I want a Saturn, and have some questions

[ryu]

So I once considered getting a japanese Sega Saturn for the heck of it. Back then it was mostly a "well, one day, maybe ..." kind of thought, but considering that I'm still not not too interested in either a 360 nor a PS3, I thought I might actually go for a Saturn after new year's (it's pretty convenient having his birthday placed right after christmas).

But since this isn't an exactly cheap thing to buy, I thought I should get some input on the console before actually buying one. Here's what I'd like to know:

- Is there anything I should be careful about when purchasing one, like weak parts of the console easily getting damaged, maybe different console versions with important changes?

- It's disc based, so I guess chances are if I get one the disc-drive won't be alive/live for very long. Is it still easy to get replacements, are they expansive?

- Seen on a picture that it say 15 Watt on the AC. Like .. what? Is it really that weak? And since I'm european, can I hook it up on a 300 Watt strong AC/AC converter? I know using a converter weaker than the console's AC can blow up your console, but I'm wondering how things work out by that much difference even the other way around. Want to be on the safe side here.

- Just noticed the console has a cartridge slot. What is that for, is there any obscure good use for it?

- I'd appreciate some game recommendations, as my current 'to get' list is still rather short (and some of these games are on the expensive side too, heh):

Batsugun
Battle Garegga
Bokan to Ippatsu! Doronbo Kanpekiban
Dodonpachi
Gradius Deluxe Pack
Grandia
Radiant Silvergun
Rockman 8
Salamander Deluxe Pack Plus
Sonic Jam
Soukyugerentai
Strikers 1945
Thunder Force Gold Pack 1
Thunder Force Gold Pack 2
Thunder Force V

I'd appreciate any kind of help I could get.

[BulletMagnet]

- Is there anything I should be careful about when purchasing one, like weak parts of the console easily getting damaged, maybe different console versions with important changes?

I've heard that models with round power buttons are more reliable than those with oval buttons, but I've had one of the latter for several years and haven't had any problems with it.

- Just noticed the console has a cartridge slot. What is that for, is there any obscure good use for it?

Its main use was for RAM carts required to run certain games (and optional for others) - you'll probably end up inserting an import enabler (like an Action Replay, some models of which also contain RAM functionality and memory storage).

- I'd appreciate some game recommendations, as my current 'to get' list is still rather short

There are a truckload of good Saturn games to snag, though most were only released in Japan - for my summary of the system's shooters look here. Also check out this feature (not by me) on the same site.

Hopefully someone else can answer the rest of your questions.

[ryu]

Thanks for the input so far, I already found some more neat games.

Its main use was for RAM carts required to run certain games (and optional for others) - you'll probably end up inserting an import enabler (like an Action Replay, some models of which also contain RAM functionality and memory storage).

Considering I won't be needing an import enable if I'm getting a japanese Saturn, would a RAM upgrade + memory storage the best choice? Just read that the Saturn used to save using a battery inside the console, that doesn't seem very reliable.

[BulletMagnet]

Considering I won't be needing an import enable if I'm getting a japanese Saturn, would a RAM upgrade + memory storage the best choice? Just read that the Saturn used to save using a battery inside the console, that doesn't seem very reliable.

You probably will be wanting some extra memory, as certain games take up a good hunk of space and the Saturn doesn't have much of it built-in...as for the RAM, there are actually two "general" variations on that (1M and 4M) so you'd be best-served with a cart that has both. Then again, some games (mostly fighters) came with special RAM carts specifically made for them, so be aware of which games need which.

[ryu]

Thanks for the warning regarding RAM carts, I'll look out for these special cases.

I just took a quick look at few of the games on ebay and found this:

Case: A
Manual : B
Disc: A
Spine Card: missing

What's a spine card? :/

[E. Randy Dupre]

The main use of the cart slot was more for the memory cart, I think (certainly initially, anyway) - without one of those, you're kind of stuffed, thanks to the battery running constantly (to keep the internal clock going). it's seriously annoying that some games not only don't support the memory cart, but also seem to have an issue where battery saves won't transfer onto it and back properly without getting corrupted in the process. I think this is the case with Radiant Silvergun, for one, but can't remember exactly.

But yeah, some form of memory cart is essential. The best thing is that the official one has an insane amount of space on it, meaning you'll only ever need to own one of them.

Incidentally, it's been my experience that having a save file for Tomb Raider on the memory cart effectively reformats the thing - I lost many, many save games due to that, including some major NiGHTS scores - so be wary of that. Although it's probably a fairly obscure thing, given that most people played TR on the PS1 and it probably hasn't held up well enough to want to play it again nowadays.

The only issue I've had with either of my Saturns is a random power-down/reboot thing, similar to the effect that overheating causes on Dreamcasts. In both cases, it's been the ribbon cable inside (connecting the CD drive to the board, I think, but I'm not very tech-savvy) coming loose, easily sorted by pulling it out and whacking it back in again.

Oh, and the cart slot seems a bit too keen on failing to recognise when a memory cart is plugged in, which is a pain in the arse for me as the region switch on my modded machine is inside the cart slot flap, meaning I have to take the thing out every time I want to switch regions, exacerbating the cart recognition problem.

Other than those issues, I've found the hardware relatively reliable. I've had my PAL unit since launch day and it still works fine.

Games-wise, what kind of things are you after? There are a bunch of great Saturn games, probably too many to list randomly without knowing if they'd appeal to you or not.

[Jockel]

What's a spine card? :/

*insert medical joke here*

It's this little piece of paper that's wrapped around the edge of a new game.

[ryu]

Games-wise, what kind of things are you after?

Considering I've filled my shmup quota for now, platformers and RPGs would be what I'm more interested in now.

It's this little piece of paper that's wrapped around the edge of a new game.

No idea what that's supposed to be. oO

[BIL]

Also known as an obi strip (on the left).

[UnscathedFlyingObject]

As for its use, the only thing it does is jack up the price of games.

[neorichieb1971]

Spine card includes the bar code. Leaving the artwork intact. It does have collectible value though.

Its the height of the CD case, 1 inch wide on front and back.. so really just a piece of shiny paper that wraps the binder.

[Kilmaattikahn]

From my personal experience, the weakest part of the Saturn is the cartridge slot, it's a pain in the arse to get it to work. Back in the day I just thought I had a bad memory card, but since then my first Saturn died and I purchased two other cartridges to allow me to play other region games and both of them also have a hard time being recognised by my "new" replacement console; however, as soon as it does recognise them, I can just leave them there for months and they work with no problems.

[neorichieb1971]

The cart doesn't go in straight thats all. I must admit I had the problem once or twice, but I hardly used the carts myself. I did use them for the expansion games like SFZ3, Cotton 2, Metal Slug etc. But since 1 cart worked for all of them I just left it there.

[brokenhalo]

From my personal experience, the weakest part of the Saturn is the cartridge slot, it's a pain in the arse to get it to work. Back in the day I just thought I had a bad memory card, but since then my first Saturn died and I purchased two other cartridges to allow me to play other region games and both of them also have a hard time being recognised by my "new" replacement console; however, as soon as it does recognise them, I can just leave them there for months and they work with no problems.

I can't remember where exactly i read it, but i read that the pcb board in an action replay cart is a little thicker than the pcb inside the official sega carts. this causes the cartridge slot pins to bend away from the contacts. same problem you run into with old nes consoles where you have to reseat the cart numerous times until you hit that sweet spot.

[Ex-Cyber]

as for the RAM, there are actually two "general" variations on that (1M and 4M) so you'd be best-served with a cart that has both.

1MB RAM games are supposed to run on a 4MB cart, and generally do. I've seen lots of rumors about "some games" that supposedly only run with a 1MB cart, but nobody ever seems to come up with an actual list of verified 4MB-incompatible titles. Most (if not all) carts marketed as having both are just implementing a 4MB cart.

Then again, some games (mostly fighters) came with special RAM carts specifically made for them, so be aware of which games need which.

The game-specific carts are ROM carts. The only games I know of that have them are King of Fighters '95 and some Ultraman game whose proper title I can't remember right now.

As for save memory, keep in mind that most third-party memory carts don't support saving directly from the game; you have to copy files to/from the Saturn's internal save RAM.

[E. Randy Dupre]

Marvel Super Heroes vs Street Fighter is one that was originally 1MB RAM cart compatible and was meant to also work with the 4MB version, but it's never done so for me (the surefire test being to see if there's any animation in the characters' crouching frames). It could just be the wonky cart port again, though.

[speedlolita]

As for its use, the only thing it does is jack up the price of games.

And yet I don't mind..

[evil_ash_xero]

I still have my launch day Saturn, and I got one when they announced that Sega was stopping support for it in the U.S.. They both still work quite well. I'm sure they'll put out at some point, but they're still truckin'.

I would like to know how easy it is to replace the lasers and all that jazz, but it seems to be hard to find that info.

Oh, another thing about the cartridge slot...people use it to region free the Saturn. Say, you have a U.S. Saturn(don't know if it's cheaper or not than a J one), you can just pop the cart in, and it will give you a Game Genie type screen, and then you can just click OK, and play any J game you want. Now, if you did go with a U.S. Saturn, make sure to get the second printing of Soukyugurentai, since it's has a bunch of garbled graphics in the first print(on a non modded or non J system).

The slot is also used for extra RAM carts, that games like Metal Slug, and many Capcom fighters use.

Just so you know, in case having games in the English language is important to you also(Panzer Dragoon Saga, Dragon Force, or other RPGs, for instance).

[ROBOTRON]

Everyone's covered what I was going to say...I do have some thoughts on what games to buy:

Thunderforce 5
Radiant Silvergun
Layer Section
Darius Gaiden
Metal Black

Be Praying for deep pockets...
Be Praying for deep pockets...
Be Praying for deep pockets...
Be Praying for deep pockets...
Be Praying for deep pockets...

[louisg]

Lots of really good non-shmup games on Saturn too.. pick some of those up also =) I think a lot of those should still be really cheap.

re: longevity of the drive: I got mine second-hand around 1999 or 2000. It's a model 1 Saturn, has seen a lot of use, and only started acting up after a friend of mine tried a pretty brutal swap trick on it.

[ryu]

yeah, since nobody mentioned anything I guess the drive's surprisingly persistant. I remember how my PSone's drive completely failed me after a few years

does the console support RGB video oupout? what's the standard output? I'll need to plug it into a PAL tv after all, almost forgot

[Alec]

Marvel Super Heroes vs Street Fighter is one that was originally 1MB RAM cart compatible and was meant to also work with the 4MB version, but it's never done so for me (the surefire test being to see if there's any animation in the characters' crouching frames). It could just be the wonky cart port again, though.

Marvel V SF actually requires the 4mb card. Just like X-Men Vs Street Fighter it won't play with the 1mb. I've heard the Japanese version of Marvel Super Heroes (not V SF) benefits from the 1mb cart with more animation frames. It can also be played without any cart, just like the other regions. I've never had a Japanese Marvel Super Heroes to try it out though. My Saturn cart slot is totally wonk and I can't play SFZ3 at all.

[E. Randy Dupre]

Sorry, that's me getting confused. I meant Marvel Super Heroes, not MSH v SF. Reports I read at the time of release claimed that *all* regional versions of MSH had nearly full animation wheen played with the carts inserted. I've never owned a 1MB to try it, but the PAL version, at least, is no different with the 4MB than it is without it.

[Specineff]

I can confirm that the American version of Marvel Superheroes works with the 1 and 4 MB carts. If you use the 4MB cart, however, you will only use 1MB of it. (So the result is the same, regardless of which one you use.) It does improve the animation and load times a little. And leaves the PS1 version in the dust.

[BulletMagnet]

does the console support RGB video oupout? what's the standard output? I'll need to plug it into a PAL tv after all, almost forgot

Mine worked with the custom RGB cable Matt made for it (though unfortunately the monitor it was designed to work with no longer functions properly), so presumably SCART and other such cables are out there someplace for it. Someone actually from a PAL territory would be better able to answer this than me, though.

[E. Randy Dupre]

The initial release of the machine in PAL territories actually came packaged with a SCART cable - it caused a bit of a kerfuffle amongst people who still had older televisions and wanted an RF cable. To the best of my knowledge, SCART doesn't necessarily infer RGB, though - you can have a composite signal fed through a SCART connector - so you'll need to make sure you know what you're buying.

[ryu]

according to wikipedia the console does have an RGB output, and it seems there are a bunch of rgb cables for the saturn on ebay. so I guess there won't be any problems with the video output.

just need to find out about wether using my 300 watt transformer would work or not

custom RGB cable Matt

why did you need a custom one, was it to connect it with a pc monitor instead of a tv?

[Kilmaattikahn]

Randy is right, and AFAIK, no SEGA-made SCART cable exists for the Saturn that isn't RGB-capable. Beware of third-party ones, though. The official one also outputs composite, so if you have a TV with no spare RGB SCART inputs you can still play using the SCART cable, at the expense of video quality, obviously.

[BulletMagnet]

why did you need a custom one, was it to connect it with a pc monitor instead of a tv?

Technically yeah, it was for use with an old Commodore monitor - most SDTVs TVs around here don't have inputs of higher grade than S-video.

[louisg]

why did you need a custom one, was it to connect it with a pc monitor instead of a tv?

Technically yeah, it was for use with an old Commodore monitor - most SDTVs TVs around here don't have inputs of higher grade than S-video.

Wow, I'd love to have RGB cables for my Amiga monitor for my various consoles. I wish the Ami monitor were more than 14" though, because the picture on that is incredible.