Did one of you guys post some images of the inside of the framemeister at one point? I am trying to find those, but I guess my keywords aren't picking up the post. No luck (so far) on Google, either.

Yeah, keropi posted a picture of the inside a while ago.

[CkRtech]

Thank you, austin532.

[BuckoA51]

But when I power the MD on, I'm just getting "No Input" shown

Any ideas why?

My monies on the sync stripper not getting enough power. I wish companies would just stop selling those adapters with them built in unless they have the power piggy backed from the mini.

[keropi]

@CkRtech

follow this thumbnail and press the magnifying glass icon on the bottom right twice to get the full size of the pic:



also I have a newer pic that has a higher resolution , same zoom icon x2 to get the full size:

[Floob]

But when I power the MD on, I'm just getting "No Input" shown

Any ideas why?

My monies on the sync stripper not getting enough power. I wish companies would just stop selling those adapters with them built in unless they have the power piggy backed from the mini.

Thanks. Do you think I need a sync stripper? Should I just get this instead?
http://www.retrogamingcables.co.uk/euro ... -sale.html

Or would you recommend something else for outputting from a JPN MD to a mini?

Thanks.

[CkRtech]

@CkRtech

follow this thumbnail and press the magnifying glass icon on the bottom right twice to get the full size of the pic:

Thanks!

[mickcris]

But when I power the MD on, I'm just getting "No Input" shown

Any ideas why?

My monies on the sync stripper not getting enough power. I wish companies would just stop selling those adapters with them built in unless they have the power piggy backed from the mini.

Thanks. Do you think I need a sync stripper? Should I just get this instead?
http://www.retrogamingcables.co.uk/euro ... -sale.html

Or would you recommend something else for outputting from a JPN MD to a mini?

Thanks.

Did you buy the MD cable with the jp21 scart pinout or the euro scart? If you bought the jp21 then that's the problem, but you could just use the adapter that came with the mini.
I don't need a sync stripper for any of my consoles and I have lots of them.

[Floob]

Thanks. Do you think I need a sync stripper? Should I just get this instead?
http://www.retrogamingcables.co.uk/euro ... -sale.html

Or would you recommend something else for outputting from a JPN MD to a mini?

Did you buy the MD cable with the jp21 scart pinout or the euro scart? If you bought the jp21 then that's the problem, but you could just use the adapter that came with the mini.
I don't need a sync stripper for any of my consoles and I have lots of them.

I bought the MD cable with euro scart. So I've been careful not to use the JP21 to xrgb mini adapter that came with the unit as I read that could damage it.
So currently I dont have a non sync stripper that would work with my MD - unless I understood cables and could rewire the JP21 that came with the mini?

[CkRtech]

This looks strangely familiar in a way.... http://www.ambery.com/anvitodvcowi.html.

[mickcris]

Thanks. Do you think I need a sync stripper? Should I just get this instead?
http://www.retrogamingcables.co.uk/euro ... -sale.html

Or would you recommend something else for outputting from a JPN MD to a mini?

Did you buy the MD cable with the jp21 scart pinout or the euro scart? If you bought the jp21 then that's the problem, but you could just use the adapter that came with the mini.
I don't need a sync stripper for any of my consoles and I have lots of them.

I bought the MD cable with euro scart. So I've been careful not to use the JP21 to xrgb mini adapter that came with the unit as I read that could damage it.
So currently I dont have a non sync stripper that would work with my MD - unless I understood cables and could rewire the JP21 that came with the mini?

Yeah, you can rewire the one that came with it from jp21 to euro scart.

[Floob]

Thanks. Do you think I need a sync stripper? Should I just get this instead?
http://www.retrogamingcables.co.uk/euro ... -sale.html

Or would you recommend something else for outputting from a JPN MD to a mini?

Did you buy the MD cable with the jp21 scart pinout or the euro scart? If you bought the jp21 then that's the problem, but you could just use the adapter that came with the mini.
I don't need a sync stripper for any of my consoles and I have lots of them.

I bought the MD cable with euro scart. So I've been careful not to use the JP21 to xrgb mini adapter that came with the unit as I read that could damage it.
So currently I dont have a non sync stripper that would work with my MD - unless I understood cables and could rewire the JP21 that came with the mini?

Yeah, you can rewire the one that came with it from jp21 to euro scart.

I wish I could

At least I think I understand the issue now:
http://retrorgb.com/sync.html

Although it sounds like without a sync stripper I could well end up with jailbars?

[Thomago]

@CkRtech: LOL!

[austin532]

Is there any reason why the H_POS and V_POS settings shouldn't be adjusted from their default settings? I notice some systems appear slightly off and are not perfectly center.
For example the PS2 is slightly off center and tends to look better IMO around H_POS set to 50 and V_POS set to 34.

[Thomago]

Should there be a reason? I mean... the Framemeister has a bunch of settings that are all but ideal when leaved at default.

[lettuce]

What setting can be used to remove the coloured side borders I'm seeing on some NES games?