SLG-in-a-Box

[bencao74]

This is my "new" project called SLG-in-a-Box. I`be posted some news in the SLG3000 thread some time ago, but now I put it on my desk again ... and here is the thread.

It converts various video sources like Scart RGB, YUV or VGA to video output VGA 640#x480 31Khz and plus active Scanline Emulation.



This was the first prototype.

Here is the feature list :

- RGB SCART Input
- VGA Input
- YUV Input
- Audio Out (from Scart)
- VGA output
- Scanlines for 480p and higher resolutions.
- Scanlines switch On / Off
- Switch On / Off
- Power Led for Unit and scaler
- Switch on / off for scaler
- Switch for Resolution Config
- Scanlines Intensity Adjustment
- Odd / Even scanlines
- All controls at the front of the enclosure
- OSD menu for scaler configuration
- All interfaces at the back of the enclosure

Testing so far :

Scanline Emulation : Works
RGB Scart input : Works
YUV input : Works
VGA input : Works :DD
Input controls : WORKS :DDD
- B1 = Up, B2 = Down, B3 = OSD, B4 = Source select
On Screen Display : Works
Scanlines switch On / Off : Works
Switch On / Off : Works
Power Led for Unit and scaler : Works
Switch on / off for scaler : Works
Switch for Resolution Config : Works
Scanlines Intensity Adjustment : Works
Odd / Even scanlines : Works

So this is the breakthru. The unit is working as expected.






http://bencao74.blogspot.de/2012/07/new ... n-box.html More pics

And this is the second prototype taking some advices into account. I`ve made a more compact design which results in more stability. All functional Man Machine Interface are located in the front control panel. I`ve taken all the signals from the scaler PCB via ribbon cable to the front panel PCB. Thus this unit comes now with an easy to acess OSD menu. The SLG3000 functionality is controles by the sliding switches : Even/Odd Scanlines, Scanlines on and off and resolution config. The scanline intensity is controlled via the scanlines intensity knob
I`ve foreseen two power supply on/off switches for the scaler and the SLG3000 functions. For just forwarding VGA signals the scaler PCB is not needed.

The back panel has all signal interfaces :

- RGB SCART
- YUV
- VGA in
- VGA out
- Audio Out
- PSU

I`m going to put this unit in my shop soon. Tell me what you think you about this project.

Here is the SLG3000 Thread
http://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=33454

[emphatic]

Very sexy. Nice sofa as well.

[fagin]

Price will be the killer question I imagine.

[gundamalpha]

This is a bit too late but it would be nice if the sound output could include sound from YUV source as a matter of convenience

[bencao74]

Price will be between 175€ and 190€ for the complete unit with enclosure. I`m sorting out some parts.

One of my supplier lacks of this sliding switches. Does anybody know a good cheap alternative? MKL perhaps?

http://www.reichelt.de/Schiebeschalter/ ... &OFFSET=16&

For Audio : The SLG-In-Box offers two rca sockets. For RCA audio plug on YUV cable just use this rca socket adapters, they do the same then:

[matrigs]

any chance for a kit consisting just of the 2 additional pcb's besides the scaling unit ?

[Stainomo]

Looking good!

The only debatable thing is that an older professional scaler + SLG could be had for about the same price and could offer better results

[bencao74]

any chance for a kit consisting just of the 2 additional pcb's besides the scaling unit ?

Sure, I`m alway open for kits. I can open the pinout, interface documentation and such things. But it`s heavily based on the gbs8220.

Looking good!

The only debatable thing is that an older professional scaler + SLG could be had for about the same price and could offer better results

There are dozen of ways using the SLG3000 in combination with new or used scalers. I didn't compare the prices or features of the various setups. I just wanted to put all my designs in one neat box e'oila. Of course I can't compete with used serial production scaler

[Stainomo]

You do have 1 big advantage - scart input! Most ppl aren't very confident in making a scart to RGBs cable!

[fagin]

You do have 1 big advantage - scart input! Most ppl aren't very confident in making a scart to RGBs cable!

Hence why they already have the "Sync Strike" available.

[Stainomo]

Most scalers have RGBs connectors - no reason to get a sync strike

[matrigs]

any chance for a kit consisting just of the 2 additional pcb's besides the scaling unit ?

Sure, I`m alway open for kits. I can open the pinout, interface documentation and such things. But it`s heavily based on the gbs8220.

Nice - i simply happen to have a gbs8220 and have no need for a second one and i'll doubt i might sell the first.

[Androigynous]

I like the transparency of all your products, however...did you ever consider having it enclosed in plastic? Or at least having some sort of option to have it or not. I could totally see this in a sleek black box (with the arcade forge logo on it), it would fit in well with the other audio video equipment in people's entertainment centers. My two cents...looks awesome!

[fagin]

Most scalers have RGBs connectors - no reason to get a sync strike

Read what you put originally and then think how the Sync Strike fits your statement.

[Stainomo]

A sync strike offers vga style out put if i read correct no regular sync? Except through the screw connectors on the side - not very usefriendly

[fagin]

What do you deem as "regular" sync?

Anyway... this was all about providing a way to use SCART as an input, which is what I thought you were referring to, as that's what I certainly was referring to.

[Stainomo]

true - i'm pusing this too far

Anyway - great product! I might actually get this since i'll need a scaler for a second location at some point

[Fudoh]

Here's my review, soon to be published on my website:

ArcadeForge SLG-in-a-Box

The SLG-in-a-Box is a new creation by ArcadeForge, who brought us the SLG3000. Rather than being a completely new creation, it's a combination of the (in-)famous GBS8220 scaler board, the Sync Strike (a sync stripping device) and the glorious SLG3000. The Sync Strike and SLG portions have been redesigned with new board layouts to accompany the scaler board inside one sexy looking plexi case.
The case measures ... x ... cm ( ... x ... inch). The SLG board sits in the front and offers switches to enable and disable scanlines and to chose between odd and even lines to darken. One the same board you'll find a power switch which disables the GBS8220 sitting in the middle of the case. This comes in handy, if one wants to use the SLG portion for other VGA sources (like Dreamcast or XBox360). There are three additional switches in the front which control the scaler (brightness, sharpness controls and resolution setup) and one to select the input (RGB via scart or Component). On the backside there's an input/output board which offers RGB scart, component and VGA inputs as well as a set of RCA jacks for stereo audio output and of course the VGA output to connect the SLG-in-a-box to a monitor or TV set.

Setup is as easy as it gets. The scart input on the back is connected to a LM1881 IC for sync stripping, so the input can accept RGB signals from all the scart sources you could think of. No need for special cables, japanese RGB cables or raw sync type of cables. The component input accepts 240p, 480i and 480p, all of which are processed by the GBS8220 board sitting in the center. All boards are powered by a single 5V input on the back.
The actual processing quality unfortunately is the weak spot of the whole construction. While I wouldn't call the GBS8220 bad by any means, it's just a very generic linedoubling board, originally made for arcade operators (who give a shit about quality) to run Jamma boards on PC monitors or LCD displays. The GBS's output looks ok. The results are quite similar to what most of today's TVs can achieve with a component source on their own. 240p signals are processed as 480i, so you'll run into deinterlacing artefacts, even for progressive 15khz source signals. If used with low-res sources, it's basically mandatory to enable the scanlines, which help in masking many of the artefacts and render the picture - well, let's say - acceptable. The GBS board needs about 2 frames processing time. The GBS is built for NTSC signals, but PAL signals are usually accepted. The output will still be rendered at 60Hz, so it's not advised to use PAL machines with this setup.

With the prototype design I've had on hand for testing, I've run into a few problems with the VGA passthrough function. With a Dreamcast connected to the bypass input on the back and the GBS board switched off, I got some interferences and noise when trying to run the DC with enabled scanlines. Since the very same DC works just fine using a classic SLG3000 I guess it's just a little quirk, which will get fixed quite soon. Another problem (and a rather weird one) is that while the DC was connected to the SLG-in-a-Box using the VGA input the scanline overlay for any of the processed sources would stop working (of course the DC was switched off). ArcadeForge is looking into this.
Eventually the SLG-in-a-box is more like a proof of concept. Of course it's sleek and of course it's the perfect way to utilize a GBS8220 scaling board, but with an anticipated price of roughly 185 EUR there's very hard competition out there. Ususlly for around 80-120 EUR and a little patience one can pick up a large number of home theater processors ranging from an iScan HD, over the Vigatec FX2 units to the Cinemateq processors (which even offer scart RGB inputs) and by adding a SLG3000 for about 50 EUR one ends up at the same price but with *much* better processing and increased flexibility over the rather cheap GBS8220 core. XRGB-2 or 2plus units are also available in the 180-200 EUR range by now.

Conclusion: minor VGA input quirks on the prototype board aside, the SLG-in-a-box does exactly what it's supposed to do, plus it's readily available (contrary to so many vintage home theater processors), on the other hand you can spend the same amount of money and get one of the other recommended processors on this website and end up with superior processing results.

[bencao74]

Fudoh, thanks for the review.

I`ll take the points into account.

For the price I was again going into supplier negotiation. I was able to get a far better price for the enclosures. For the VGA input issue I have to investigate, neanwhile I will write a workaround.

So currently the SLG Unit will have a price 169€ incl. PSU.





Here is the shop link

http://wp1114205.wp150.webpack.hosteuro ... ucts_id=71

[Fudoh]

So currently the SLG Unit will have a price 169€ incl. PSU.

absolutely reasonable considering the prices for the Sync Strike, GBS8220 and SLG3000 on their own!

[Nostromo]

I am very interested in purchasing this, and I have a few questions in case someone can help me out - thanks!

1. Whats the size of the thing?

2. How does it compare in picture quality to an X-RGB Framemeister?

3. Does it suffer any visible lag?

4. Any on screen artifacts/noise/etc?

Thanks!

[fagin]

1. Don't know.

2. No comparison to the XRGB range of processors. This has a cheap performance scaler at it's heart..... the scaler on it's own can be picked up from various outlets for as little as £25.

3. Circa 2 frames.

4. Yes with certain signal types - this scaler recognises 240p as 480i with no motion adaptive deinterlacing facilities.


However.... as has already been reported by myself and most recently Fudoh 3 posts back, with the SLG in toe it makes a big difference to the image quality by sharpening things up and hiding certain artifacts. When all is said and done though you get what you pay for.

[Nostromo]

Thanks a lot for your reply

[bencao74]

Hey,

the measures are 21cm x 25cm

[fogueman]

Hello guys

I´m also considering getting the new Slg-in-a-box, as I already have the slg3000 and i´m very satisfied with the results.

Bencao, can we take a look at the unit working in a video?? I think both nostromo and myself would appreciate that.

I have a question about hdboxpro. I´ve read at fudo´s site that it offers better image quality than cga scaler, but I don´t know if you can use the sync strike to use Snes and Neo Geo aes on the unit.

My goal is to have Megadrive, Snes, and Neo Geo AES on my 37 flatscreen with the scanlined effect on the slg3000.

[Fudoh]

I´ve read at fudo´s site that it offers better image quality than cga scaler

it's not really better, it just offers a better recognition for actual 240p sources (compared to 480i). This reduces the deinterlacing artefacts a bit. Otherwise they're the same.

but I don´t know if you can use the sync strike to use Snes and Neo Geo aes on the unit.

no RGB input on the HDBox.

[fogueman]

so, fudoh, if there´s no way to use the Snes and AES on the hdboxpro... what other options do I have, besides Cga to Vga Scaler plus sync strike -slg in a box??, considering what i´m looking for: 100 euro aprox (I already have the slg3000), and plugging snes and neo aes to Rgb-scart on the scaler.

I think the cinemateq scaler that fagins reviewed on youtube has scart socket

[Fudoh]

To use a Scart source on a HDBox you can add a Scart to YUV transcoder, but it's not worth it.

For 100 EUR you can pick up a bunchload of processors (if you have a little patience). The Cinemateqs have Scart RGB, that's right, but even without an actual Scart port many processor accept RGBs through 4 Cinch/RCA ports (e.g. the iScan HD or the Vigatec FX2).

[Nostromo]

Thats a lot of info. The real problem I see is that there isnt an affordable, new, readily available scaler which is a bit better than the cheap arcade one, which is a pity. The arcade one costs as little as 25 euro on Ebay, I would happily spend 100 euro for something which is a bit better than that (not 6 year old stuff though), but there isn't.

Pity!

[Fudoh]

I would ANYTIME spend 100 Euro on a processor, which did cost 1500 EUR six years ago, over ANY 100 EUR processor, which is available new nowadays.

But that's your choice of course.