r type 3 vs. thunderforce 4

tizerist · Post by **tizerist** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 12:54 pm

which , out of these 2 great games do you consider to be the ultimate 16-bit shooter, considering they are the snes's and megadrives best shoot em ups respectively?
they are very much ying and yang to each other, while R3 looks better and has better audio, TF4 has a more arcadey pacing.

i aint got very far into R3, but the similarities (to look at them) always hits me.
definately both worth owning.
what do you reckon??

Turrican · Post by **Turrican** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 1:02 pm

"They are their respective systems best shooters" - questionable, even if you're talking of best horizontal shooters.

"R3 has better audio" - I completely disagree, R3 music is subpar and its weakest point.

But I give you it's an hard call - honestly they're both great games. If I'd be forced to pick up just one, I'd probably go for TFIV.

FRO · Post by **FRO** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 2:24 pm

Turrican wrote:But I give you it's an hard call - honestly they're both great games. If I'd be forced to pick up just one, I'd probably go for TFIV.

Of course, I would agree!

I can't speak about R-Type 3's music because it's been a while since I played the game. However, TF4's music is pretty darn hard to beat. If you're strictly a graphics person, TF4 still holds its own (despite no mode 7 stuff). If you're talking about challenge, well, TF4 again holds its own.

I would put TF4 on top because I think it pushes the Genesis/Megadrive to its limits, while R-Type 3 doesn't have as much going on as, say, Space Megaforce or Axelay.

sven666 · Post by **sven666** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 2:41 pm

ill give you axelay is a damn fine game,but dude, space megaforce barley makes par?

anyways, its a hard call.. TF4 is brilliant but im a big r-type fan so i guess it inches its way past.. not by much tho.

Sly Cherry Chunks · Post by **Sly Cherry Chunks** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 2:47 pm

The only thing R-Type III has gong for it is the interesting and fun-to-use weapon system. TF4 beats it in every other respect - visuals, audio, pacing, gameplay and the amount of cool set-pieces. The "Blade" weapon lets it down a bit, being mostly useless - as do the annoying voice samples.

R-Type III is as dull as dishwater until you reach the final boss.

TF4 > R-Type III.

Jon · Post by **Jon** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 5:09 pm

Man thats a tough call (in my opinion anyhoo.) I would probably say that TF IV barely edges it out due to the frustation factor in R-Type III. Just barely.

Ganelon · Post by **Ganelon** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 5:35 pm

Despite TFIV being technically inferior to R-Type III's graphics, I think the visuals were designed a lot better (maybe because R-Type has to maintain its grimy look in every game while TF has always been about flash). I'd easily go for TFIV and its much smoother pace as a huge Tecno Soft fan myself...

However, I think Macross is a better horiz shooter with the innovative enemy stealing on the SFC and Gaiares the same for the MD.

captain ahar · Post by **captain ahar** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 5:42 pm

i'm going with r-type III. despite the much slower pace, the action is a whole lot more satisfying. of course, i am not that huge on thunderforce so consider my bias clear.

SFKhoa · Post by **SFKhoa** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 5:45 pm

TF4 >>> R-Type 3 for sure.

ghibli99 · Post by **ghibli99** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 5:50 pm

Tough call. Although I ranked RT3 above TF4/LF in the Top 25 thread, they were *right* next to each other, so I guess subjectively, I rank them at the very top for their respective platforms.

RT3 is a much more frustrating game, but at the time, just playing through that first level was such an experience that it left a greater impression on me than TF4. I could tell that Irem had a blast with the effects, but man, does the game get hard later.

That's not to say that TF4's absolutely rockin' intro and parallax insanity wasn't mind-blowing, either, and the differences and strides Technosoft made between TF3 and TF4 is dramatic.

My rankings change from day to day, but thinking about both of them now, I would have to give the nod to TF4 today, which may have to do with the fact that I'm listening to the Stage 1 Boss music right now

, which is and always will be some of the most adrenaline-pumping 16-bit music ever created.

raiden · Post by **raiden** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 6:18 pm

well, R-Type III is my favourite R-Type game, while Thunderforce 4 is my least favourite Thunderforce game (only counting parts 3,4 and 5). That´s why in this case, I tend to prefer R-Type III, although I generally prefer the Thunderforce series.
I don´t like TF4´s excessive vertical scrolling, but I like RT3´s variation in level design. But regarding music, RT3 can´t even begin to compare to TF4.

captain ahar · Post by **captain ahar** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 6:19 pm

raiden wrote:well, R-Type III is my favourite R-Type game, while Thunderforce 4 is my least favourite Thunderforce game (only counting parts 3,4 and 5)

what other ones are there?

LSU · Post by **LSU** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 6:32 pm

TFIV. Easy choice for me.

it290 · Post by **it290** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 6:33 pm

TF4, although I prefer TF3 in general.

R-Type 3 isn't that bad in this department, but I really hate games that overuse mode 7. I don't want to sit there and wait for the damn to screen to rotate, and it looks ugly anyway. TF4, aside from its superior gameplay, also has more speed, more sprites, and more parallax. Blast processing.

Rob · Post by **Rob** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 7:14 pm

Turrican wrote: "R3 has better audio" - I completely disagree, R3 music is subpar and its weakest point.

But the SNES soundchip was made especially for the system. It also had like 100,000,000 colors, so my vote is obviously for RT3.

Post by **nZero** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 7:26 pm

God, it's like choosing between being punched in the face or kicked in the nuts. Probably the two games I like least out of their respective series. I'll give a slight nod to Lightening Force (ha ha) because the attract mode is a better presentation, with rockin' music to boot.

Ko.oS · Post by **Ko.oS** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 7:33 pm

not to sound negative, but TFIV is too long, and RTIII is too slow.

i only creditfeed shumps to see the ending anyway, so TFIV wins (besides, RTIII has stupid checkpoints, and a loop-over. who the fuck invented that crap!??)

Stormwatch · Post by **Stormwatch** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 8:17 pm

What is this? An "ultimate 16-bit shmup" thread and no one mentioned Sol Deace, Gley Lancer, or Eliminate Down?! You people disappoint me.

superhitachi4 · Post by **superhitachi4** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 9:11 pm

Games such as these are so good, a choice was not meant to be made. You have to buy both.

CMoon · Post by **CMoon** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 9:19 pm

Yes, not only a pointless question (both can be had for cheap) but pointlessly biased. Definitely not in my top ten of 16 bit games.

J-Manic · Post by **J-Manic** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 10:02 pm

TFIV kicks the shit out of R-Type III. Although, R-Type III is still a really good hori nonetheless.

Turrican · Post by **Turrican** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 10:46 pm

Rob wrote:But the SNES soundchip was made especially for the system. It also had like 100,000,000 colors, so my vote is obviously for RT3.

Sometimes you're not funny, Rob. You're the only one here which tried hopelessly to turn this thread into another snes vs md war.

Rob · Post by **Rob** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 11:25 pm

Turrican wrote: You're the only one here which tried hopelessly to turn this thread into another snes vs md war.

I'm sorry it didn't turn out that way, but that's essentially what this thread is. Anyways, limited entertainment value and no possible insights to be made here. This is why I don't make that many topics. A good one is hard to make, and a best TF or TF vs. ___ thread is not that.

WarpZone · Post by **WarpZone** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 11:58 pm

I often can't tell when I die in TFIV, thanks to all the cheap shots and graphics that disguise attacks. So R-Type III.

Ko.oS · Post by **Ko.oS** » Fri Mar 31, 2006 12:12 am

I dunno, I can onelife the saturn rev of TFIV (no slowdown) on mania .. maybe you need to wear glasses?

anyway, RT3's stage 4 midboss tune is topclass, you guys have zerotaste in VG-music (oh no its buttrock)

Keranu · Post by **Keranu** » Fri Mar 31, 2006 3:21 am

R-Type 3 rulez TF4. Sorry, not a TF fan.

Specineff · Post by **Specineff** » Fri Mar 31, 2006 3:41 am

nZero wrote:God, it's like choosing between being punched in the face or kicked in the nuts. Probably the two games I like least out of their respective series. I'll give a slight nod to Lightening Force (ha ha) because the attract mode is a better presentation, with rockin' music to boot.

Oh, finally. QTF. I personally find the music in TF4 to be pretty standard sounding compared to the exceptional job Technosoft did with TF3. Don't believe me? Compare Daser's (desert level TF4) with Seiren's (Water planet on TF3).

Ok. TF4 has better graphics, but not by much.

RType 3 however, beats the crap out of Super R-Type.

So IMHO, it boils down to execution. And I feel that R-Type 3 is better executed than TF4. But given the choice, I'd play none. Because they're both weak. Now, if we compared R-Type Delta VS Thunder Force 5.. that's a fight I look forward to.

Thunderforce has always felt more dynamic, more manic when compared to R-Type. A bad comparison would be TF is Speedy Gonzalez, making noise and running around the place, enjoying what it can do. R-Type is more like Wil E. Coyote: Bides its time, prepares its gadgets.. patiently.. waiting for the moment to strike.

Specineff · Post by **Specineff** » Fri Mar 31, 2006 3:43 am

Stormwatch wrote:What is this? An "ultimate 16-bit shmup" thread and no one mentioned Sol Deace, Gley Lancer, or Eliminate Down?! You people disappoint me.

You mean Sol Feces, Gay Lancer and Elamenate Down?

Kidding, kidding. Only Sol Feace feels lame to me.

Sorry for the double post, mods.

dai jou bu · Post by **dai jou bu** » Fri Mar 31, 2006 4:57 am

Like Specineff said, it's really hard to comare R-Type to anything else since there's not a lot of shmups that have really tried to mimic its style sucessfully. You guys would be better off comparing Gradius 3 (arcade or SNES version) to Thunderforce 4.

I do prefer the new beam shots in R-Type 3 over the "sword" beam attack that pushes you back in Thunderforce 4 though.

Specineff wrote: So IMHO, it boils down to execution. And I feel that R-Type 3 is better executed than TF4. But given the choice, I'd play none. Because they're both weak. Now, if we compared R-Type Delta VS Thunder Force 5.. that's a fight I look forward to.

That's debatable. R-Type III was the plateau of the series' life, since it was the first to introduce two different force types other than the standard one we were used to seeing, something which Delta carried on. Also Delta carried on the tradition of having different beam shot types, just like in III, except it's exclusive to the ship you choose in Delta. The bosses were also a little bit tougher in III and more creative; I still consider the 4th stage boss to be one of the best ever designed in a shmup, which more than makes up for the stage's odd layout.

In short, Delta doesn't do anything spectacular, other than adding sci-fi horror atmosphere and getting to use a room-clearing "bomb" when your force reaches 100% in damage absorption, which to me, contradicts everything the series emphasized: "Memorization for Game Progression."

Oh, and Delta suffers from slowdown while III doesn't. It should be the other way around, like how Thunderforce 4 suffers from slowdown while Thunderforce 5 doesn't (well, the PSX version anyway).

Delta's not a bad game though. I mean, it is balanced for all three (I MEANT TO SAY FOUR) ships, right?

JBC · Post by **JBC** » Fri Mar 31, 2006 5:15 am

I'm actually more of a fan of the R-Type series than Thunder Force but i'm still going to go with TFIV on this one. Even aside from the gameplay being more enjoyable, the overall feel of the game is better. R-Type III strayed to far away from the look of the series, and that made it less solid for me. If you notice the actual enemy and environment designs in III are kind of far removed from the rest of the series - with the exception of R-Type Final, which i thought was just wack... uh, yo.

Thunder Force IV is just more intense, gameplay and mood-wise.

shmups.system11.org

r type 3 vs. thunderforce 4

r type 3 vs. thunderforce 4

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