I have both a 2chip and 1chip PAL SNES with an identical lockout switch installed (on pin 4) and am having issues with SA1 games only on the 1chip. They will only work if I kill mains power, turn the console on (to drain power), wait 5 seconds and then turn the mains back on; then they boot every time, but never if I turn the console off and back on again, or try loading them immediately after loading a different game.
So they only work on a "cold boot" on the 1chip, but work fine on my 2chip. These are SFC games; Super Mario RPG and Hoshi no Kirby Super Deluxe.
Scraping information on the Internet related to SA1 lockout, I tried every possible combination of the following mods to see if it would have any effect, but none of these helped:
* lift pin connected to cartridge port 56
* lift pin 1 and 2 on the lockout chip
* lift pin 1 and 2 on the lockout chip and short the pads under them (ie connect in 24 and 55 on the cartridge port)
* on the game, lift pin 127, leave it floating
* on the game, lift pin 127, connect to 5v
I wonder if anyone has any insight into this issue. Maybe a supercic mod is a solution, and probably the next thing I'll try but I'm curious why this is only an issue on my 1chip, and if there's anything else to try before going down the supercic route.
PAL SNES 2chip vs 1chip SA1 lockout
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NewSchoolBoxer
- Posts: 369
- Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2019 2:53 pm
- Location: Atlanta, GA
Re: PAL SNES 2chip vs 1chip SA1 lockout
No reply so I'll say what little I know since I live in NTSC world.
SA1 carts have additional lockout protection as you know. They even detect for the mouse or multiout plugged in to prevent drawing too much power from the consoles. 1chips have more Game Genie hate compared to their 2chip siblings, so is feasible they also have more lockout and/or cart dumper protection comparable the SA1 games that were released around the same time.
I speculate that you have a race condition where on cold booting, the 1chip lockout firmware does not kick in before the game boots. Nice work.
My interpretation of this site is that disabling the PAL lockout chip with the switch prevents any SA1 game from working on a "Newstyle" aka 1chip. Of course not disabling the lockout chip prevents NTSC SA1 from working. As in, PAL Kirby Super Star needs to see a PAL lockout chip, not a disabled or switched off chip. For normal boot to work for NTSC SA1 you need to install the equivalent of an NTSC lockout chip on the console like the supercic mod.
If you're going supercic, you may also want to consider the dual frequency oscillator mod to play NTSC without slowdown on the same PCB. Else import a Super Famicom from Japan and use a DC power supply. On US eBay I imported one for $40 USD and it shipped in less than 5 days from Japan. Maybe your country's import duty situation is a problem but I didn't get hit with any fee.
SA1 carts have additional lockout protection as you know. They even detect for the mouse or multiout plugged in to prevent drawing too much power from the consoles. 1chips have more Game Genie hate compared to their 2chip siblings, so is feasible they also have more lockout and/or cart dumper protection comparable the SA1 games that were released around the same time.
I speculate that you have a race condition where on cold booting, the 1chip lockout firmware does not kick in before the game boots. Nice work.
My interpretation of this site is that disabling the PAL lockout chip with the switch prevents any SA1 game from working on a "Newstyle" aka 1chip. Of course not disabling the lockout chip prevents NTSC SA1 from working. As in, PAL Kirby Super Star needs to see a PAL lockout chip, not a disabled or switched off chip. For normal boot to work for NTSC SA1 you need to install the equivalent of an NTSC lockout chip on the console like the supercic mod.
If you're going supercic, you may also want to consider the dual frequency oscillator mod to play NTSC without slowdown on the same PCB. Else import a Super Famicom from Japan and use a DC power supply. On US eBay I imported one for $40 USD and it shipped in less than 5 days from Japan. Maybe your country's import duty situation is a problem but I didn't get hit with any fee.
Re: PAL SNES 2chip vs 1chip SA1 lockout
Thanks for the reply, I forgot I posted this or I would have followed up. I did buy a supercic (dual oscillator), stuck that into my 1chip and problem solved, everything works without any trouble. I do also have a Super Famicom (and Super Famicom Jr) but to save space I was hoping to have just one console out to play both sets of games. Sorted!