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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Thu Sep 19, 2019 7:26 am 


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Superb post BIL, sadly the last hour I spent with the game saw me progressing no further than the 4th stage, and not very far at that. One thing that does puzzle me - I'm almost 100% certain that when I used to play NS back when I first discovered MAME some, oh 17-18 years ago (FUCK!), I used to hang around on the first stage and have every weapon powered up before the boss. Seems the gold guys now only spawn in specific spots, first level seems to stop them from coming once you've powered up two weapons? Doesn't make a huge difference, just curious. Unless I'm getting it mixed up with the PCE, or maybe even C64 version.
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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Thu Sep 19, 2019 10:48 am 


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Thanks! Pretty glad to have this one down, tbh. Been talking it up since this thread's very first page. :smile: Gotta play what you praise. :mrgreen:

Sounds like we've been playing MAME for about the same length of time, isn't it unnerving when emulators become nostalgic? :lol: Offhand, it sounds like you may have been playing Ninja Spirit (World) rather than Saigo no Nindou (Japan) - they handle POW carriers differently, among many other tweaks. The PCE version is decidedly based on Saigo.

Stage 4 was my longtime wall too, for many years - the place where survival could no longer be guaranteed. It's a genuinely dangerous stage, on account of its random samurai setups. In 4-1 they're paired with Kusarigamas, in 4-2 with the spike pits - either way, you need to react swiftly to whatever's handed out. Saigo may be an innately floaty, wuxia-styled game, but when it comes to RNG it's as reflex-intensive as scrolling action gets.

A breakthrough in 4-1 was using the ceiling a bit more. If you get an absolute horror spawn, like a samurai running in just as you hop a scythe, going up top can save your bacon. The samurai will break off his advance to follow you, doing likewise as you return to the floor - buys lots of time with an otherwise unstoppable, tough enemy. Of course, the ceilings aren't any safer than the floors. I was going between shuriken and grenades, but have finally settled on the latter for their splash effect. Makes clearing zako here and in 4-2 a snap. Shuriken kill sammies quicker (I use 'em in 7-1) but are powerless against crawlspace lurkers.

For 4-2, my breakthrough was simply realising that sometimes, you have to turn back. If you can see you won't make it across a ceiling before a samurai reaches you, don't try. Back off, kill them, then try again. Sometimes it'll take one retry, others four - either way, you can't force this, at least not without hellacious close shaves. I splash the ceiling and floors alike with grenades throughout the section, to cull zako, as well as to chip down any pursuing samurai. If you get two behind you, that's good fortune! Keep 'em alive for as long as possible while you run like hell. The stage geography will neutralise their speed advantage.

4-3's easy by comparison, though blocky-kun is deceptively nasty. With all the slowdown in the fight, it's easy to miss that he's faster than you. Can pull some annoyingly dangerous shit. I almost got chomped on this run, but my real fear are the times a mid-height block comes charging straight across the screen - possible to get guillotined if it suddenly descends, so I like to hedge my bets with a preemptive floaty jump. He's nowhere the run killer that st7's boss is, but don't get complacent either!

BrianC wrote:
I got the 1cc on normal in TNWOA with Kunoichi. Actidentially found an exploit on the stage 7 boss where I got him in a position where I could just stand there knifing him without him moving or the usual combos occurring. I moved away from him and used the normal combos since I didn't want to win the fight that way. I'm not sure if what I did is repeatable either.


Well done, she's the toughest 1CC of the ones I've gotten so far (all but Raiden). Big jump up from Ninja!
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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Fri Sep 20, 2019 12:18 am 


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Console fiends rejoice! Fight 'N Rage is getting a Switch, PS4 and XBox One release next week. I would advise anybody even slightly interested in the beat 'em up genre to play this. It's also on sale on Steam and available on GOG too for the DRM haters.

Trailer: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8sKn4nLZwB0

iconoclast playthrough on unfair difficulty: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CBy1jGrvmOo
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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Fri Sep 20, 2019 1:16 am 


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Picked up Arcade Archives: Argus no Senshi for PS4, which includes both the JP version and Rygar (World). This one's several years old now (2015), which made me wonder if the quality would match Hamster's latest stuff. In case anyone else is curious, it seems I needn't have worried - the control response is razor-sharp, and with it being a 60hz game, the scrolling is flawless. Same options as Saigo, simple but effective. Menus are in Japanese, but I can get around that.

I have no idea WTF I'm doing with regards to scoring, however. :lol: Just motoring along for now enjoying the snappy action and incredibly rapid pace. One thing I knew from brief MAME dalliances was the flawlessly-implemented DARKNESS BOP. Image Stompy stomp! I know emphatic has praised the scoreplay, always looked forward to sitting down with this one. Strategywiki, hooo! (they good peeps! sometimes you gotta use your GAMER INSTINCT with em though :o)

The FC interpretation is a longtime minor favourite of mine. I really appreciate how disappointed AC fans might've been in it, now. The basic bop/bludgeon chassis is tantalisingly intact, but the AC's blistering pace obviously isn't. Still, I'll always enjoy it as a milder single-sitting ARPG. Interesting to see the origin of its monster and world designs here. It's a cool aesthetic, vibrantly barbarous with creepy critters and stunning prehistoric vistas galore. Tecmo's mid-80s AC stuff had some real style... I'd love to see Gemini Wing and Wild Fang on here. Dem tunes! Dat BAIORENCE!
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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Fri Sep 20, 2019 4:02 am 


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Too bad, last I checked, the US PS4 version of Rygar still hasn't updated and lacks both the JP version and scan lines. Thankfully, the US Switch version (which also counts as a purchase for the JP version) has the JP and US version, as well as scanline options. I find it interesting that the Lynx version uses the JP title screen. It's definitely not close to arcade perfect, though.


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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Fri Sep 20, 2019 6:43 pm 


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That's a shame about the US PS4 version. :o I immediately made a Japanese PSN account for my PS4, since I got it specifically for The Ninja Warriors Once Again and Shottriggers. I'd totally do so for the Japanese ACA as well, though. Lots of good stuff on there! And I'm not normally fussy about filters (much more concerned with input lag and screen tearing), but I have to admit I'm very fond of the options now.
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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Fri Sep 20, 2019 11:17 pm 


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BIL wrote:


That's an impressive clear, and some seriously useful notes. Did you figure that stuff out yourself? I had no idea that there were two types of samurai, I assumed they behaved a bit differently depending on whether there's a ceiling. The sword and sickle's projectile invincibility is really interesting too.


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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Sat Sep 21, 2019 12:25 am 


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Thanks. :smile: The ninja pit was 99% other guys' work (chiefly yours, Vludi's and Ex_Mosquito's, plus H-AML from ReplayBurners' 1CC) - I marshalled the valour of my fellows in a holy war against the kusogenic heresy. Image I think I got 'em! Will compile my findings this weekend. Image Also I nicked the st5 boss speedkill from SaigoNoNindou - I was already battering him down pretty quick with shield+kusarigama, which is more deathproof, but it's a fun gritty takedown (anyone else love Irem's "extreme DPS" M72 sound effects? So digitally crunchy, like an alarm clock going thermonuclear!) If I'd seen his st3 shield+grenade kill, I woulda copied that too. Image

(I found SNN's channel while searching for PCB footage, to confirm my recollections of its heavy slowdown... I was worried the ACA release might've been overdoing it, but nope, going by his footage it's exactly like I recalled - he seems super cool btw! Lots of excellent replays and VGM uploads - Gemini Wing's X68000 soundtrack is aces Image)

Otherwise, yep, came up with the rest myself - the ACA series caught me totally off-guard, I only knew Hamster to be decent-at-best from the PS2 gen but they've really sharpened up. There's so much good stuff I wanna get into! But I knew Saigo would be hanging over my head if I didn't settle the score. :mrgreen: I was already pretty conversant with the game on a ~2CC level, so it wasn't quite starting from scratch. Other than a Sunday afternoon spent drilling the pit, Stage 6 took the lion's share of practice time. I spent a couple evenings playing from there exclusively. One of my favourite scrolling action sequences ever - it's a shame the boss is such a joke, but the stage is so utterly ruthless and inherently un-masterable, I don't have the energy to complain much.

The jumpslasher samurais really needed a palette and/or headswap - that'd be part of my dream hack for sure. I'm surprised they weren't used in stage 7, but also horrified at the prospect, haha (they'd make the Mad Monk a total lottery - you can of course just about fend the ground-types off while fighting him).

The chain's attack frames seem to grant near-total projectile invulnerability - a st3 rifle can blast you square in the ankle while you're killing someone across the screen, bullet will shatter on contact. I think I died to a st6 kunai while firing straight down during a jump, but that may have been due to the chain hitting ground and retracting early, plus I was getting wolfpiled. I'd call it 99% trustworthy for now.

The sword seems to behave similarly, but not quite as effectively - the rifle scenario described above will see you die. I suspect it's the POW sword's enormous hitbox, particularly with a couple shadows in tow, that seems to create a similar effect, particularly when airborne. Despite my best efforts I never seem to miss projectiles (or wolves).

Interestingly, the shield will kill katana ninjas on contact, but it won't protect you from their swords any more than it will bullets and kunais - got slashed while blithely superjumping across the marsh, never again!
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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Sat Sep 21, 2019 2:13 am 


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BIL wrote:
That's a shame about the US PS4 version. :o I immediately made a Japanese PSN account for my PS4, since I got it specifically for The Ninja Warriors Once Again and Shottriggers. I'd totally do so for the Japanese ACA as well, though. Lots of good stuff on there! And I'm not normally fussy about filters (much more concerned with input lag and screen tearing), but I have to admit I'm very fond of the options now.


I have a JP account too, but I didn't know some of the US versions were inferior when I got them and I lost interest in double dipping with the PS4 versions I already had when I got the Switch version.


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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Sun Sep 22, 2019 2:13 am 


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Soon, ninja brethren.
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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Sun Sep 22, 2019 2:14 am 


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Looking forward to more regulars getting their mitts on this one :mrgreen:
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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Sun Sep 22, 2019 5:03 pm 


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Japanese TNWOA player who has been figuring out Ninja time attack ever since the game launched posted videos of Normal mode in 1673s and Hard in 1994s. Impressive stuff. Other characters might get flashier with combos but Ninja is a murder machine haha


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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Sun Sep 22, 2019 5:26 pm 


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Mah BOI Image

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Those videos remind me of how smooth the new boost dash is, particularly on termination. On SFC he more abruptly snaps out of it, so you need to append the kick for speed/range - here he gets a sliding stop with a sleek transition frame you can pivot during, perfect for switching sides on a target you've just floored, or zooming into meaty range for an EX nunchaku thrashing. Feels almost Virtual-ON, dashing about delivering precision carnage.
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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Mon Sep 23, 2019 12:10 am 


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Vanguard wrote:
I do think that you need to restrain yourself a bit to properly enjoy Mario World. Backtracking for capes and yoshis every time you lose them kills both the pacing and any sense of consequence for failure.


i've restrained every one of the last several times i've played. since the game is on the switch for free and they've improved their netcode over what the nes stuff had, i've been playing through the game 2-player with a friend and chiding her tendency to do this as we alternate stages (and getting her to stop doing it). we both ran through the secret star road bonus levels (i got through tubular on the first try, god i hate that stage) right near the beginning. i'm currently trudging through the godforsakenly awful forest of illusion, which has a lot of mandatory secrets for progression - i really don't know of a path in this game that doesn't require secret exits and it's arguable several ghost house levels and the forest illusion require them, it's almost definitely intent to be forced to replay some of these for the different exits. my friend at this moment is going through vanilla castle which has so much tedious waiting on cycles and threatless platforming.

i tend to do 100% every time i play - and perhaps, to some extent, that is the source of my exhaustion - but i just can't find the kernel of where the game is really solid. some stages are much more enjoyable than others, but the lack of pacing and sprawling nature of the game means that few of them are sequentially ordered and that even by picking and choosing, there's not really a way to have a run that just hits the high points. much of the game really starts to run together for me (especially after replaying a stage to get another exit, which is dreadfully frequent in stages that aren't worth playing even once) and i cannot discover any configuration of limitations or mindset that turns this into something i'd love. meanwhile, even when going for the exhaustingly long, single-sitting, as-many-stages-as-possible clear on smb3 i am very consistently entertained and rarely brought down by its worse stages. it feels more the delightful menagerie of gimmicks & toys.

the extremely lingering essence of the series' once superbly considered execution of player character momentum also feels weird - it's so close to pinpoint turning, but it's not. i miss jumps in this more than any other mario game (or any game with pinpoint turning & zero momentum like rockman or ninja gaiden) and similarly enjoy speed much less. in smb 3 and smb especially, when you press back you don't immediately turn and more adjust the jump - in smw, however, you turn around and start fumbling a lot, which is why i think so many players overtly rely on the cape. it's so... unpleasantly 'wiggly.' the points at which you accelerate don't feel as natural and the speed increase also feels a bit more pointed and difficult to manage.

i don't really hate the game, it just feels very disappointing.

- - - -

still need to get a good clear on ninja spirit (pce). i can smoke pc engine mode at this point, often without getting hit, but the arcade mode is so much meaner and i've been mostly just playing daemon x machina, which is a bit of a timesink (over 20 hours and still not cleared the story).
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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Mon Sep 23, 2019 9:50 am 


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PCE Ninja Spirit's arcade mode is no joke. Recorded a no-miss for old times' sake, having never actually managed one before (just lots of 1CCs). Thought it'd be a snap, ended up needing most of my Sunday. :mrgreen:

I'd put it around Contra Spirits' Hard difficulty, that is, brisk. Not a terribly steep 1CC, but it's fiendishly apt to snatch away a 1LC. As with the arcade game, I found myself relieved it's such a tight credit - its difficulty peaks could make a longer game onerous. (getting Vietnam flashbacks of Metal Slug 3's Final Mission Image)

As I always thought, it's a really nice conversion. Mags were chucking around "arcade perfect" like rice at a wedding circa 1990, but mechanically, it's dead-on. To a fault, actually - the inconsistent Shuriken aim (Left is laggy, Right is instant) and deadly Chain jump glitch are here too. Stage design for 1 through 5 is extremely close. 3 and 4 are outstanding conversions of wickedly relentless stages, near-perfect.

6 abruptly gets weird, and it makes me wonder if the aforementioned mechanical accuracy was more "drag n' drop" than calibrated conversion... because from player perspective, 6's terrain change is god-awful. The rocks you run along? In the arcade version, they're subtly uneven, just enough to convey a rough surface. It's a stylistic element, nothing more. On PCE, those dips are outright drops, and with the game's low gravity, they'll deny your jump just long enough for an ill-timed samurai to take your head off. It's really fucking aggravating. :| (the arcade game has one example of this, in stage 7-1. You'll learn to fear the sharp, visually indistinct drop right after the second POW carrier - if a samurai attacks as you cross it, you're in deep shit! but with the stage being a confined deathtrap from start to finish, as opposed to st6's open battlefield, it's nowhere as galling)

Stage 7 is also very different! 7-1 (Nazo no DEVIL'S AIR FRESHENER) is cool, but screw 7-2 (Kanashimi to MONEY-GRUBBING FUCKS) as always. I'm not gonna go all Stockholm syndrome complaining about the altered pit. It chokes balls either way. :shock: I actually find the PCE's short, sharp easy route a bit nervier than the AC's longer, stabler plan. Kinda compresses twenty seconds into five. Contrasting renditions of utter kusoge. Image

Stage 6 death-rocks aside, changes are pretty harmless and the difficulty is legitimate - much nearer MD Daimakaimura's workhorse reliability than MD Strider's 11th-hour stumbles. Intensity isn't far off the arcade game, outside of st6+7's decided comedowns (RIP mad monk, but the final boss remains every bit as assholic). It's too bad st6's giants and jump-slashers got nixed... presumably the port couldn't handle AC mobs without obscene slowdown, but surely they could've distilled the essentials? G&J spawning simultaneously are all you need for pants-shitting RNG terror - instant wall of razor death, think fast motherfucker! Overall I can't complain much, just a bit nonplussed at some changes seeming stylistic rather than technical.

I'm gonna see if I can overlay the AC soundtrack for a simulation of the cheap n' cheerful CD-ROM (not Super CD and most definitely not Arcade CD :wink:) reissue I wish this had gotten. Masahiko Ishida's sinister, pounding arcade OST is the only true casualty in an otherwise lovable HuCard.

I think the official name for this conversion might be "Saigo no Nindou: Ninja Spirit." Will try titling my run that and seeing if anyone yells at me. Image
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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2019 6:16 am 


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Can anyone provide/direct me to some strategy info for a 1cc of Double Dragon on FC? I know you need to power level in the first two stages by spamming punch. My current challenge with the game is I always end up trading blows with enemies, especially in the double Abobo fights (my usual strategy is a single kick followed by a backwards elbow). I really hate the enemy's crouching dodges in the game as well. It seems random and unavoidable; just luck. Am I missing something?
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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2019 7:00 am 


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Here's the link from the index. Some discussion follows on the subsequent posts/pages.


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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2019 7:10 am 


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Awesome thanks, I didn't even realize this thread had an index. BIL is doing the Lord's work as always.
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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2019 7:21 am 


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Oh hell yeah, DD1FC strats! :o I'm headed out and, ruefully, the net nanny at work think this thread is some kind of sordid otaku Fight Club (banned for PERSONAL WEAPONS and THREATS OF VIOLENCE :shock: :lol:), so I'll check back later. The post Skye linked should be a good start! I recorded a demo 1LC shortly after - for now, here's a quick link to the DOUBLE BOBO takedown. Image

Skye's done the lion's share of the indexing so far, tbh :mrgreen: Sounds like it'd be good to post my additions soon. For now, I'll stick an index link on the front page starring KNIFE ARMY :cool:
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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2019 7:43 am 


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Beautiful. :)


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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2019 3:23 pm 


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BIL i'll hopefully get back around to ninja spirit soon and use some of your stuff for help on getting at least a 1cc on arcade mode.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_70yzy5EhaU

kommander has been streaming the new contra and it looks... dire. hp bars, numbers popping up on damage, overtly long cinematic kills (yes, really), combat that boils down to a bunch of stuff lining up and chasing you while you just mow it down. feels like every modern twinstick game in a very bad way.
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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2019 6:01 pm 


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You'll have no trouble getting the 1CC, knowing your kill sheet. :smile: The 1LC's a minor pain in the ass (the short runtime helps) - but as I always try to remind myself, shortly after my usual post-mortem bark (taptaptaptaptaptaptaptap "FUCK!"), I'd be sadder if it weren't. :mrgreen:
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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2019 11:28 pm 


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So I'm keeping at this DD1 quest and getting a bit stronger with each run. There's tons of useful stuff in your post so thanks a lot for that BIL, and thanks for directing me there SKYe.

So I'm trying to apply the Abobo point blanking but I'm finding my kicks often whif and he takes a quick step back and smacks me right in the face. Is there a trick to the spacing?

For Machine gun Willy, during my first run I activated the machine gun glitch easily and kicked him down, but last night's run I used states ad infinitum to replicate it and it just wouldn't work. I ended up fighting him straight out with a poke and throw strategy which worked pretty well actually, but it's not something I'm dying to risk during my first 1cc attempt.

Also grappling mostly works but sometimes it just doesn't? I feel like my spacing is pretty good but...
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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2019 11:39 pm 


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ACSeraph wrote:
So I'm trying to apply the Abobo point blanking but I'm finding my kicks often whif and he takes a quick step back and smacks me right in the face. Is there a trick to the spacing?


No real trick tbh, just a feel for the game's vexing combination of exacting yet glitchy. Here's an aggressive shutdown of Mibobo #2. You can see where I'm a few pixels too far off, and get tagged, but I correct my footing aggressively to avoid a knockdown*.

* please think of this cavern showdown, in which our hero slips everything his mighty foe throws at him before blasting him clean through a wall, as my humble tribute to this Shin Hokuto no Ken highlight. Image

PLEASE LET ME APPEAL TO MY GOD FOR FORGIVENESS!!!
THERE IS NO GOD WILLING TO SAVE YOU
AIEEEEEEEEE!!!
ATATATATA! ATATATATATATA!! HOOWAAAAAA-TAAAAAAAAA!!! *MEAT BAG EXPLOSION*

Imma edit a video sometime Image


Quote:
For Machine gun Willy, during my first run I activated the machine gun glitch easily and kicked him down, but last night's run I used states ad infinitum to replicate it and it just wouldn't work.


I've had that glitch fail a few times, too, but I seem to recall it being reliable enough that I had no problems relying on it in one-life runs. DD1's weird about these things, unfortunately... from what little I understand, if you're not right on the threshold of falling, he'll still hit you, but if state practice was consistently failing it wouldn't surprise me that some crazy RNG variable was at fault. TBH I should've really learned to fight him properly for that replay, but I found the glitch myself and was kinda proud. :mrgreen:

Quote:
Also grappling mostly works but sometimes it just doesn't? I feel like my spacing is pretty good but...


As with Abobo, I'm pretty sure the game's just overly stringent about range. As a rule of thumb, when going for a grapple I try to connect the kick from the absolute maximum distance (same as taking down Williams and Ropers early on, before they and you can jumpkick). Note (as seen in that post), you can also connect a hit from "too close," then back away and have the grapple connect. Weird. It wouldn't surprise me at all if the code can simply deny you at times. You can see in my run how I'm able to execute the hugely powerful jumping roundhouse finisher seemingly without comboing - kills that st3 Bobo in no time flat. That's a bug triggered by fighting in front of a doorway. :lol:

Fortunately the game's single deadliest execution, the st4 wall, is totally consistent every time. Normally I'd have tried to find a solution myself, but buddy was very kindly holding his copy for me while I determined whether it could be done consistently. Image

BTW If you're liking DD1FC but finding it a bit rough around the edges (which it is!), chances are you will love DD2FC - refines away 99.9% of the chaff for the most evil "two enemies onscreen max" brawling ever. Technical violence! Under XTREEM scrutiny it has minor input glitches of its own - see here - but they're easily sidestepped. FC ver is essential, its Hard mode takes the NES equivalent's face off with a belt sander. Apologies, that was horrific! :shock: BUT ITS THAT SORTA JOINT THO Image GET A PARTNAH AND WHOOP SOME FUCKIN ASS Image
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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Wed Sep 25, 2019 3:54 am 


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Thanks a lot for the detailed breakdown! I'll make sure to see this beatdown through to the end as thanks. Maybe I'll even update my long neglected 1cc list...

As for DD2 FC, I actually have played it quite a lot and I love it. DD 1 and 2 were among the first FC games I purchased with my shiny top loader, but I'm pretty lazy about learning games to be honest, so I didn't get it in my head to actually 1cc them until Nintendo Online provided me with state practice. DD2 will be next on my hit list, and ultimately I'll try to knock them both out on my original hardware.
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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Wed Sep 25, 2019 9:47 am 


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Pre ordered Ninja Saviors for the PS 4. Face punching will commence upon release.

In the meantime I'm going back to Ketsui and Under Defeat.
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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Wed Sep 25, 2019 4:33 pm 


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ACSeraph wrote:
As for DD2 FC, I actually have played it quite a lot and I love it. DD 1 and 2 were among the first FC games I purchased with my shiny top loader, but I'm pretty lazy about learning games to be honest, so I didn't get it in my head to actually 1cc them until Nintendo Online provided me with state practice. DD2 will be next on my hit list, and ultimately I'll try to knock them both out on my original hardware.


Excellent choice. :smile: DD2FC is one of the machine's unheralded gems... it's one of my fondest memories, discovering it. I fired it up and got the shit kicked out of me by the very first Williams duo. Assumed I was just playing badly and checked a NES "Supreme Master" speedrun for reference. OMFG LMAO THEY'RE TRYING TO BREAK BILLY'S KNEE WITH THEIR FACES Image Cleared the mode on my first attempt. :lol: The FC equivalent is a different beast entirely. Amusingly enough, even the friggin stage 2 chopper is angrier. :shock:

In a happy paradox it's both more vicious and more user-friendly than the NES version. Continues are enabled by default, you can play the whole game on lower difficulties, and said modes will tone down Mission 6's platforming too. A lovely little cart with a hellacious mean streak. I dub its Hard mode XTREME MASTER :cool:
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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Wed Sep 25, 2019 4:43 pm 


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I like that the JP version of DD2 FC can be played on Switch with a US Online subscription on the JP Famicom app. I was surprised by the last US NES release. JP gets that Kunio marathon racing game and US gets Vice Project Doom.


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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Wed Sep 25, 2019 6:56 pm 


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Sounds good! I'd love to see even a few more NES veterans try the FC one. Yet another feather in its cap: its "Normal" is more or less the NES's Supreme Master; you can't lose no matter which version you prefer. Definitive version of a Technos gem.

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Now, on my word, I owe the thread one (1) NINJA PIT KILLER post. The fiend is in my sights. Image For now though, and I'M SORRY OKAY :shock: but IT JUST KEEPS HAPPENING Image

We have known it! Many times, a punitive hardcore gamer scruffing has been warranted by the hapless noobs of Heavy Goods Vehicles 101 - the cheap n' cheerful haulage superstore that keeps trying their hand at these mean ol' videogames! The cycle is a tragically familiar one: your faithful doctor fires up a JAPANESE TV GAME and says "Hey that's pretty good!" then hops on the Google to see what is up! And THEN heresy ensues - liable to cause innocent noobs a really bad day! These intrepid lorry merchants managed to get just about everything wrong about Ninja Spirit's weapon set, and that is some dangerous misinformation!

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A Short Primer
THE FOUR WEAPONS OF TSUKIKAGE: THE FAKE VERSUS THE REAL
2019 Biruford Press

HGV101 wrote:
The hero, a ninja named Moonlight can use four weapons, which you can switch between at any time.


A steady start! Please continue.

The Sword wrote:
The sword is wielded rather unusually, as it’s swung at an upwards arc,


It is a cool detail, isn't it? Wicked reaping motion as you sail over the soon-to-be decapitated heads of the foemen. REAL EDIT: ZOMG, not only do the giants share Tsukikage's palette, they too wield their swords decidedly underhand! I wonder if something's going on there. Perhaps Tsuki really is the SAIGO of his clan, his fallen comrades turned against him in death! Brrr!

The Sword, continued wrote:
but it’s handy for blocking projectiles.


Ha ha, it sure is mister! You know, this is going surprisingly well! :smile: I think we might *RECORD SCREECH*

The Shuriken wrote:
The shurikens are much weaker but can be tossed in almost any direction.


Oh you absolute nutsack! :o I mean, you first-rate driveshaft repair specialist! Shuriken have the game's highest DPS. The sword has the lowest. It's brilliant in stage 3-2 with its easy, breezy, bullet/zako-snuffing arc, plus its overhead "clash" mechanic for warding off monks and their staves. Power, though?

Spoiler: show
Image


As I type this, a rotting giant is cleaving some poor HGV101-trusting noob in half - his torso hitting the grass in a flood of gore and filth, his undead slayer melting into the night. :sad: A forlorn shamisen lingers in the air, mingling with the stench of dead man's poop. HE TRUSTED YOU, HGV101 :evil:

The Bombs wrote:
The bombs work similarly to the shurikens, but while they’re more powerful


They're not. Bombs are easier to connect with their lingering splash, which can also bypass enemy shields and terrain - but unimpeded, shurikens will kill faster. The advantage is tiny, but it's real, and it can save your ass VS stage 7's charging samurai - who can plunge through bomb-splash with their speed and durability, but will be solidly punctured by a hail of shuriken.

Much more concerningly, though...

The Bombs, continued wrote:
they have a low firing rate.


Image Let's kill two frowzy fowls with one GIF, shall we:

Spoiler: show
Image


The Kusarigama wrote:
The “kusarigama” sickle has a long reach and can be bent in different directions, though ultimately it’s rather difficult to wield.


B... "bent?" :\

Image

It's an eight-way attack, JFC! You ever play Dracula IV?! Now, "difficult to wield" is a judgment call, but with the cornucopia of misinformation above, I'm guessing our heroes of beverage freighting are needlessly mongling their thumbs for the chain swing. Don't be a mongler! Just hit a direction adjacent to your initial attack - job done. After, let it reel back in, then send it out again for nonstop screen-shredding swings. Enjoy the unmatched balance of range, speed, power and defense that makes it the game's single most valuable weapon! It's good, don't be a chump!

Spoiler: show
Image


On the PCE conversion wrote:
Overall, it’s a fantastic port, and not only one of the better action games on the TurboGrafx-16, but it’s better than the frustrating arcade original thanks to its balance tweaks.


Far be it from me to differ too strongly - the HuCard is wonderful, and the arcade game is wickedly tough - but surely you onlookers can understand, even in your disgust, why I've yet again driven the Birucar through the front window of HGV101's Tinkletowne branch, before proceeding to urinate all over their forecourt while tugging my cockerel at the intervening rozzers! Image Image "This game is frustrating! Also, I've stated in detail that I have no idea how its weapons work." Image TALE OLD AS TIME Image

This ain't charity, noobs. I just hate seeing anything go to waste. Image
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[THE MIRAGE OF MIND] Metal Black ST [THE MASSACRE] Gun.Smoke ST [TRAGEDY FLAME]
"We need some charred bodies flying out of this explosion"


Last edited by BIL on Thu Sep 26, 2019 6:01 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Wed Sep 25, 2019 7:27 pm 


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playing some super c and god damn the extend rate in this game is waaaaaay too generous and the loop difficulty increasing way too marginal. this is the start of loop 8, which means i've played 8 stages 7 times, or 56 total stages. i've probably died somewhere around a dozen to fifteen times at this point, meaning that i'm getting more than one life per stage on average. that's silly! i'm never going to run out. i'll fall asleep before running out.

the looping on the original fc/nes contra is a lot better - fewer extends, trigger happy hell zako, faster increasing difficulty to a higher overall difficulty cap (probably, maybe super c gets comedic lightning zako if i play fifty loops and doesn't cap around loop 8/9 like contra, they do seem to be moving faster or at least spawning more often), etc. it feels good, and also feels like you can't quite continue *totally* indefinitely despite that free extend per loop because shit gets mean. iirc last time i played i just quit with abt 8 or 9 lives on the start of loop 11, which i think i talked about in my first post on here, ever? feel like if i really concentrated for six hours or whatever i could probably hit around loop 20 or something but man, a person just gets tired.

went and played another loop before hitting submit, starting loop 9 with 51 lives. 51 lives!!!! ain't need no ko nammy code when you get more 1ups via extends than in a mario game.
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