DSC-1024 Scan Converter...who has one? (need a little help)

[segasonicfan]

So I got my DSC-1024HD in the mail today and was STOAKED until I noticed a major problem. I'm using it primarily as a downscaller to 15khz RGB and I notice my image is *very* blurry on the output, like there is ghosting over everything. This only happens when the image is moving fast like with Sonic or a shmup. Fiddling with all the settings did not seem to fix this. Even with RGB 15khz input to the processed output it does with, with and without the "genlock" being active.

I presume its because it is removing the interlacing or something...anyone experience this or know a fix for it? Such a cool converter otherwise, it even has a button to freeze the output for image stills!

[Fudoh]

I had one a few years ago, but didn't find much use in it for video game setups.

Your's scan converting to 15khz from what input ? The DSC does not support 240p output, but only 480i. What display have you connected the Sony to ?

[segasonicfan]

Hey Fudoh, thanks for the fast reply!

The thing is I'm just inputting a 15khz signal for now. I tried both a composite and an RGB 15khz signal (so it is essentially a passthrough). The reason for this is that I am using it for its zoom and other features, especially for the Game Gear TV out mod like this guy did:

http://www.lcv.ne.jp/~mgs1987/sega/gg10.html
http://www.smspower.org/forums/files/gg_full_137.gif

On composite the image looks especially blurry even standing still, though it is playable. With RGB the image is nice and sharp but blurs/ghosts horribly if there is fast scrolling either vertically or horizontally. Ironically, it resembles the original Game Gear display

I'm guessing that either my unity is broken (unlikely) or that this has something to do with it upscanning *every* signal internally before outputting it back down to 480i and then it can't keep up with with the frame rate so it ghosts it instead of tearing? It's very strange indeed. I can take a video of it later if that helps.

The display I'm using is custom, it's a consumer CRT I hacked to be RGB many years ago. It has worked perfect with native console RGB outputs, many scan converters (XRGB, TVator, Extron, etc), and other stuff over the years.


EDIT: after more testing, I found the ghosting issue happens even with composite video input I also double checked the cable wiring for the RGB output and made sure all seven grounds were connected. No dice. Also tried changing ever possible setting I could find :/ I don't understand how anyone could make a downscanner that would ghost this badly.
-Segasonicfan

[Fudoh]

this has something to do with it upscanning *every* signal internally before outputting it back down to 480i

this! If you want working zoom/overscan controls you have to do it on a 31khz+ signal. Can't be done in an interlaced domain.

and then it can't keep up with with the frame rate so it ghosts it instead of tearing? It's very strange indeed. I can take a video of it later if that helps.

video would be nice, but I would assume that it's just a terrible video deinterlacer that kills half the resolution.

I needed to do a similar thing to run Super Hang On (360) on a 4:3 display. See here (from my scanline website):



To do that with really great results you have to use a XRGB on the GG's output and an Extron VSC to bring it back down to 15khz and apply the geometry controls. I did this with a 360's 480p VGA output. I could imagine that the combo of a XRGB plus the Sony DSC is able to do the same. Key to your problem should be to use a 31khz input and not a 15khz one.

To get perfect results on a LCD you would use a Framemeister which has varible zoom controls for systems like PSP or the GBA Player. The XRGB got a PSP zoom function in B0 mode, which might also work nicely on a GG's output.

[segasonicfan]

Thanks for the info
what a bummer! I don't understand why they would have it accept NTSC in the first place if it can't output it correctly? I mean this thing was *expensive* when it was released and it is essentially useless as an NTSC converter of any kind.

That means the composite, S-video, and component inputs are worthless :/ I tried it just now as a VGA downscaler and it looks really good though (better than extron actually). So I think you are right, it has an el crapo deinterlacer. What a freaking mess, I want to kick myself for actually purchasing something branded Sony and thinking it would work well.

So basically I have to use and XRGB or similar to upscan and then downscan separately because the DSC1024 upscanning essentially doesn't work. ah well.

[Fudoh]

I would still appreciate a small video - you can upload it privately on youtube and send me a link.

For 240p content it could be a deinterlacing problem. Did you - just for fun - try a 480i source ?

[segasonicfan]

I would still appreciate a small video - you can upload it privately on youtube and send me a link.

no problem, Ill make one for ya within the next few days.

For 240p content it could be a deinterlacing problem. Did you - just for fun - try a 480i source ?

Just tried a GBA with Innovation TV out (480i judging from RetroRGB's site) and it had the same nasty ghosting.

[segasonicfan]

OK, here are some videos:
https://youtu.be/YMJ9PQkXIOk
https://youtu.be/y0zYuDL--SA

The blur is surprisingly hard to capture on camera- it just looks like my camera is the cause of it. But trust me, the background looks awful and blurry even in RGB. I showed a friend and he was blown away at how bad it was.

This was all captured in composite to show how freaking awful the decoder looks too. Bad colors and extra, extra blurry. Also, no brightness control is available.

Sony makes me so angry with their crappy products.

Thanks again for your replies Fudoh and helping me figure this out. Your time and input is much appreciated

-Segasonicfan

[hyrulebr]

Sorry for resurrecting this old topic.

I have the chance to buy a DSC-1024G for a reasonable price. But I did not like that it recognizes 240p as 480i. Does the "G" model have the same hardware as the "HD" model? I did not find this reference anywhere ...

[segasonicfan]

stay away from this turd. Seriously, these units are trash.

[hyrulebr]

stay away from this turd. Seriously, these units are trash.

I feared that the hardware was the same because they look the same externally... Too bad. It is an interesting unit on paper and very easy to use.

Thanks for the help!