Shmups Netplay - Raiden Fighters series & VP1 now playable!

[MathU]

Have you ever wanted to play 2D shooters online with other people, but didn't know how or were too afraid to ask? Perhaps you weren't even aware that you could? Well this thread is for you!

Has there ever been a 2D shooter you've always wanted to play with someone? Maybe you've had trouble finding anyone to play it with, let alone someone skilled. Use this thread to arrange games with others!

There is a huge world of playing shooters online through emulation. Here's what you need for various game platforms:

Arcade Shooters
MAMEHub – A new netplay solution for both MAME and MESS, this emulator has excellent netcode and rarely desyncs. When desyncs do happen, it fixes them in real time so your game isn't ruined. This emulator is continually being worked on and stays updated with the latest MAME builds. While MAMEHub is still in beta, it already works exceptionally. While a lot of emulators are Windows-only, MAMEHub even has Mac and Linux ports, and you can play cross-platform! It requires a bit of work to setup, including port forwarding, but I would recommend it for just about anything arcade except for a select few games that netplay is currently broken for.

MAME32k – An ancient Kaillera-based build of MAME, it rarely desyncs, but it has poor game support due to being based on a very old version of MAME (0.67). Most people, including myself, use 0.64 instead of 0.67. I'm not sure entirely why/can't remember. I used MAME32k a lot in the past, but I have not found any reason to use it again since MAMEHub came out.


MAME++ – Another Kaillera-based build of MAME, this emulator likes to desync, but it has much better game support. This is based on MAME 0.119.


SNES Shooters
ZSNES 1.36 or 1.42 – While ZSNES hasn’t been updated in a while, it’s the best emulator by far for SNES netplay. Versions 1.42 and 1.36 are the ones you want for netplay. 1.42 likes to desync on some games, but 1.36’s netcode is rock-solid. Are there actually any SNES shooters that allow co-op? You could play Strike Gunner S.T.G., Raiden Trad, and umm... Darius Twin

NES Shooters
NEStopia – Another Kaillera-based emulator, this has very basic netplay functionality, and it can desync. You may actually be better off using MAMEHub for NES netplay at this point.

FCE Ultra – This has netplay? Supposedly it does, but I’ve never gotten it to work right. Note that netplay is broken in FCE UltraX.


Playstation Shooters
ePSXe – This is the go-to emulator for Playstation netplay, but I have had trouble with desyncs when using it in the past. Uses Kaillera for netplay. Experiment at your own discretion.


Playstation 2 Shooters
PCSX2 - I have no hands-on experience with Playstation 2 emulation at the moment due to not having a powerful enough computer, but I know PCSX2 has a plugin that allows for netplay.


Dreamcast/NAOMI Shooters
NullDC - I don't have much personal experience with this, but I hear it has few desyncs. Lacks a GUI, so you have to edit a text file with the other player's IP at the moment.

Demul - Requires a more powerful computer than NullDC, and I have heard that it has more trouble with desyncs, but I have not actually tested it myself. There is a setup guide here.

This topic post will be subject to future editing. If you have experience with other emulators for 2D shooter netplay, please post about them and I’ll add them. I'll probably put system/connection speed requirements for each emulator eventually if someone can get me that kind of information.

[mjclark]

This is very interesting and I'd like to see a list of shmups which people have successfully played in online coop, ie what is actually working.
There's also the issue of actually finding other people to play with ( I still have trouble finding a Strania co-op game) for any specific game at a given time
Also there's stuff like Jamestown which demands an onlin co-op feature that it hasn't got.
I guess if there were enough people, they could synchronise their online presence and availability through a thread on here.

[Zaarock]

There's also the issue of actually finding other people to play with ( I still have trouble finding a Strania co-op game) for any specific game at a given time

http://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=11812 ?

supercade is another netplay MAME client that you launch off a web browser. the netcode seemed decent, not sure about desyncs. Was playing some neogeo stuff which can be sort of finicky with drivers etc..

will check out MAMEhub, looks interesting.

[mjclark]

There's also the issue of actually finding other people to play with ( I still have trouble finding a Strania co-op game) for any specific game at a given time

http://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=11812 ?

Oh yeah (doh!)- thinking about it, it would be fantastic to play Strikers 1945 II, Strikers 1999,Trizeal and Raiden III as an online co-op.
So is that possible and already happening somewhere?

[MathU]

If your computer is powerful enough to emulate Raiden III or Trizeal on PCSX2 (or NullDC), it may be possible. Strikers 1945 II and 1999 have been playable online for a long time.

supercade is another netplay MAME client that you launch off a web browser. the netcode seemed decent, not sure about desyncs.

The problem with Supercade is it's very selective about the games it supports, and it's a real pain to get working right. Thankfully, MAMEHub supports everything Supercade does now and much, much more.

[Obiwanshinobi]

Are there actually any SNES shooters that allow co-op?

Strike Gunner S.T.G.

[Nick420]

This should be incorporated into shmup mame.

[Blackbird]

Are there actually any SNES shooters that allow co-op?

Raiden Trad =D

[BPzeBanshee]

Are there actually any SNES shooters that allow co-op?

Raiden Trad =D

Too bad the Megadrive version's Single-Player only.

Speaking of Megadrive, Kega Fusion has a netplay function in it but in my experience it's problematic outside of being used in a LAN. Then again I haven't had much opportunity to test it with people over the internet, furthermore there isn't any co-op shmups that I know of and play on Megadrive. If anyone can pitch in for some support with this that'd be excellent.

[mjclark]

So has anyone successfully played online co-op shmups with these set ups and if so which ones and which games?
I'm not trying to put a downer on this at all cos I'm really excited by the idea of shmups netplay but I'd like to start with something that's confirmed working

[BPzeBanshee]

So has anyone successfully played online co-op shmups with these set ups and if so which ones and which games?
I'm not trying to put a downer on this at all cos I'm really excited by the idea of shmups netplay but I'd like to start with something that's confirmed working

I know ESPRade (somewhat) works if you're online at the same time as me. Get on Facebook more so I can talk you through it.

[mjclark]

I know ESPRade (somewhat) works if you're online at the same time as me

It's the "somewhat" that bothers me- but yeah next time I'm free and on FB let's sort it out

[BPzeBanshee]

I know ESPRade (somewhat) works if you're online at the same time as me

It's the "somewhat" that bothers me- but yeah next time I'm free and on FB let's sort it out

Well I did two windows of it open connecting to eachother and it desynced all the time but that was either due to
A) being an old version
B) me running two windows locally when you're probably not supposed to

I think if our internets are good enough it should work fine, and like someone else mentioned the Strikers games are meant to run perfectly on them so we can always try those games.

[mjclark]

I think if our internets are good enough it should work fine, and like someone else mentioned the Strikers games are meant to run perfectly on them so we can always try those games.

Kool etc.
I'm really busy this week raising cash, watching what's coming out of Comiket 80 and going on holiday ( ) but as soon I've got some proper freetime I'll get MAMEHub configured, I'll PM you and we'll have some fun.
If others on this forum have MAMEHub working properly too maybe we could pool our resources and get some netplay sessions going.
What version of MAME is MAMEHub based on then?

[MathU]

MAMEHub was updated to MAME 0.143 last week.

Most 1st generation CAVE games like ESP Ra.De. run at full speed, but with some hiccups if your latency isn't quite good enough.

[Observer]

Beat Hazard works considerably well despite having huge lag between both sides. I've played with australian people and had 285 ping and it was still playable. Bloody flammin' galah, mate! Had some matches with people in the US with 160-148 ping and it was nearly perfect. Local people was the best though, barely no ping.

But before playing BH you really need to coordinate all the tracks and share them so you can synchronise your libraries.

exception conflict was also meant to be a multiplayer game but the netcode was nothing short of terrible (or just poorly optimised) and required most people to live within the same area to get proper ping.

[mjclark]

OK!!!! I just played some Strikers1999 on MAMEHub with a dude from Luxembourg and it worked just fine.
There were a couple of freezes but apart from that nice and smooth.
This is fantastic- get on it people!!!
And thankyou very much MathU for starting this thread!


OMFG: I've never had anything to do with MESS before but you can play PC Engine games in online co-op can you?

[MathU]

I've never had anything to do with MESS before but you can play PC Engine games in online co-op can you?

You can indeed. We had a 3-player game of Bomberman going last week until we switched to the Irem arcade version.

[Frenetic]

Anyone test out Change Air Blade yet? It would be cool to have a mini tournament with that game!

[racer445]

I've played lots of Naomi stuff with my friends using Demul and the Kaillera netplay plugin. It works great! With low-ish pings it's very playable.

Here's a decent guide on Shoryuken detailing the setup: http://shoryuken.com/forum/index.php?th ... al.116635/

[Dave_K.]

Anyone test out Change Air Blade yet? It would be cool to have a mini tournament with that game!

I'm with you on that Frenetic! Do you have mame setup on one of your Net City's?

[Accutron]

I've played hundreds of hours of all sorts of games with my friends using Mame++ 0.119. Most shooters we've tried will 'work', but desyncs are frustratingly common, and if the ping between the host and all other players isn't roughly 50 or less, it's not a very enjoyable experience. Input delay increases with ping, making most shooters barely playable or unplayable. My friends are all out on the left coast, so my ping to them hovers around 90-140 most of the time. DDP tends to be our low-hanging fruit because it works right about half the time and we all have it memorized well enough to compensate for the input delay. Even then, it's more of a promising technology demo than a legitimate gaming experience.

[MathU]

So I feel really bad for recommending MAMEHub right when a new revision introduced a timing issue that was causing frame rate problems and intermittent freezing for some users. I'm happy to say that has just been fixed. I hope nobody got the wrong impression and was turned off by it, and if they were, that they'll give it another chance.

Anyone test out Change Air Blade yet? It would be cool to have a mini tournament with that game!

Change Air Blade works great in MAMEHub. This sounds like a great idea.

I've played lots of Naomi stuff with my friends using Demul and the Kaillera netplay plugin. It works great! With low-ish pings it's very playable.

I was under the impression that Demul required a pretty hefty computer to run games at full speed online, and has worse desync issues than NullDC. I'd love to actually try it with someone.

[Kasbe]

You also have ggpo. It focuses on fighting games (I think it's the main gathering place for 3rd Strike players) and I think it works better than superarcade. It's restrictive with the games it supports, but I've seen people playing unsupported roms doing some kind of swap think via savestates. Not sure though.

Also, I play most of my PS2 shmups via PCSX2 because I suck at playing with a gamepad (and it allows to choose better resolution). Mushi and Gunbird Collection dont need a very fast computer to run smoothly, although it may take some time tweaking the emulator to run at the proper speed. It may be worth giving it a try online.

[BPzeBanshee]

None of the Raiden Fighters games work via MAMEHub as far as I've tried, but then again their emulation has been shoddy for the last 5 years anyway so it's not really much surprise.

Some of the games running just without anyone connected via MAMEHub have varying input delays. ESPRade's is horrible but Garegga and Dodonpachi and a few others I tried were either okay or not noticable against normal MAME at all.

At least I bothered to get the setup for installing it done, it was quite easy.

[MathU]

How do you check input lag anyway? I had a very smooth game of ESP Ra.De. going with someone around 130ms ping yesterday and the frame delay wasn't a problem at all.

[TodayIsForgotten]

Raiden Mame worked well with someone from mississippi. 1943 worked like shit with someone from the same state with a shitty connection. In order to really benefit from playing any game via netplay you really need to be within a state of each other or so with good connections.

[MathU]

It depends entirely on the emulator and netcode you're using.

[mjclark]

Thanks again MathU for starting this topic
I've had good results on MAMEHub so far as long as ping<160ms. Anything higher than that though and it's unplayable.
The problem with it for me at the moment is that the community's so small but I guess this thread's here to drum up support.
I'm in UK and whatever time I join MAMEHub (8.30am, 4.00pm, midnight) there's only about 8 people online and only two of them are actually playing. There's also very few european members
I've got a very on-the-fly lifestyle so I like the idea of just being able to drop into MAMEHub and pick up a game but it will need a lot more players a lot more geographically dispersed for that to happen.
It's a lot of fun when it works though and there's also some interesting stuff still to be sorted out:
XII Stag CHD wouldn't launch cos it required a zip that doesn't exist so I guessed that renaming the taitogn.zip (which the game does require) to xiistag.zip would satisfy the conditions and it worked so that game is now playable in MAMEHub.

So c'mon guys! Everyone get on MAMEHub so we can have an online drop-in arcade going!

[BPzeBanshee]

How do you check input lag anyway? I had a very smooth game of ESP Ra.De. going with someone around 130ms ping yesterday and the frame delay wasn't a problem at all.

Since MAMEHub doesn't allow pausing you can't, but I can certainly feel the difference between playing it in MAMEHub, playing it in standard MAME and playing it in ShmupMAME myself.

Normally you'd press P to pause and press SHIFT-P while holding a direction, then just keep pressing SHIFT-P and see how many frames it takes for the ship/person to move.