Dreamcast HDMI Mod

[austin532]

I'm trying to get the best picture out of the Dreamcast and was wondering if it is worth waiting for the Dreamcast HDMI Mod or should I just bite the bullet and get a Toro and a VGA to HDMI converter? I believe the boards will be coming out sometime early next year.

[Fudoh]

By using a VGA to HDMI converter you will always lose resolution. That's a problem caused by the DC's SMPTE signal timing. Full resolution is only possible if you use a VGA to component transcoder along with a component to HDMI converter. Then it's perfect. I would expect the same from any HDMI mod.

Do you have a link to the DC HDMI project ?

[Guspaz]

http://assemblergames.com/l/threads/hdm ... les.56044/

It's more of a generic mod, though, intended to add HDMI to any console that has digital RGB signals that can be tapped, be it a GameGear or Dreamcast.

[austin532]

It's still sounds interesting and I will be keeping an eye on it. The videos he has shown so far look pretty good.

[zakruowrath]

I think electronash is developing the mod to hook up directly to the digital lines of the Dreamcast processors kind of like what Marshall is doing with the UltraHDMI N64. The results looks pretty damn good to be, however I've never seen Dreamcast VGA in person yet. Here's Daytona USA running at 60fps on his mod:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cNuqMp6eemI

He has a lot of other games he tested which look wonderful with the mod, I'd love to see VGA vs HDMI comparison screenshots and videos when he gets into the later stages of the mod.

[D]

Cool mod, but in practice the quality will not be notably better than VGA. dc's vga is purrrfect. Please correct me if I'm wrong...
It might upscale better to a higher resolution that matches the monitor/tv
Still cool to have, my tv has no vga input. Didn't think I'd get a dc again. Wrong!
The dreamcast's vga signal is crisp as hell. It would take 7 years with the arrival of the ps3 which has HDMI to top it. I know it's possible to get VGA out of ps2/gc & xbox, but cables and adapters are pretty uncommon. Now a ps2 and GC hdmi mod, I'd be all over that! It will happen!

[Guspaz]

Using VGA on the dreamcast on a digital TV involves converting from digital to analog and back to digital: there is a loss in quality there. Modern TVs also often lack VGA inputs.

[austin532]

Now a ps2 and GC hdmi mod, I'd be all over that! It will happen!

I know he is also working on a GC HDMI mod as well. Not sure about PS2 but that would be great. It desperately needs it.

[bobrocks95]

I know he is also working on a GC HDMI mod as well. Not sure about PS2 but that would be great. It desperately needs it.

Gamecube HDMI is already out, still waiting on PS2. It probably has another very difficult to solder to chip though that would require a ribbon cable.

[antron]

Gamecube HDMI is already out

Really, where? I see development but nothing purchasable.

[bobrocks95]

Really, where? I see development but nothing purchasable.

It currently targets the Pluto-IIx HDMI FPGA dev board which you can buy right now. If you're waiting on a cable, it won't ever happen. If you're waiting for a smaller/cheaper board Badassconsoles might have one out before the end of the year.

[BuckoA51]

Cool mod, but in practice the quality will not be notably better than VGA. dc's vga is purrrfect. Please correct me if I'm wrong...

In most situations you lose resolution due to the DC's weird SMPTE signal timing, so a HDMI mod if implemented correctly could be way better.

Really, where? I see development but nothing purchasable.

For Gamecube HDMI we'll have the fitting service available again tomorrow (27/11/15) but quantities will be limited, though once we have the initial batch done we can take on more.

[parodius]

Full resolution is only possible if you use a VGA to component transcoder along with a component to HDMI converter. Then it's perfect.

I'm going that route. Currently shopping for the component to HDMI converter.
Anybody has some experience with any of those 3 types ?
Type 1 - Lenkeng ?
Type 2 - plastic
Type 3 - metal
Tempted to buy the Type 3.

[Fudoh]

I have all three. With #3 (Ligawo branded version) I had problems getting a picture on my Sony.

[panzeroceania]

I wonder how difficult it would be to get an SDI output board instead of an HDMI one, my monitors all use RGBHV and SDI.

[Fudoh]

480p isn't a valid SDI timing, is it ?

[Unseen]

480p isn't a valid SDI timing, is it ?

SMPTE 344M, ED-SDI, 540 MBit/s

[Fudoh]

ok, I accept defeat

But a bonus consideration: I think the Sony BVMs still don't support. And the majority of other equipment doesn't either. At not a single video processor I ever had (and that covers 10+ years) would accept that.

[Guspaz]

Most HD-SDI gear that I've seen won't do it. For example, Monoprice's HD-SDI converter (which is really a 3G-SDI converter) will do 525i and 625i (which are SD-SDI at as low as 270 Mbps) and they'll do 1080p60 (which is 2.97 Gbps) but they won't do 480p. I found that out the hard way. Wouldn't do 480i either. Of course, all our gear supported 1080i, but the stupid venue's network wouldn't do any more than SD-SDI, so we were completely unable to do anything... Grr...

Anyhow, the BKM-142HD for the L5 PVMs won't go below 720p, and the BKM-20D/BKM-21D for the BVMs only do 525i/625i.

[Fudoh]

will do 525i and 625i (which are SD-SDI at as low as 270 Mbps) and they'll do 1080p60 (which is 2.97 Gbps) but they won't do 480p. I found that out the hard way. Wouldn't do 480i either.

technically 480i and 525i are the same - just different denominations, so not sure what your problem here was.

[Guspaz]

Perhaps the venue's network wasn't up to even that? The quality of analog video was pretty terrible when we fell back to that.

After years of trying different things, we finally just threw in the towel and streamed the video over their network, which is gigabit capable. That let us do 1080i60 without issue.

[panzeroceania]

ok, I accept defeat

But a bonus consideration: I think the Sony BVMs still don't support. And the majority of other equipment doesn't either. At not a single video processor I ever had (and that covers 10+ years) would accept that.

what about the BVM-A20F1 ?

http://www.themobileunit.com/Brochures/ ... vm-a_2.pdf

the brochure says it accepts 525p "SMPTE 293M" Enhanced Definition

525/59.94/1:1 -- 720 -- 483 -- 59.94Hz -- 27MHz -- 858 -- 525 -- 31.469kHz -- SMPTE 293M / Rec.ITU-R BT.1358

I'd love to do SDI mods for my NES, N64, Gamecube, Dreamcast, they all have HDMI mods at this point, but for me SDI to a BVM or CRT projector would be the best case scenario.

EDIT :

hmm, it appears that's only via the Analog input board, not the SDI board

[Fudoh]

I'd love to do SDI mods for my NES, N64, Gamecube, Dreamcast, they all have HDMI mods at this point, but for me SDI to a BVM or CRT projector would be the best case scenario.

why ? these are analogue displays. What do you think you gain by creating a digital connection that needs to be converted back to analogue anyway ?

[Guspaz]

The DACs on the BVM SDI board may be better than the DACs in the consoles.

[panzeroceania]

same reason people do SPDIF or HDMI mods. honestly I'm perfectly happy with high quality analog signals, but I like to tinker. In theory bringing the digital signal right to the CRT minimizes chances of signal degradation.

[Fudoh]

I agree with that. After all I've been using a SDI DVD player since 2004 or so... But I think it needs to make a difference. If I can't spot it, I would say it's not worth it.

[Guspaz]

For the Genesis or the NESRGB? Probably not. But if somebody did an HDMI mod for the SNES (one that didn't just convert from RGB internally)? Then you'd see quite an improvement, since not everybody has a 1chip.

That and avoiding things like jailbars, which even consoles with good RGB output can suffer from.

[austin532]

Alright now that I have enough, what are the best VGA to Component and Component to HDMI devices out there? Audio Authority and Atlona tend to get good reviews. Zero lag and zero loss of quality is optimal.

[Fudoh]

There aren't exactly many transcoders to choose from. For the DC's signal 31khz signal you can use whatever you can find. There shouldn't be any difference. Audio Authority's great. To go from component to HDMI I didn't see any difference between a chinese $25 converter and a Gefen for $200. The cheap ones all convert to YCbCr (and so does the Gefen). If you need RGB output, it might get more complicated.

[austin532]

Ok, stupid question but are transcoders and converters the same? People say yes but I just want to clarify because the AA is a VGA to Component "Converter" not transcoder. I do plan on buying it since there should be no lag or signal loss.

As for a Component to HDMI device I'm not sure what the best one to get is. The Gefen looks good as it has RCA where as the Atlona only has Optical. I'd rather not get the cheap Chinese ones. Again zero lag and zero loss of signal is best but I'm guessing that's not possible due to the analog/digital conversion?