Suggested Shmups for someone starting out

Paperclip · Post by **Paperclip** » Tue Aug 12, 2014 9:21 pm

Ok, so I'm playing through Jamestown and just defeated the final boss. I intend to keep on playing and trying to beat it on Divine, which will most likely take me awhile to do. However, I was wondering what other Shmups are a good step forward from Jamestown. The Dodonpachi series looks good but I don't own an X-Box 360. I actually wouldn't mind buying one since I can get a used one for pretty cheap, however it looks as though all of the good Cave Shmups are Japan only and I'm not sure if they're region locked so I'd hate to buy a system for games I can't even play on it. I did purchase the Exceed trilogy on Steam for super cheap so that should be fun.

So, any advice either about the Dodonpachi series or any other shmups that might be up my alley would be hugely appreciated. I'm finding the challenge to be extremely addictive and would like to keep going.

professor ganson · Post by **professor ganson** » Tue Aug 12, 2014 9:36 pm

There are lots of good shmups for the 360 that are region free. That might be your best bet, since older systems (PS1, Saturn, PS2) are also going to require importing for best results.

TransatlanticFoe · Post by **TransatlanticFoe** » Tue Aug 12, 2014 9:53 pm

You won't be missing out on much with a non-Japanese 360 because a load of them are region free. I've marked with a * the ones you can actually get at affordable prices via reprint editions (which are also region free) - certainly around the going rate for a lot of the cheaper stuff on Saturn/Dreamcast.

Bullet Soul
Bullet Soul Infinite Burst
Dodonpachi Saidaioujou *
Eschatos *
ESPGaluda II
Game Centre Love
Ginga Force *
Ginga Force & Eschatos Wonder Pack *
Muchi Muchi Pork & Pink Sweets
Mushihimesama Futari *
Shooting Love 10th anniversary. XIIZEAL & ΔZEAL

Then you have the ones which were localised (all likely to be cheap as chips):

Akai Katana
Death Smiles
Dodonpachi Daifukkatsu (as Dodonpachi Resurrection)
Raiden Fighters Aces (North America only, not PAL)
Senko no Ronde (as Wartech: Senko no Ronde)
Under Defeat HD (PAL only, not North America)

mehguy · Post by **mehguy** » Tue Aug 12, 2014 10:23 pm

There are some none import shmups on the 360 such as raiden fighter aces and raiden 4. The 360 is probably the best console for modern shmups.

professor ganson · Post by **professor ganson** » Tue Aug 12, 2014 10:26 pm

mehguy wrote:The 360 is probably the best console for modern shmups.

A backwards compatible Jap PS2 is hard to beat.

FerociousSwan · Post by **FerociousSwan** » Tue Aug 12, 2014 10:29 pm

A few other region locked you would miss out on from not getting a JPN Console ...

Mushihimesama HD
Shooting Love 200X
Radirgy
DoDonPachi Daifukkatsu Black Label disc release (Ketsui Arrange Mode)
DoDonpachi Daioujou Black Label Extra
Ketsui

Plus a few others, so if you just exclusively want to play shoot em ups, it might be worth considering a JPN console

Paperclip · Post by **Paperclip** » Tue Aug 12, 2014 10:56 pm

Cool, thanks for all the good info. If I were looking for a JPN console, where is the best place to look online? That way I can compare prices with the US console and figure out whether it's worth it or not. In the meantime I'm going to keep working on the games I have.

The only problem I have is that time passes insanely fast playing this type of game. An hour seems like minutes.

Patashu · Post by **Patashu** » Tue Aug 12, 2014 10:58 pm

Paperclip wrote: So, any advice either about the Dodonpachi series or any other shmups that might be up my alley would be hugely appreciated. I'm finding the challenge to be extremely addictive and would like to keep going.

1) Get http://shmupmame.wordpress.com/download/
2) Everything on this list that isn't more recent than Espgaluda can be played in it, so go find ROMs for them: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CAVE_(comp ... _developed
3) Want more? Get Giga Wing, Mars Matrix, Psikyo's releases ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psikyo#Psikyo_releases ), Raizing's releases ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eighting#L ... .27s_games )... Or if you want a more exhaustive list, just look here: http://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=38524
4) Use savestates to practice, then assemble the 1CC run of your life. Don't forget to record input as .inp so you can record it/throw it on youtube/analyze mistakes/etc. In fact, even if you buy/own the game on a console, it's worth emulating it as well because savestates and input recording are soooo good.

The only problem I have is that time passes insanely fast playing this type of game. An hour seems like minutes.

Hah, you and me both!

LordHypnos · Post by **LordHypnos** » Tue Aug 12, 2014 11:46 pm

-Don't ignore developers just because they're not CAVE (though CAVE is also, obviously, good)
-If you have steam, Crimzon Clover: World Ignition is probably the most popular release in recent times 'round these parts
-If your computer is powerful enough, there's a lot of good Naomi shmups playable in Demul, NullDC, and Makaron, which probably won't run all that well in MAME. There may be other arcade emulators that I'm unaware of. These may be worth checking out.
-Lots of good free doujins around. Blue Wish Resurrection +, rRootage (probably my personal favorite doujin. You play individual stages in this rather than a full game, there are four modes, and around 40 stages in each, 1/4 of which are randomly generated. This one is very fun to play casually), Parsec 47, Eden's Aegis, XOP (which has several variations), oddmobs, and Hatenkou (requires X68000 emulator), just to name a few

Shoot away

Blackbird · Post by **Blackbird** » Wed Aug 13, 2014 1:31 am

Get Crimzon Clover! Fantastic game. It sounds like you're already pretty good at shmups if you can clear Jamestown, but Crimzon Clover has several modes of varying difficulty, from modestly difficult to Mushi Ultra-level hard. The game will last you a long time if you dig into the scoring system or try to 1CC the more difficult modes.

Here's a trailer.

Kaikan, Blue Wish Resurrection Plus, Touhou, and eXceed 3rd are all pretty easy to find, good, and inexpensive (or free!).

Paperclip · Post by **Paperclip** » Wed Aug 13, 2014 5:37 am

Patashu wrote:
Paperclip wrote: So, any advice either about the Dodonpachi series or any other shmups that might be up my alley would be hugely appreciated. I'm finding the challenge to be extremely addictive and would like to keep going.
1) Get http://shmupmame.wordpress.com/download/
2) Everything on this list that isn't more recent than Espgaluda can be played in it, so go find ROMs for them: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CAVE_(comp ... _developed
3) Want more? Get Giga Wing, Mars Matrix, Psikyo's releases ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psikyo#Psikyo_releases ), Raizing's releases ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eighting#L ... .27s_games )... Or if you want a more exhaustive list, just look here: http://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=38524
4) Use savestates to practice, then assemble the 1CC run of your life. Don't forget to record input as .inp so you can record it/throw it on youtube/analyze mistakes/etc. In fact, even if you buy/own the game on a console, it's worth emulating it as well because savestates and input recording are soooo good.

I got the emulator and I downloaded the original Donpachi. It works like a charm! There seem to be lots of games available to play with this emulator. Thanks for the great tip! I think this will keep me going for awhile yet.

I also got crimzon Clover on Steam and it's completely amazing. Even on Novice though it's still pretty tough for me.

The one thing, though, with these arcade port games, they make me a little lazy since I have infinite continues. I have to really focus to keep my edge. With something like Jamestown, I was constantly on high alert and I think it helped me do better. Guess it's just something I'll have to get used to.

jepjepjep · Post by **jepjepjep** » Wed Aug 13, 2014 5:55 am

Paperclip wrote: I got the emulator and I downloaded the original Donpachi. It works like a charm! There seem to be lots of games available to play with this emulator. Thanks for the great tip! I think this will keep me going for awhile yet.

That's a great place to start, but I'd suggest going with Dodonpachi first! Also recommend Batsugun Special to begin with.

Patashu · Post by **Patashu** » Wed Aug 13, 2014 6:15 am

Paperclip wrote: The one thing, though, with these arcade port games, they make me a little lazy since I have infinite continues. I have to really focus to keep my edge. With something like Jamestown, I was constantly on high alert and I think it helped me do better. Guess it's just something I'll have to get used to.

Well, you don't want to be constantly on edge unless you're trying to improve a personal best. That shit drains you -fast-. The point of practice, savestates, unlimited credits, etc is to make it really easy to isolate a problem you're having and come up with the best, most consistent way to break it down. The goal of learning how to play the game better should be your focus - you have to analyze mistakes and think hard about it. Don't just credit feed because you can credit feed, credit feed to get to the place you're practicing, basically.
Then you take what you've learned, pump all the adrenalin in and go for that 1CC

Paperclip · Post by **Paperclip** » Thu Aug 14, 2014 11:55 pm

Ok, so I've been really getting into Crimzon Clover per the suggestions of all you helpful folks. That game is addictive to me like cocaine (I've never actually done cocaine but I'm guessing

). I can 1CC Novice Original up to the 4th boss so far. Don't laugh, I know that's sad but I'm brand new to the scene (Just startedMonday evening with Jamestown) so you gotta cut me some slack

. I think this one could last me quite a long time if I try to get 1CCs for the various modes with the different ships.

I also went ahead and downloaded Raiden 4 for the PS3 and that's really fun also, but it's mega hard, at least for me. The bullets in that game are WAY faster and plus you have limited credits. I'm not sure whether CC or Raiden 4 is considered to be more difficult, but for me so far it's R4.

Blackbird · Post by **Blackbird** » Fri Aug 15, 2014 12:00 am

It's not just you. Raiden 4 is a legitimately difficult game - at least as difficult as Crimzon Clover's Arcade mode, and probably even harder. It's still a good game, but I'm not sure I would jump into it directly as a new player.

Glad you're enjoying Crimzon Clover =D. It's one of my favorite games.

Prinny · Post by **Prinny** » Fri Aug 15, 2014 12:22 am

I'd say once you get used to the feel of Crimzon Clover, you should try looking at some replays for reference on how to score and survive better(and maybe learn some tricks against the bosses). I believe Icarus and Neptas post some of their runs on youtube, so you can view those to have a better understanding of the game mechanics. I also posted two of my runs on the high score topic recently (you may need to rename the replay so it doesn't conflict with any of your current ones) that you can also look at.

Don't be surprised if you find yourself losing concentration and dying more often the longer you play. That might be a good sign to take a short break.

Paperclip · Post by **Paperclip** » Fri Aug 15, 2014 12:51 am

Prinny wrote:I'd say once you get used to the feel of Crimzon Clover, you should try looking at some replays for reference on how to score and survive better(and maybe learn some tricks against the bosses). I believe Icarus and Neptas post some of their runs on youtube, so you can view those to have a better understanding of the game mechanics. I also posted two of my runs on the high score topic recently (you may need to rename the replay so it doesn't conflict with any of your current ones) that you can also look at.

Don't be surprised if you find yourself losing concentration and dying more often the longer you play. That might be a good sign to take a short break.

Wow, I swear you're inside my head! That's exactly what happens after a few runs. I've learned that it's important to take breaks every 2 runs or so to reset my brain and rest my eyes.

As far as the bosses go, I find it interesting that they're actually the easiest part for me overall. I've managed to beat all of the first 5 bosses (the only ones I've had access to so far) without dying. It's the stuff in the stages that gets me the most. Stage 3 in particular seems to eat lots of lives. I always lose at least one life to those kamikaze spiked ball things that come from behind and to the side and are extremely frustrating

.

Illyrian · Post by **Illyrian** » Fri Aug 15, 2014 9:04 am

Remember you get a few moments of invincibility when you activate break mode so there's nothing stopping you from only activating it as a way to stave of death. It is less fun that way though, I think.

Astraea FGA Mk. I · Post by **Astraea FGA Mk. I** » Fri Aug 15, 2014 10:00 am

I bought an EU region Xbox 360 S, the region free NTSC-J Cave titles and the three Rising Star Games releases quite a while ago, but since got a NTSC-J 360 S and all of the Japanese version Cave releases. My PAL region Xbox is collecting dust, sadly going unplayed, connected to my big TV. So if you get hooked you will inevitably buy the Japanese Xbox so you may as well get it first. Unless you want to play home region non-shmup 360 games for some reason ^ ^

Stevas · Post by **Stevas** » Fri Aug 15, 2014 11:56 am

Raiden Fighters Aces (North America only, not PAL)

Still boils my fucking piss.

coffeyrt · Post by **coffeyrt** » Fri Aug 15, 2014 5:24 pm

I know giving assistance or selling modchips is not allowed here so I am going to walk a fine line. Why does everyone talk about importing japanese PS2s and Xboxs instead of just modding them to play out of region games? That seems like an easier and cheaper solution, while keeping the amount of redundant consoles down. I know I have done this with my PS2 and am planning on doing this with an Xbox 360.

BIL · Post by **BIL** » Fri Aug 15, 2014 6:08 pm

Stevas wrote:Raiden Fighters Aces (North America only, not PAL)

Still boils my fucking piss.

NEVER FORGET. GLORY WITH THE RFA PAL THREAD. MERCY ON EUROPA.

Some-Mist · Post by **Some-Mist** » Fri Aug 15, 2014 6:20 pm

full extent of the jam.pdf

as for suggestions, I would just go with what sticks out to you/what you enjoy.

Paperclip · Post by **Paperclip** » Sat Aug 16, 2014 10:02 am

Some-Mist wrote:full extent of the jam.pdf

as for suggestions, I would just go with what sticks out to you/what you enjoy.

Oh wow awesome guide thanks! I'll have to read through that as I have time.

I can 1CC up to the stage 5 boss on Novice Boost now. The thing that really gave me a lift was retrying stage 2 many, many times until I could consistently no miss on it. Being able to routinely no miss all the way until near the end of stage 3 is super helpful. I feel like I may need to do some retries on stage 4 though since that seems to be kinda tricky for me still.

There is absolutely nothing like the feeling of breaking through a wall on this game and getting even just a little bit farther. It really is addictive and amazing. I think I may be hooked on shmups in general now. Hope I don't get burned out though.

Special World · Post by **Special World** » Sat Aug 16, 2014 1:50 pm

If you have a Wii (or bought one for cheap) there are actually a ton of great scrolling shooter options between the console's library and the virtual console. It was actually the system that got me into scrolling shooters hardcore, after having dabbled with Gradius and Mars Matrix when I was younger.

Virtual Console has a ton of classic Turbografx / SNES / Genesis games, like:

Gate of Thunder (my favorite classic hori)
Lords of Thunder
Star Soldier
Star Parodier
Blazing Lazers
MUSHA
Alien Soldier
Super R-Type
R-Type 3
as well as Twinkle Star Sprites on the Japanese eshop

while the console itself has some somewhat lesser-known shooting titles like:

Milestone Shooting Collection (the second one is Japan-only)
Castle Shikigami 3
Blast Works
Sin and Punishment 2

It's actually a surprisingly good console for shooters, especially if you want to supplement the modern bullet hells with some classic horis. And they're really good for beginner players too, especially the Turbografx games. Although from your posts I think you're a bit better than beginner: I can't play Crimzon Clover for crap and I've been playing shmups for a good while now.

japanesesuperplayer · Post by **japanesesuperplayer** » Sat Aug 16, 2014 1:58 pm

TransatlanticFoe wrote:Bullet Soul

I agree, this game is fantastic for beginners.

nasty_wolverine · Post by **nasty_wolverine** » Sat Aug 16, 2014 3:00 pm

japanesesuperplayer wrote:
TransatlanticFoe wrote:Bullet Soul
I agree, this game is fantastic for beginners.

LOL

Paperclip · Post by **Paperclip** » Sun Aug 17, 2014 4:58 am

Actually, I've been mulling over the idea of streaming CCWI on Twitch. I haven't really streamed before (I tinkered with it awhile ago but I got kinda lazy and put it off) so I was wondering if anyone can recommend a good, beginner-friendly streaming program and/or a guide to setting up a basic stream on twitch.

Patashu · Post by **Patashu** » Sun Aug 17, 2014 5:00 am

Paperclip wrote:Actually, I've been mulling over the idea of streaming CCWI on Twitch. I haven't really streamed before (I tinkered with it awhile ago but I got kinda lazy and put it off) so I was wondering if anyone can recommend a good, beginner-friendly streaming program and/or a guide to setting up a basic stream on twitch.

Streaming PC games on twitch is braindead easy thanks to OBS.
1) Get this https://obsproject.com/download
2) Make a scene, in the scene capture the Crimzon Clover WORLD IGNITION window and set it as the base resolution of the stream with the button
3) Go into settings and fiddle with video/audio bitrate, and use preview stream/save stream locally to test
4) Make a twitch account, go here http://www.twitch.tv/patashu/dashboard/streamkey and plug the stream key into OBS
5) Now you can stream on twitch! Do a test stream to make sure it's watchable/listenable. Since this is CC:WI and all, stress test it with something with lots of bullets.

Lord Satori · Post by **Lord Satori** » Sun Aug 17, 2014 6:51 am

I like how people just list a barrage of Cave games and other various shmups that cost money. If you're just starting out, I'd suggest getting some freeware shmups before you decide whether or not you actually want to get into them. Even after you do, there are still plenty more to get.

shmups.system11.org

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