Games with good scoring systems that are not Shmups?

[1000Eyes]

Looking to broaden my horizons

I'm guessing we shouldn't count similar genres like:
- Tetris-likes (Cleopatra Fortune, TGMs, etc.)
- Racing games
- Rhythm games

Not because they aren't good examples, but because it's well known already

Started this question because I loved the scoring of Pang.

[Kino]

Relevant to my interest, will be monitoring this thread intently.

I'm a bit picky when it comes to scoring systems; infinite loops or a counterstop is usually an instant disqualification for me. Thus far, I've stumbled upon precious few I would compare favorably to your average post 4th-gen shmup. Here's the main ones that stand out to me:

Psycho Soldier (1987 auto-scrolling run 'n' gun, by SNK. Mainly based around letting the point items float to the top of the screen, then grabbing them at the last possible second, as items accrue in value the longer they stay on-screen. Figuring out how to route everything and stay alive simultaneously is quite tricky, you'll often have to exploit your bomb attack's invulnerability frames to manage this.)

Psychic 5 (1987 platformer, by NMK. The most insanely convoluted arcade scoring system ever conceived up until this point. I can't do it justice, read this and scroll down to the sections pertaining to all the Bonuses.)

Gussun Oyoyo (1993 action puzzle game, by Irem. Bizarre mashup of Tetris & Lemmings, high scores are heavily reliant on speeding through levels to attain the maximum time bonus of 50000 points. It gets interesting due to the tetromino [well, tromino in this case] drops being randomized, so you can't rely on receiving the same loadout every time; each playthrough is a unique experience. Quick thinking & adaptability is key. There's also a multiplier when you crush multiple enemies at once, but it rarely comes into play outside of the penultimate stage, where in typical Irem fashion you're encouraged to checkpoint milk. Even in their puzzlers it's inescapable. )

Denjin Makai (1994 belt scroller, by WinkySoft. I go into the nitty gritty over here, read that if you must. TL;DR stay at low health the entire game, use your Desperation Move to finish off enemies whenever possible, guess correctly during the one or two sections with random point item drops.)

Pretty Soldier Sailor Moon (1995 belt scroller, by Gazelle. Toss every enemy like a ragdoll, milk certain bosses with your infinite combo, don't bomb, get lucky with randomized bomb drops, and somehow do all this while not getting dicked over by the rudest timer in b'mup history.)

BTW, were we keeping this exclusive to arcade games? If not, lump in the following:

Elemental Gearbolt (1997 light gun shooter, by Alfa System. Based around maintaining your chain combo, never getting hit, strategic swapping between your Thunder shot & your Blaze shot, and in the US version, finding hidden chalices.)

The Adventure of Little Ralph (1999 platformer, by New Corporation. An elaborate fruit chaining system, an extremely satisfying combo mechanic that has you domino effect-ing enemies into each other, the 10K point items you have to grab on a precise frame... a near masterpiece of scoreplay, marred only by an unfortunate oversight that requires you milk arrows for an hour straight, if you want anything near a WR tier score.)

[Randorama]

Rainbow Islands. Sumez will probably offer a dissertation on the intricacies of this game and its scoring system once he reads this thread.

Of course, Bubble Bobble offers plenty of scoring opportunities too.

I would add Fairyland Story, too, although I do not remember how good the scoring system is: it is an early single-screener, after all (Taito, 1985).

Pang! and Super Pang! are lovely examples, and Pang !3 might be ugly but it offers an even better experience (faster pace, more intricate Stage design).

The two Puzz Loop games are really difficult but have also interesting scoring opportunities, and other Mitchell games have similar intricate systems across different genres. Question: are non-Tetris-like Puzzle games acceptable for the thread?

[1000Eyes]

The two Puzz Loop games are really difficult but have also interesting scoring opportunities, and other Mitchell games have similar intricate systems across different genres. Question: are non-Tetris-like Puzzle games acceptable for the thread?

Of course! That's why Pang's up there to begin with

Also Puzz Loop... so that's what Zuma was ripping off. Back then my mother liked to play a lot of Popcap games, and I remember having fun with Zuma. Funny to see that it has Arcade roots.

Kino: Any type of game is fine, and thanks for the detailed post! Lots of stuff I've never heard of.

On topic, here's some I often see recommended but haven't played myself:

Devil Daggers & Hyper Demon: Score attack FPSes
Slashout: Another answer to "bmups have no good scoring systems". Mainly based on this post. Combo-based with a strict timer?

[Sumez]

Awesome idea for a thread, honestly!

I think unfortunately with the shift towards progression/1CC-focused arcade games banking on using continues etc., solid scoring systems started mattering less to anything outside of the genres mentioned. But that's also exactly why this thread is interesting. I think looking at game from before 1986, you're probably gonna find more great examples in a variety of genres.

Donkey Kong is a game that IMO has a surprisingly solid scoring system as evident by the heavy competition going on in it. But it's funny, because it's almost by accident. Some elements are absolutely by design, but it feels like a lucky fluke that it actually works. Without the definite killscreen, the scoring would have been completely irrelevant because it would have been a marathon game instead. With the killscreen, every single 100 points you can squeeze out of it really matters.
It does suffer from its very long runtime, and the fact that one source of points is completely random (either 300 or 500 points determined by RNG) is hilariously bad. But the scoring system is what elevates the game for sure. Especially on the barrel stages.

Rainbow Islands. Sumez will probably offer a dissertation on the intricacies of this game and its scoring system once he reads this thread.

Of course, Bubble Bobble offers plenty of scoring opportunities too.

Bubble Bobble has some wonderful scoring mechanics!
Grouping enemies is the core element, which chains into other scoring opportunities. There's the immediate score when popping grouped enemies, but also the value of the fruits that are dropped then.
The more enemies are grouped, the more EXTRA bubbles will then appear, which increases your chance of extra lives. And picking up those (even when you don't need them) consequently makes candy canes appear, which summons the giant score items.
If you can make it to stage 50 without dying you get to skip a lot of stages without great socring opportunities and jump right into the ones that have.


Rainbow Islands is odd for scoring. It has some really fun systems, but it doesn't have much of a scoring system I'd say. I usually have the same amount of points at the same place in the game no matter how I'm doing.
But there's some extremely high level scoring tricks to the game which you can see employed by Ben Shinobi in his counter stop video. They rely on both using the permanent wing item in a certain way, and then continuously timing out on the final screen of the game, and picking up all diamonds in order between the final checkpoint and the end boss - which is an absolutely insane thing to do.
This is crazy stuff that I'm not able to pull off at all. I think I'm pretty good at the game, but it's way beyond me. On my current level there's nothing I can do to increase my score outside of getting to the end of the game with as many lives in stock as possible.

[Randorama]

Well, in Rainbow Islands you can squeeze each Stage for secret items and the killing of grouped enemies as in Bubble Bobble. In one form or another, it appears in several other Taito games in one form or another. I forgot: Beraboh Man (Taito, 1984) is an intriguing puzzle-platform-single screen game which awards progressively increasing bonuses for clearing stages without deaths or mistakes. Stages become progressively tough, and the game seems to loop endlessly.

Also, +1 for 1986 or perhaps 1987 being a cut-off point in the evolution of score-driven games. I believe that arcade games in the 1988-1990 period veered a bit into the "story mode" direction (i.e. 1-CC'ing the game to discover the full plot), leaving the focus on score opportunities aside, to an extent. I wonder what results may come up, if someone sits down and analyses games with score-rich mechanics/opportunities vs. "simpler" games, year by year. I think that games combining the 1-CC/story approach and complex scoring mechanics started becoming predominant in 1992 or 1993, across various genres, but I am pretty sure that memory is failing me

EDIT:

Land Maker is an obscure Taito vs. puzzle game (pit/dropping items) sub-genre that has also an interesting way to push the score to the counter-stop. I am half-tempted to also propose Solomon's Key and Rygar as games with interesting score systems. Good...well, I leave the evaluation to readers.

[1000Eyes]

Rainbow Islands (...)

I always wanted to get into Rainbow Islands. I have a lot of distant respect for Fukio Mitsuji, but I must admit his games have a reputation for being opaque so it scared me off for a while. So if I understand correctly, the idea is that to really play the game you must collect diamonds in an order in each world, right? So is there any point in grabbing the regular score items? So there's a clean binary between mastery run vs survival run, barring high level scoring strats? Seems very different from Bubble Bobble.

[Sumez]

I always wanted to get into Rainbow Islands. I have a lot of distant respect for Fukio Mitsuji, but I must admit his games have a reputation for being opaque so it scared me off for a while. So if I understand correctly, the idea is that to really play the game you must collect diamonds in an order in each world, right? So is there any point in grabbing the regular score items? So there's a clean binary between mastery run vs survival run, barring high level scoring strats? Seems very different from Bubble Bobble.

Getting the diamonds in order is by no means required.
Getting all diamond colors on each Island (in any order) *is* required though, otherwise the game will end after the first 7 islands, short of the point where it gets really interesting and challenging.
Going for regular score items is completely irrelevant.
However, going for every other powerup is generally recommended. There is no bad powerup (though the stopwatch *can* fuck you over), and usually picking up some triggers the appearance of new better ones, often resulting in nice bonuses which will carry you through parts of a stage for free.

That said, as long as you're getting diamonds from most enemies you kill, getting every diamond isn't difficult. I'd say the only islands where you might need to go out of your way to make sure you get them is on the first and second (since they have a lower enemy density), and the Arkanoid island (due to the super short time limit). For the rest you'll probably get it without intentionally going for it. But do pay attention if you're still missing any colors while on the fourth round of an island.

There's a little overlap between "mastery run" and "survival run", in the sense that a true mastery run goes for the correct diamond order on every single island, which is incredibly difficult on some islands. But for a survival run I'd strongly suggest still going for the correct order on the first three islands. The reason is that doing so gives you permanent powerups which makes recovery on a death much more feasible down the road.

Especially the first two islands are pretty easy to plan a consistent route for, to get the correct order. While on the third you'll probably be more likely to have to improvise and be careful of what you pick up. I recommend trying to form a plan for those as soon as you start getting a feel for the game controls and mechanics.
The important thing to keep in mind is that picking up a color you already had will never screw up your order, so the earliest are the most risky ones, while the more you pick up, the less likely you are to mess up.
Also, every third enemy drops a powerup instead of a score item or diamond, no matter how you killed them. This is important to keep in mind so you don't waste a setup for a specific color drop on an enemy who wasn't even going to drop one.
For the first round of the game (which is as low-risk as the game ever gets), I always go for a specific route which picks up nearly all the diamonds I need, so I don't need to think about them at all for the rest of that island. This is a really good location to practice the idea of getting the exact color you want, and requires waiting around a bit for some of the enemies to turn red so they'll drop down from their ledge.

For some common movement tech, check out this super short video I made: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bbyb8aKdkm0

[LordHypnos]

I'm in a bit of deep water talking about these games as I haven't spend a massive amount of time on them, but here's a few from my recent explorations.

Puyo Puyo (Compile, later Sega series): Not sure if this is too much of a Tetris-like to count, but you can chain multiple puyo combos (not sure if this is the best term) together. Normally I find this to be pretty risky, as you have to set them up, and your ability to cash them in can be interrupted by nuisance puyos, but I imagine experienced players can do it much more reliably than me. In Puyo Pop Fever, you can enter a sort of special "fever" mode where there will be a big chain of combos set up if you drop the puyos into the right spot.

This is a good example of what I mean by a "chain" (around 1:48). I'm not sure how they're avoiding getting nuisance puyos. Maybe just by going fast enough, or maybe it's just some kind of mode that doesn't have them, either way it's a good example of the central scoring mechanic.

This game is also designed for PvP, so the single player mode is just versus a CPU if that matters to you.

Pirate Ship Higemaru (Capcom single screen game): In this game you wander through a maze made of barrels, which you can pick up and roll over other sailors. Once you clear all of the sailors you will move on to the next screen. There is also a Captain character who comes back after you roll over him. If you can roll over multiple enemies at once, you get more points. Some of the barrels have fish inside of them that you can pick up for more points. There's also an anchor item that freezes the screen for a little bit.

As you can see from that description, scoring probably consists of trying to roll the Captain multiple times, trying to combo enemies together, and collecting all of the fish on every screen. I haven't really played it enough to know whether it's a good scoring system (hopefully someone can comment), but it does seem to have enough mechanics to count. I imagine this is true of a lot of early 80s single screen games.

As a general video reference, here's LordBBH getting more points on probably his second time ever playing the game than I have gotten in like a dozen plays