Most annoying shmup ever!

[DC906270]

I can play and enjoy most shmups, (except boring ones like Layer Section and Metal Black) but the ones that i really HATE and can't stand to play because they are so CHEAP and not even difficult skill-wise are :

1. Salamander
2. Super Star Soldier

Both PCE versions. In my view CHEAP has the following definitions :

1. You die because of poor visibility/clashing background colours and shapes with the sprites/bullets
2. You die at end of stage and unfairly go back to beginning of stage and then have to fly back through an easy level in order to get killed at the end again by the unfeasibly large (to screen size) boss and go back to beginning again
3. Enemies fly from edge of screen and kill you without warning
4. Poor collision detection (that bullet didnt even hit me!)
5. Gradius style scenery borders with power ups placed right next to scenery and an over abundance of speed ups and lack of enemies to shoot at leading to cheap death

I'm sure i coud could up with more if i tried. Anyway, anyone else have any pet-hates?

BTW, i dont treat "hard" as cheap, as i find Hellfire and Undeadline MD very playable

[nsonthi77@hotmail.com]

Fuzzy Shooter, period.

Its annoying b/c the difficulty level is rediculously high. I could honestly say its the hardest shooter ever made in exsistence. Enemy bullets fly at you so fast, you don't realize what hit you and you feel dumb founded. I gave up half an hr into the game and I realize I won't get far anyway. Hell fire got nothing on Fuzzy shooter.

[CIT]

As far as shmups go that are on whole pretty good, I would say Hellfire, R-Type I-III, Kyuukyoku Tiger (Megadrive version), Tatsujin Oh, Ashura Blaster, Rayxanber I&II and Metal Black are all rather aggravating.

Then of course there's shooters that are just bad and impossibly unfair, like Deep Blue on PCE.

[ThirdStrike]

Shienryu annoys me even though I beat it a few times before.Dogunn and Tatsujin Oh also annoy me. I just dislike shmups when I have to reset.

The damn reset everytime you die bothers me and the bosses are no joke.

[BulletMagnet]

I'm sure i coud could up with more if i tried. Anyway, anyone else have any pet-hates?

Hmm, sort of an offshoot of the "gaming pet peeves" thread, just specifically shmup stuff...

From the last thread I'd reiterate putting stuff in the foreground which obscures everything on the playfield; utter design stupidity for a shmup. I'd also mention scenery which enemies can shoot and travel through, but you can't; Gradius constantly does this. Many times I've found myself killed cheaply because not only was an enemy or bullet able to travel through a wall and nail me, but it traveled behind the wall, so I had no chance to see it coming. Maddening, especially in a shmup like Gradius, with walls all over the place which the player often has to hug. Same goes for giving a player a life meter and then throwing almost entirely one-hit kills at them, a la Axelay. Then there are shmups which have a lot going on in the background (rank systems and such) but tell you nothing about how to properly control them, or even that they exist.

[Jon]

Gradius III on the PS2 double pack makes me want to walk into the path of oncoming traffic...

[Randorama]

Then there are shmups which have a lot going on in the background (rank systems and such) but tell you nothing

Shmups don't speak.Well, except for the "speed up", "power up" or "destroy the core" lines

[BulletMagnet]

Well, heck, even some kind of demo screen woulda helped, but in games where understanding how the background stuff works is absolutely vital to playing it correctly, it seems kinda cruel to just leave the players completely out in the dark...heck, Raizing supposedly only released "official" info on Garegga's rank for some kinda contest IIRC...or do I recall incorrectly?

[Vexorg]

Gradius III on the PS2 double pack makes me want to walk into the path of oncoming traffic...

I'm gonna' have to sig that one.

[zinger]

MD versions of Battle Squadron and Xenon 2, I absolutely hate these games. Haven't played the originals though.

[Shatterhand]

Xenon 2 on Amiga, As far as I remember, just have better music. (Actually, the only good thing about Xenon 2 IMO is the music), otherwise the MD version is identical.

Battle Squadron on Amiga is better, but also a lot harder. If you don't like Battle Squadron because it's hard on the MD (And it indeed is), you would dislike it even more on Amiga.

[ArrogantBastard]

Shienryu. God, I hate the hell out of that game.

[thchardcore]

GIGA WING 2

The gimmicky ass reflect barrier never sat well with me, I never really knew what all the fuss was about and I hate the play perspective (give me TATE homie). It's like it wants to be a crazy cave bullet hell game, only the reflect barrier (laser) totally kills any fun and the amount of superbombs you get makes for another "escape" method. Crappy enemy design and not very appealing art only add to my distaste. The music is okay I guess, but it's only like quasi-epic in the face of other game soundtracks (AREA 88, Ikaruga, Silvergun, Garegga)

I'll probably sell my copy, I only played it once and I bought it new.

[dessgeega]

Gradius III on the PS2 double pack makes me want to walk into the path of oncoming traffic...

that sounds about right.

and yes, the pc engine salamander is ludicrously cheap.

[BAD]

R-Type II, or any of the R-Types for that matter. Ridiculously hard; I always thought that they never needed to be so hard. I also hate the fact that memorization is essential to passing several parts of the game; parts where reflexes alone won't help. Starting way back in the level with no power-ups also doesn't make anything better. Gradius is challenging, but R-Type is stupid difficult. They're OK, but no more R-Type for me...

[MSZ]

R-Type Final

[Andi]

Starship Hector (NES) is annoying because of the sheer amount of enemies and bullets on the screen and the flicker that results from them. The respawn points are shitty, your gun fires too slow, there are too many ground targets that must be bombed, and it is insanely difficult.

Ikaruga is also annoying because there is only one way to approach every encounter in the game. Fuck that garbage.

[BrianC]

The shmups in Action 52!

[howmuchkeefe]

Right now Perfect Cherry Blossom is annoying the hell out of me. 9 out of every 10 deaths are my fault, mostly because I allowed my concentration to slip. Every once in a while, though, I'll die because of the slightly laggy controls, or because I don't yet know how big my character's hitbox really is, or those of the bullets I'm trying to dodge.

The game has revealed how badly I've been spoiled by slowdown, too.

I'd just take a break, but a few weeks ago, while waiting for PCB and IN to arrive, I looked at my growing collection of credit fed shmups and swore that I would 1cc PCB come hell or high water.

[Rob]

I'll probably sell my copy, I only played it once and I bought it new.

Try playing a second time. I have a guide that explains playing for score in the strategy section. It won't be any fun if you treat the barrier like an "escape" button.

[zinger]

Xenon 2 on Amiga, As far as I remember, just have better music. (Actually, the only good thing about Xenon 2 IMO is the music), otherwise the MD version is identical.

Battle Squadron on Amiga is better, but also a lot harder. If you don't like Battle Squadron because it's hard on the MD (And it indeed is), you would dislike it even more on Amiga.

Xenon 2 on MD doesn't seem to have in-game music at all (just for the menu).

I dislike MD Battle Squadron because I think it's just a badly designed game overall. I remember listening to the original soundtrack, which is pretty cool and definately very catchy, but the Mega Drive soundtrack is just bad.

[Specineff]

Curse
Rabio Lepus Special.
Deep Blue.

Play those and tell me we don't deserve the punishment described in the Book of Revelation.

[gs68]

Darius Gaiden's SUPER POWER DOWN DEATH OF DOOM.

'nuff said.

[dessgeega]

Darius Gaiden's SUPER POWER DOWN DEATH OF DOOM.

gradius.

and speaking of konami, the mode 7 stages of axelay. the hitboxes make no sense; my ship will be destroyed by a pipe that's nowhere near it.

[Randorama]

Well, heck, even some kind of demo screen woulda helped, but in games where understanding how the background stuff works is absolutely vital to playing it correctly, it seems kinda cruel to just leave the players completely out in the dark...heck, Raizing supposedly only released "official" info on Garegga's rank for some kinda contest IIRC...or do I recall incorrectly?

Again with this argument...?any shmup with rank will have faster bullets after a while, which is a pretty obvious proof of its existence. If you're still "completely in the dark", you should pay more attention to what's going on the screen You can consider it as a "n00b test": if you play and you can find out how you influence the engine by your actions (and without an handbook), you are finally out of "n00bdom", so to speak. Beside that, i noticed rank for the first time in Gradius and Darius, and i was 8, so it can't be an incredibly difficult element to notice...

[ill6]

Image Fight (Wow, big sprites... Oh, I am dead)
Ghost Pilots (I must move out of the way of that bullet... Oh, I am dead)
Ikaruga (I am invicible as my ship is black! Oh no, I was white and am dead)
GigaWing2 (Oh, I am dead)

[Raidenfighter Kirkov]

Lynx: Raiden...oh my god how could anyone develop such a fart in the wind !




Greetings
RFK

[Onken]

R-Type II, or any of the R-Types for that matter. Ridiculously hard; I always thought that they never needed to be so hard. I also hate the fact that memorization is essential to passing several parts of the game; parts where reflexes alone won't help. Starting way back in the level with no power-ups also doesn't make anything better. Gradius is challenging, but R-Type is stupid difficult. They're OK, but no more R-Type for me...

i have to agree on the r-type thing, i hate the way you go bak to the begginin of the stage with no weapons, again & again & again again & again & again again & again & again.....

and since arriving at this wonderful site i have been playing some of the cave games which i find nearly impossible to stay alive for more than 5 seconds, with the massive spreads of bullits really nasty big bosses... slap fight had the balance just right all those years ago !

[Klatrymadon]

I had a really rough time with Donpachi the other day, but I think that was mainly because I was in my mate's house and he wouldn't shut up.

[BulletMagnet]

I'd just take a break, but a few weeks ago, while waiting for PCB and IN to arrive, I looked at my growing collection of credit fed shmups and swore that I would 1cc PCB come hell or high water.

Zun's games are all very possible to 1CC (as you say, dying in them is pretty much always one's own fault); I know I've done Imperishable Night on Normal, and I think I once managed a 1CC on Cherry Blossom, but I'm not positive...if I didn't make it I was close, because I know I've been to the last boss. And, of course, if I can do it...

Again with this argument...?

This one I don't think I've gotten much into previously...though at this point it's hard to keep track. ;P In any event, in a game like Gradius I was aware of rank long before I'd even heard the term "shmup," but a simple system like that is much easier to notice and understand than something like Garegga's, which is almost completely unique in its setup among shmups. I don't want this to turn ugly or anything, so I'll just reiterate that it's my personal preference to be told the "vital" stuff of how a game works outright (especially when it's a game which you have to approach and play differently than most others in the genre) and leave it at that...I just personally find it easier to "dare to know" when you have facts rather than vague hints and theories to go on. Proof of my own mental deficiency? Perhaps. But I've never denied that for a second.