Recommended arcade stick to replace default?

[SPM]

Hi.

I want to upgrade my 8bitdo arcade stick with a better lever, but have no idea where to start.

The website says it is compatible with "Sanwa JLF / Sanwa JLW Seimitsu / LS 33, 55, 56, 58".

What would you recommend? I'd like it to go back to neutral faster and with less flickback. It would also be good being able to hit the switches with less travel-distance (especially diagonals! Seitmitsu seems better for that) and having a less loose lever (it's kind of loose in its neutral position, where it wiggles quite freely).

Also, if buying a pack is cheaper than just parts, I may want to go for stiffer buttons as well (to rest my fingers on them without actually pressing them down)

Thanks

[SPM]

After watching this video I think Seimitsu is my choice (both buttons and lever).
Sanwa vs Hayabusa Vs Seimitsu Review Detail Comparison 2019 HD

Are any of the aforementioned "LS 33, 55, 56, 58" worth it compared to the only one I heard about "LS 32"? Or should I go with the LS 32 and grind the plate to fit it in?

Also, any aliexpress links to buy them? I only see super cheap copies, whereas sanwa is everywhere

[Dochartaigh]

I just installed both a Sanwa and Seimitsu stick in two of my fightsticks – maybe a couple months ago now. Did this because there's THOUSANDS of posts and reviews saying one is better for shmups, another is better for fighting games, use this if you life shorter throw, use this optional gate one for better diagonals etc. etc. etc. Bought every type of gate for each as well... And you could blind pepsi test me with them and I would have ZERO idea which is which... neither have any of my rare inoculated friends I've had over to the house since I added them notice any difference either. Not saying there isn't a difference... just that myself, and nobody I know so far, is at that level to notice a darn iota of difference lol.

I go more towards Sanwa as they're supposed to be more durable and with a bunch of family members kids (just like in the arcades) hopefully stick/button-smashing the crap out of these when things get back to normal I like the idea of that extra durability as well.

[bigbadboaz]

I find it really hard to believe you can't tell any difference in feel among them. Preference varies and I've certainly disagreed with some advice I've followed in the past, but every lever I own works in a distinctly different manner.

About that preference thing.. your opinion is your own but the vast majority are going to say stay AWAY from Sanwa for shmupping, at least without serious mods. Too loose and too much throw. It's true that durability and quality are great but those have little to do with gameplay characteristics.

To OP, I would start with the LS-56. It has a relatively stiff spring which helps with precision, very short engage by default which you are looking for, and you can order it with a Kowal short-throw set to make it the best in that regard. You can also order an LS-58 spring alongside it in case you want to try a looser tension on the same setup. These mods will only add $4 to the purchase of the stick.. For a first try this is easily the most likely to give you the traits you are talking about.

Keep in mind the 8bitdo stick is not so "ultra-moddable" as they claim and you're going to have to do a little bit more work to switch sticks with it than with the majority of commercial sticks which take a 5-pin connector.

[SPM]

Thanks! I think I'll do that and go for the LS-56 and the extra 58 spring (and PS-14-G buttons). I'll probably get it from akishop since focusattack and arcadeworlduk are more expensive (and those 3 seem to be the main options), so the mod will have to wait (they don't sell it there).

Any other recommendation will be appreciated. A first timer here

About modding, I've seen there are several options. Will likely just solder those 5 cables to the board pads. (I'm going for the -01 version. Should I go for the "fasten" version instead?)

[bigbadboaz]

You need to get the -01 in order for the short-throw spacers to be compatible. As long as you understand how to wire it without the 5-pin connector, you're fine.

I would order from Focus and get the mod at the same time. It's $2 there, and ordering from Aki (have you ever done it?) can be excruciating. They don't stock anything - only aggregate orders for a while until they forward everything as a batch to the suppliers - so you have to wait indefinitely for the order to actually ship, sometimes with no updates for weeks. You'll occasionally hear people wonder if the store has gone out of business without telling them.. whatever you think you're going to save, it won't be worth it especially if you can't get the mod with your order.

PS-14-G - a lot of people like them, but do you know they are completely flat? I don't like that personally at all. I prefer the GNs, and even more the PS-15, which are closer to a Sanwa button in design. As long as you know what you're choosing -

[Dochartaigh]

I find it really hard to believe you can't tell any difference in feel among them. Preference varies and I've certainly disagreed with some advice I've followed in the past, but every lever I own works in a distinctly different manner.

Correct. No difference to me and a ~half dozen casual gamers (just like me) who I had try both (we would try one for a bit, switch, then go back to original - with each being in the same case nobody could tell any notable difference). It's a stick. They both stick up pretty much the same amount. Ball tops are identical besides color. They go in a circle and make clicking noises. They seem to go about as far left/right/up/down as each other. Minimum difference (if any noticeable and rememberable) in how much force is needed to make them go in any direction.

The novices amongst us are happy if they can get a Hadouken above ~80% of the time repeatedly. Even for me, after months of practice (and by practice I say spurts of an hour here or there, maybe twice a week - that would be a lot actually.... probably 2-3 hours a day for a couple days when I very first got them). I'm happy if I can do a Shoryuken with any degree of repeatability (fireballs, tornado kicks, throws I'm awesome at now though lol).

If we leave the fighting game genre and move over to shmups, normal people, even ones who own dozens of XBO/PS4 games and have played video games since they were 6 or so back in the 80's don't even know what a "shmup" is (I've used the term and every single time I'm asked what that is), so no need to even get into how these sticks *might* *perhaps* *extremely minutely* *really-but-not-really* differ when playing shoot em ups.

Sticks (do people really call these "levers"? lol) in question are Sanwa JLF, and Seimitsu LS-56 (Arcade shocks 'exclusive' version they sell with multiple springs... only way I could get the adapter plate at the time... I left the stock spring in it).

[SPM]

Well... the "lever" term might just be me with my lack of knowledge on the matter and my poor English. I used it to differenciate it from the whole stick (the whole arcade "controller" with buttons, cases and such).

ordering from Aki (have you ever done it?) can be excruciating.

We'll find out I guess... I just bought it after my previous post!

PS-14-G - a lot of people like them, but do you know they are completely flat? I don't like that personally at all. I prefer the GNs, and even more the PS-15, which are closer to a Sanwa button in design. As long as you know what you're choosing -

I got them for their stiffness. Don't know if I'll like the flat surface. Thought I wouldn't mind...

[Johnpv]

I feel like this a hard thing to recommend for some one since there's so much personal preference in it. I went Sanwa, but I also added a heavier spring and a larger actuator, but doing that they work pretty great for me. That's me though.

[Wilsoncqb1911]

It's funny this just came up as I'm looking at changing the stick on my 8bitdo as well.

I have been playing on a JLF for years on a Panzer III. I upgraded the spring to 2 lbs. I tried the 4 lb and it was too much for me. 2 lbs feels right, but I might want to try 3 at some point. I just recently replaced the stick with a Seimitsu 56 from Arcade Shock. Now keep in mind that I'm really used to the JLF because I've been using it for years. This is my first try at Seimitsu. I can tell that there's a shorter throw and it is more responsive. It's a bit lighter than my 2 lb spring in the JLF but I'm going to stay with it stock and see if I mind. Overall I would say that the Seimitsu is nice. The difference isn't night and day but I think I like the Seimitsu better for shmups, as others have noticed.

You might also try Hayabusa's levers. I really like them as well. I have one on my RAP for the Switch and it's great. I might even like their buttons more than Sanwa.

The stock 8bitdo lever and buttons aren't bad either. it took me a little while to get used to since the stick is floppier, but it's still playable. It's like 80% of the JLF in terms of quality IMO. I am going to change it though, but I don't think it's absolutely required. The buttons are similarly ok, and they get more of a pass since you are basically just holding them down when you play a shmup. Maybe if I played fighters I'd care more.

[SPM]

I just recently replaced the stick with a Seimitsu 56 from Arcade Shock.

Did you use the stock 8bitdo plate or the seimitsu SE? I've read it slightly scraches the bottom case with the SE.

The buttons are similarly ok, and they get more of a pass since you are basically just holding them down when you play a shmup. Maybe if I played fighters I'd care more.

That's true with the autofire button (which I may keep the stock one for - only if the seimitsu's resistance gets tiring for long sessions) but with the rest, especially bombs, hypers and special uses, I NEED these stiff buttons (I just keep pressing them accidentally)

[Wilsoncqb1911]

I just recently replaced the stick with a Seimitsu 56 from Arcade Shock.

Did you use the stock 8bitdo plate or the seimitsu SE? I've read it slightly scraches the bottom case with the SE.

The buttons are similarly ok, and they get more of a pass since you are basically just holding them down when you play a shmup. Maybe if I played fighters I'd care more.

That's true with the autofire button (which I may keep the stock one for - only if the seimitsu's resistance gets tiring for long sessions) but with the rest, especially bombs, hypers and special uses, I NEED these stiff buttons (I just keep pressing them accidentally)

I put the Seimitsu in my Panzer III so I'm not sure how it fits in the 8bitdo. I think I'll put a JLF in the 8bitdo.

[Dochartaigh]

The difference isn't night and day

I should have put this analogy/story in my last post as I think it really fits: things like joystick or "lever" preference and perceived differences (and similarly different levels of CRT's from consumer to professional to broadcast, upscalers, different emulators, etc. etc. etc.) really is like fine wine...

Some people can tell the difference between a $10 bottle and a $20 bottle. Others, considered professionals, even gone to college/graduate school for this (if you believe that lol lol), have failed the $20 vs. ~$1,000 test, and/or thought that the $20 wine labeled as a $1000 wine (when they were both the SAME exact wine) thought that the $20 wine was crap and the $1000 wine was superb... this has happened, through scores (probably hundreds) of scientific tests over and over and over again... All proving most of this stuff (not all, but a LOT) is simply in the person's head, nothing more. Good read:

https://www.theatlantic.com/health/arch ... ad/247240/

I honestly think what we're talking about here falls into that category megalithically. And to the OP, seriously try both - no harm, these are pretty cheap after all – what? like $25-35 for each stick? See if you prefer one over the other. Either way pickup another cheap stick off Craigslist (if you don't have another) and put the other stick in it for a friend to use!

[Wilsoncqb1911]

The difference isn't night and day

I should have put this analogy/story in my last post as I think it really fits: things like joystick or "lever" preference and perceived differences (and similarly different levels of CRT's from consumer to professional to broadcast, upscalers, different emulators, etc. etc. etc.) really is like fine wine...

Some people can tell the difference between a $10 bottle and a $20 bottle. Others, considered professionals, even gone to college/graduate school for this (if you believe that lol lol), have failed the $20 vs. ~$1,000 test, and/or thought that the $20 wine labeled as a $1000 wine (when they were both the SAME exact wine) thought that the $20 wine was crap and the $1000 wine was superb... this has happened, through scores (probably hundreds) of scientific tests over and over and over again... All proving most of this stuff (not all, but a LOT) is simply in the person's head, nothing more. Good read:

https://www.theatlantic.com/health/arch ... ad/247240/

I honestly think what we're talking about here falls into that category megalithically. And to the OP, seriously try both - no harm, these are pretty cheap after all – what? like $25-35 for each stick? See if you prefer one over the other. Either way pickup another cheap stick off Craigslist (if you don't have another) and put the other stick in it for a friend to use!

Yeah, I dont think it matters at all which one chooses. Sometimes I play and I think I'd like to go back to the JLF since mine has a stronger spring. I do think the Seimitsu has a shorter throw and and requires less movement to activate. It has a shorter shaft which may be all of the reason. No stick is going to change your skill level though.

[emphatic]

Over the years, I have experimented a lot with different brands (SUZO, Magstick, SANWA JLW and JLF, Seimitsu LS-32 and 56). Hours of modding, testing, what have you.

I'm very happy with SANWA JLF with a KOWAL oversize actuator and 2LB spring and octo gate. The gate shape is really only useful though if you ride the gate a lot while playing. Great in games like Out Zone. IMHO, SANWA feels a lot better built than Seimitsus, but it's been a couple of years since I decided to stick (pun intended) with SANWA.

I bought but never installed and tried the KOWAL short throw mod for LS-56, but I imagine it should be good.

For buttons though, I've never liked SANWA. They're hair trigger buttons, so too easy to bomb by accident. Also, they are over sensitive to direct sunlight, so they will be discolored pretty easy, if that's important to you. Seimitsu buttons are great, I prefer the feel of the snap-ins over screw-ins. Very good for mashing or just holding them pressed for a long time (CAVE games ) Full disclaimer, I'm using Samducksa buttons now. They look and feel a lot like Seimitsu, but they click a bit when actuated.