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 Post subject: Re: ST: Battle Garegga (20.7.14 - edits, record replays list
PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 8:13 pm 



Joined: 09 Oct 2011
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trap15 wrote:
Yes, the “rapid my set” is the autofire button I mean. You want to shoot with that button to adjust, but you can’t use it “properly” at some times. So you want a non-rapid shot button to avoid the speed change in those other instances.

Thanks for the reply and advice trap but I can't get that to work.

I can indeed use the "Rapid My Set" button (RMS) to adjust, but that will only adjust speed for buttons that have RMS assigned and has absolutely no effect on the non-rapid shot button.

As far as I can tell, when a button does not have the RMS assigned to it, nothing affects the speed of its autofire other than a tap-tap-taperroooo. So I can use my RMS button to fire at 20hz or whatever, but if the non-RMS button started at 10hz, it will still fire at 10hz regardless of what I do with the RMS button.


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 Post subject: Re: ST: Battle Garegga (20.7.14 - edits, record replays list
PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 9:08 pm 


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I have used 20Hz button mappings (both via explicit button mapping as well as the adjustable "rapid my set" mapping) to raise the autofire rate in the late-game so I wouldn't have to rapidly mash. In both cases, I just need to press the button once, which raises the built-in autofire rate, at which point I can go back to using the regular non-rapid shot button.

I would be really interested to see a clip of using a 20Hz shot binding for an extended period of time, but still keeping the system-level autofire rate at 10Hz. That would be a really big (new) bug, if true.
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 Post subject: Re: ST: Battle Garegga (20.7.14 - edits, record replays list
PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2019 4:02 pm 


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Spirit X:
Once you have ever pressed the button faster than the previous auto fire setting according to the game (calculations done depending on slowdown and other stuff) the auto fire rate of just holding the shot button will forever be changed to how fast the button was pressed at it's fastest.
So, if you during the initial slowdown when the screen fades to black after the select ship screen you press the shot button faster than what is 8Hz according to the game's logic (let's say), the speed of shots from holding the shot button will always be 15Hz, unless you press the buttons faster and raise it.
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 Post subject: Re: ST: Battle Garegga (20.7.14 - edits, record replays list
PostPosted: Wed Aug 28, 2019 10:42 am 


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Just started playing this game. Confused by a lot of the mechanics so I decided to check some strategy here. Read the whole first page and I think my brain is melting now. :shock:
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 Post subject: Re: ST: Battle Garegga (20.7.14 - edits, record replays list
PostPosted: Sat Sep 21, 2019 3:31 pm 


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It is so nice to see how a game works inside.


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 Post subject: Re: ST: Battle Garegga (20.7.14 - edits, record replays list
PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 8:33 pm 


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Bumping with some tick point info from Plasmo's twitter.

Plasmo wrote:
During tick point milking with Gain’s swords you sometimes notice certain irregularities. This is due to the fact that Garegga only calculates the point gain you get from the swords every second frame.

This means that you don’t get any points during the other frames. Depending on whether you have started shooting on even frames or odd frames, your score increase differs. This can result in a significant gap during longer milks such as stage 3 boss.

Compare the same sword burst (same position, autofire frequency etc.) on different starting frames in the pictures below. The first picture shows the even frame cycle (570 points total) and the second picture the odd frame cycle (540 points total).

The 20 frames each shown in the pictures above are summarized in this table.

Please pay close attention during your next stage 3 boss milk and don’t lose out on easy points!


Images in the twitter thread:

https://web.archive.org/web/20200213174 ... 0163334144
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 Post subject: Re: ST: Battle Garegga (20.7.14 - edits, record replays list
PostPosted: Fri Apr 24, 2020 8:21 pm 


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Austin wrote:
Just started playing this game. Confused by a lot of the mechanics so I decided to check some strategy here. Read the whole first page and I think my brain is melting now. :shock:


Same here, I recently purchased this game for ps4 since I have always seen such praise shine on it. And I wanna get into surviving in this game. But it seems like scoring and survival are too closely tied in this game.
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 Post subject: Re: ST: Battle Garegga (20.7.14 - edits, record replays list
PostPosted: Tue May 19, 2020 5:32 am 


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Yeah the game demands scoreplay to rank management.

Since you have the PS4 version why not try out Premium mode? IIRC this mode has fixed rank per-stage and 15hz autofire.
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 Post subject: Re: ST: Battle Garegga (20.7.14 - edits, record replays list
PostPosted: Mon Jun 08, 2020 2:19 am 



Joined: 03 Mar 2020
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Had a run where my per-frame rank increase randomly jumped to 110 after suiciding halfway through stage 4. I'm not sure exactly when it happened because I wasn't looking or recording. Playing Miyamoto with 15hz autofire (hadn't turned it up again by accident); going to 30hz didn't correct it, and picking up a special formation increased it by 2 as expected. Is this an understood glitch or something that can just happen?


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 Post subject: Re: ST: Battle Garegga (20.7.14 - edits, record replays list
PostPosted: Sun Sep 06, 2020 8:49 am 


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Icarus wrote:
An update to the Premium Arrange, maximum rank mode conditions and notes:

What we think are the triggers (some combination of these before the end of stage 1)
• at least 2,000pt medals *
• no miss *
• no autobomb
• no medals dropped

What definitely is not a part of the conditions
• 100% boss part destruction
• Boss time remaining
• 100% in-stage enemy destruction
• 100% item collection
• Current score

What deactivates max rank mode
• Autobombing (this will deactivate max rank mode anywhere it happens)
• Dying on a boss (this will deactivate max rank mode for the next stage even if it's still active when you kill the boss: https://www.twitch.tv/icarusfw/v/108403588?t=35m05s)

What max rank mode changes
• Medal magnet range is the full screen now, and affects both ground and air medals
• Rank (obviously) climbs up to 100%
• Score ticks up constantly throughout the stage
• Item drop order is changed if you're at max Shot power or max Options - the game will ignore whatever you're at max with, and will drop a Medal in its place. Also, the item drop order is greatly accelerated, and feels like every two enemies destroyed drops an item instead of every five. This results in a gigantic rain of Medals that lock in to your position.
• Floods of enemies in certain spots in the stages - combined with the altered and accelerated drop order, can contribute millions more points than usual
• Bosses are worth far more in max rank mode than not - in normal mode, all enemy values are the same as in Arcade, but in max rank mode, bosses have at least 150k more value (eg NL2 is 100k in AC, 300k in max rank mode, GS is 300k/450k) *

Reactivation requirements
• No-missing the boss (see: deactivation requirements, seems to match up)
• (Possible) Time or Attack Cycles remaining requirement
• Autobombing during the stage or boss is okay, but you absolutely must not die to the boss to reactivate max rank mode.

NOTES:
• In Cloud (stage 5), the whole of the boss rush is considered a "boss" for the reactivation requirements, so to reactivate max rank mode for stage 6, you MUST no-miss NL2, MB2, Slayer and BH in one go.

1st full stream archive (6hrs): https://www.twitch.tv/icarusfw/v/108182472
Premium Arrange ALL, 19.37mil, Gain (ABC): https://www.twitch.tv/icarusfw/v/108189596
Premium Arrange ALL, 20,48mil, Gain (ABC): https://www.twitch.tv/icarusfw/v/108192922
2nd full stream archive (4hrs): https://www.twitch.tv/icarusfw/v/108403588
Premium Arrange ALL, 20.86mil, Gain (ABC): https://www.twitch.tv/icarusfw/v/108405914


i got some additional + official infos of Max Rank in Premium mode of Battle Garegga, also the name of that max rank mode was called "Blast Branch" mode.

here, this is what i can confirm about it now:
1. To activate it, your score must reach certain numbers of its requirement, depend on what ships/characters you use.
-Silver Sword: 5,000 points
-Grass-Hopper: 8,000 points
-Flying Barron: 8,000 points
-Wild Snail: 10,000 points
-Gain: 5,000 points
-Chitta: 1,000 points
-Miyamoto: 8,000 points
-Bornnam: 3,000 points
2. Blast Branch mode will be disabled if auto-bomb is used. However, you can re-activate it by having a greater or equal number of life at the start of each stage.
-Stage 2 - Factory: 2 lives
-Stage 3 - Plateau: 3 lives
-Stage 4 - Plant: 3 lives
-Stage 5 - Cloud: 3 lives
-Stage 6 - Base: 3 lives
-Stage 7 - Airport: 3 lives

well...i didn't buy this game yet, so only thing i can do is to watch some expert players playing this game. but i still keep looking forward for it if i have any chances to buy this game.


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 Post subject: Re: ST: Battle Garegga (20.7.14 - edits, record replays list
PostPosted: Thu Sep 10, 2020 4:25 pm 


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copy-paster wrote:
Yeah the game demands scoreplay to rank management.

Since you have the PS4 version why not try out Premium mode? IIRC this mode has fixed rank per-stage and 15hz autofire.


I cleared premium today on my first try. And I have very little garegga experience. The autobomb gives you so much resources to 1cc this game. Also, I want to get the arcade experience. I keep seeing this game ranked very highly amongst players, and I always avoided it because it seemed to be unfair to me. But I want to get into it and see and understand why so many people love it.

Am I correct in assuming I can play stages 1 to 5 for pure survival without needing rank management?

Also, the great thing about the ps4 version, is that it shows you the rank percentage on the top right of the screen. I'm just curious at what point and what percentage could you say that the rank becomes impossible or ends a survival run? If I die twice at the start of stage 2, and get an extend off the pink flamingos, will that be enough for me to play for survival only so that I can 1cc this game? OR must I also take into account other aspects of rank management? There's so many questions.

Right now my first goal is 1cc the arcade mode. The game is slowly growing on me. But I really want to see the appeal of why people love it so much. Though the OST is godlike, I can't deny that.
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Last edited by mastermx on Thu Sep 10, 2020 4:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: ST: Battle Garegga (20.7.14 - edits, record replays list
PostPosted: Thu Sep 10, 2020 4:36 pm 


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IMO, you'll need to have a plan to deal with the rank in one way or another, whether you're simply trying to keep it low throughout with careful play, or whether you're planning to score well in certain spots to earn more lives to suicide away. I have seen plenty of Golden Bat players clear the game with a simple rank-control strategy without much scoring.

In any case, you're going to need some basic knowledge about what's good and bad for the rank, so you know what big mistakes to avoid. Which powerups to collect (and when), what shot level you should stop powering up at, and other basic things like that. You definitely don't need to get into the minutae, though.
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 Post subject: Re: ST: Battle Garegga (20.7.14 - edits, record replays list
PostPosted: Thu Sep 10, 2020 4:44 pm 


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How does a player differentiate lack of skill from impossible rank is what i'm asking.
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 Post subject: Re: ST: Battle Garegga (20.7.14 - edits, record replays list
PostPosted: Thu Sep 10, 2020 4:57 pm 


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That's hard to answer because there's a ton of factors.

But if you just want a specific number to go off of? I'd say that if your rank is still below 25% at the end of stage 5, you're in good shape.
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 Post subject: Re: ST: Battle Garegga (20.7.14 - edits, record replays list
PostPosted: Thu Sep 10, 2020 5:03 pm 


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CloudyMusic wrote:
That's hard to answer because there's a ton of factors.

But if you just want a specific number to go off of? I'd say that if your rank is still below 25% at the end of stage 5, you're in good shape.


Thank you, I was looking for a guideline like that. Being able to see the rank really removes the ambiguity which is appealing to me.
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 Post subject: Re: ST: Battle Garegga (20.7.14 - edits, record replays list
PostPosted: Sat Sep 12, 2020 2:19 am 


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Omg.... I've fallen in love with battle garegga. I finally get it. I never thought I'd like a game like this. The whole idea of rank management seems so retarded to me. But it's been done in such a fair way. It's actually part of the design it seems. But that makes so little sense to me. Why a game would be so designed that way. Am I making any sense.

I'm wondering how battle bakraid or armed police batrider would be, if I sunk time into them too. Or pink sweets/muchmuchi. I've been avoiding yagawa for far too long! But he has shone his light into my life.

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 Post subject: Re: ST: Battle Garegga (20.7.14 - edits, record replays list
PostPosted: Sun Nov 29, 2020 5:57 pm 


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Darius Gaiden also have 11/12 rank system to Garegga, it's just the former is less discussed. As long as you slowly powering up and chaining medals, don't worry about rank too much. Stage 6 and 7 will always be hard as balls no matter what rank are you on.
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 Post subject: Re: ST: Battle Garegga (20.7.14 - edits, record replays list
PostPosted: Wed Dec 30, 2020 7:37 pm 


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I've been playing around with Bornham for the first time. So all of my garegga experience, and 1cc were all using Golden Bat.

My god with Bornham.. stuff just doesn't want to die. I've been spoiled so much by having piercing shot before.

What's a good powerup regime to follow? I've been grabbing 1 shot up and two options on stage 1 cause i feel so naked without.

Edit: having a lil' look at the Q&A for the first time in years. recommended play is 10hz??
Is that the arcade default? If not, what's a consistent way to set that?

Ediit: okay I noticed I can set autofire rate in MAME, so say i set my shot button to this autofire rate.. Do I then continue to play with this button inputting at autofire rate 10hz?
Or will that drive rank up like crazy and it's better to set the rate, then hold the shot button, autofire off. :?:
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Last edited by Blinge on Wed Dec 30, 2020 9:16 pm, edited 6 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: ST: Battle Garegga (20.7.14 - edits, record replays list
PostPosted: Wed Dec 30, 2020 8:36 pm 



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Quote:
Darius Gaiden also have 11/12 rank system to Garegga, it's just the former is less discussed.


In theory yes but not in practice. While it is true that pretty much everything you do raises the rank in Darius Gaiden, most of the rank increases that happen are very small, and rank can pretty much be forgotten when playing for pure survival, whereas in Garegga EVERYTHING you do is important, both for scoring and survival. The only things that increases rank significately in Gaiden are 1) destroying boss parts 2) taking surplus power ups (works with shield as well) 3) abusing autofire 4) Time, and death only has a timed effect on rank. In Garegga you have the exact number of shots, the type of shots, the sealed bullets, the medals, etc etc etc, and death is interesting for managing rank so no it's not really the same.


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 Post subject: Re: ST: Battle Garegga (20.7.14 - edits, record replays list
PostPosted: Thu Dec 31, 2020 12:23 pm 


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Blinge wrote:
Ediit: okay I noticed I can set autofire rate in MAME, so say i set my shot button to this autofire rate.. Do I then continue to play with this button inputting at autofire rate 10hz?
Or will that drive rank up like crazy and it's better to set the rate, then hold the shot button, autofire off. :?:


The problem with making my shot button a static 10hz autofire in MAME is I won't be able to crank the rate up for the final boss..
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 Post subject: Re: ST: Battle Garegga (20.7.14 - edits, record replays list
PostPosted: Thu Dec 31, 2020 6:38 pm 


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Another problem with making your main shot attached to auto is that if the game slows down while you're pressing auto you may register inputs faster than 10 hz relative to the game speed. In Garegga this only has to happen once, then you'll be locked to a higher rate for the rest of the playthrough. I think its better to have a separate auto button for the rate you want. Tap it once to increase the rate and go back to using the normal shot button.

It's also possible to bump up the rate manually by just flicking the shot button rapidly twice with 2 fingers. Tough to be totally accurate and getting all the way up to 30 hz this way is hard. But it's always an option if you are playing on an arcade setup without auto.


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 Post subject: Re: ST: Battle Garegga (20.7.14 - edits, record replays list
PostPosted: Fri Jan 01, 2021 8:09 am 


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Right well i think I've got it figured out in shmup mame.
Took me a while but I noticed Autofire has a toggle setting. Seems to be on by default.
So I can load the game, set the autofire by firing, then toggle it off before the first zako appear on stage 1.

Now the question is - Any tips for effectively destroying that gosh darn Stage 3 Midboss for the Extend? This is without pierce shot, i'm finding it so tough to do it with Bornham.
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 Post subject: Re: ST: Battle Garegga (20.7.14 - edits, record replays list
PostPosted: Fri Jan 01, 2021 12:47 pm 



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You want to take the back parts out first. Put yourself slightly below the midboss as it starts up to block the three front turrets and you'll be able to destroy the rocket launchers as soon as they flip open. Also if you're at max shot power Bornham's shot will be really wide and you'll have to pointblank to avoid accidentally taking out the middle turret, so be prepared to do that or stay with the 3-way.

Because of his shot width you can justify dropping options entirely for some parts which makes rank control really easy. Need to plan when to do it though or else it'll be hard to kill things.


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 Post subject: Re: ST: Battle Garegga (20.7.14 - edits, record replays list
PostPosted: Fri Jan 01, 2021 10:14 pm 


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Thanks! I'll give it a go tomorrow.
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 Post subject: Re: ST: Battle Garegga (20.7.14 - edits, record replays list
PostPosted: Sat Jan 02, 2021 4:59 pm 


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Regarding autofire, either do as suggested and set up separate buttons, or just learn the timings for the rates, like I did.
It just requires a tiny bit of trial and error and should be pretty consistent after that.
A good idea is to start tapping at a lower frequency, then hold to check if AF was increased, then raise frequency slightly and repeat the test to find out what the thresholds are. :)
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 Post subject: Re: ST: Battle Garegga (20.7.14 - edits, record replays list
PostPosted: Sun Jan 03, 2021 2:34 pm 


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I used to be pretty good at the double tap method BITD when I owned a Garegga PCB. Helps big time to being playing on stick where you can hit the button with two fingers. Might be tough to do on pad.

Every once in a while you might be doing a reset if you end up getting 20 hz on the first stage by mistake. If you learn to see how spaced out your shots will be depending on your ship and the fire rate used, that will be the easiest way to tell your shot speed at a glance. This can be slightly easier if you're on CRT since there is none of the motion blur caused by an LCD. Its a little easier to focus on the fast moving shots and see the size of the gap between them at least for me. But yeah its very doable with practice.

You can set the shot speed with auto then pause or look at a replay and pause it to see the spacing of a chosen rate if you're having a hard time seeing it in motion at first.


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