Egret 2: fixing the JAMMA loom!

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system11
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Egret 2: fixing the JAMMA loom!

Post by system11 »

Well, thanks to cools checking his loom out for me and tracing the wires, the problem with Egret 2 (maybe other cabs too) looms is now clear.

The JAMMA standard requires +5v on all four pins on the JAMMA connector. For most boards this doesn't matter as the +5s are all connected together on the PCB connector itself, but on some boards (notably so far System 18 games such as Moonwalker and Alien Storm), the +5s are not all connected together. This means all the +5 wires need to be connected at the loom itself for the games to work.

The Egret 2 designers decided to ignore this standard. While there are four +5v wires coming from the power supply, only three of these go to the JAMMA loom, on pins 3,4 and C. Pin D does have a wire at the connector, but this actually goes up into the control panel area for games that have special controls such as spinners that need +5v. In effect, they are trying to use the JAMMA connector as a +5v passthrough, assuming all the +5v pins are linked at the PCB. In case you're wondering, the fourth +5v wire at the power supply end, actually goes to the coin counter.

What this means in practise, is that if you connect a game to an Egret 2, only 3 of four +5v pins are connected and sharing the current load, which is non standard and could (although only over a very long period of time) eventually lead to burning pins out on the game board. It should be stressed that this is highly unlikely on modern games which hardly draw any current compared to older ones. On games such as Moonwalker, it will also mean that the input section (which is separately powered from the +5v on pin D) will be dead, and if you happen to have flashy controls that need +5v, they won't work/light up/whatever.

There are a couple of solutions to this. You could modify the game board and use a wire jumper to hardwire pin D to 3,4 and C. Personally I don't think that's the right solution though. Another solution would be to pull the wire off the coin counter and route it to the panel, which will then in turn feed pin D. Again, that doesn't seem like a great solution.

The best compromise would be to link pin D at the loom to one of 2,3 or C. This can be achieved easily and cleanly by anyone with a pair of pliers, using a Scotch Lock.

Here's a picture of the Egret 2 JAMMA connector, upside down. The two highlighted pins are C and D, D being the 4th to the right. This is the wire which doesn't carry +5v.
Image

Here's a picture of a Scotch Lock. These are really easy to get from any electrical place, car accessory shops and so on. I've seen at least two different sizes by the way, make sure you get the type as pictured, and not the ones that crimp as you close the clip - they're not as good and some block off the second wire hole on one side.
Image

All you need to do, is fit one of those across the C/D wires, I'd suggest half an inch to an inch away from the JAMMA connector will be the best place as the wires are nearly straight at that point. Just slide those two wires into the connector, push the blade down, and close the clip. There's a video on youtube of how to use Scotch Locks for people who really are helpless beyond reason.

Done!

As a side note: from the picture it's clear that some of the ground pins are also not connected - I've seen games before that needed all the grounds too, but sadly I can't remember which ones they were. System 16 games also confirmed to be affected by this depending on the type of JAMMA adapter you use.
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emphatic
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Re: Egret 2: fixing the JAMMA loom!

Post by emphatic »

Great thread. But this won't cancel out the +5v going up to the control harness will it? Also, does anyone know why the "SPEAKER -" is split? I figure that they go to 1 speaker each, but then why aren't the "SPEAKER +" from the JAMMA split as well (for mono/PCB usage)?
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Re: Egret 2: fixing the JAMMA loom!

Post by system11 »

emphatic wrote:Great thread. But this won't cancel out the +5v going up to the control harness will it? Also, does anyone know why the "SPEAKER -" is split? I figure that they go to 1 speaker each, but then why aren't the "SPEAKER +" from the JAMMA split as well (for mono/PCB usage)?
Nope, in fact it will mean the +5 goes up there regardless of a PCB being attached at all, it ties the wires together. It may also avoid problems with non-JAMMA games. For example, old Konami games only have 2 pins for +5v and most people use JAMMA pins 3/C on their adapter, meaning that again - the panel would lose power since D would have no connection.

As for your sound question, I don't know - there's an Egret 2 wiring diagram available though which would probably show how the speaker wires are connected. If they're working fine then leave them alone ;)
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Re: Egret 2: fixing the JAMMA loom!

Post by charlie chong »

damn the egret 2 wiring is weird! there's also the strange way it handles 6 buttons that me an cools and mkl were discussing.. i use a jamma extension on my egret 2 so could i just join up c to d on the extension instead of using a scotch lock and changing the factory standard wiring ? i don't have a og taito power supply as poolchamp snatched em out the cabs and replaced them with generic arcade power supplies so my wiring could be different anyways.
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Re: Egret 2: fixing the JAMMA loom!

Post by system11 »

charlie chong wrote:damn the egret 2 wiring is weird! there's also the strange way it handles 6 buttons that me an cools and mkl were discussing.. i use a jamma extension on my egret 2 so could i just join up c to d on the extension instead of using a scotch lock and changing the factory standard wiring ? i don't have a og taito power supply as poolchamp snatched em out the cabs and replaced them with generic arcade power supplies so my wiring could be different anyways.
Yep, you could do that instead no problem.
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Re: Egret 2: fixing the JAMMA loom!

Post by kernow »

I had loads of those on my cab, recently took them all out because I couldn't see what they were doing, just connected around singular wires.
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Re: Egret 2: fixing the JAMMA loom!

Post by emphatic »

bloodflowers wrote:As for your sound question, I don't know - there's an Egret 2 wiring diagram available though which would probably show how the speaker wires are connected. If they're working fine then leave them alone ;)
I have put a sub woofer in my EGRET II and the speaker -> line adapter I'm using only gives me sound in 1 speaker from the PCB's, but connecting for example my Xbox360 directly to the sub woofer then to the "P" connector gives me stereo sound in both of the speakers (I'm using the original speakers). It seems that somehow only 1 of the speakers get the "SPEAKER -" correctly now. I guess I'll have to change the connection point somehow.
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Re: Egret 2: fixing the JAMMA loom!

Post by MKL »

emphatic wrote:Great thread. But this won't cancel out the +5v going up to the control harness will it? Also, does anyone know why the "SPEAKER -" is split? I figure that they go to 1 speaker each, but then why aren't the "SPEAKER +" from the JAMMA split as well (for mono/PCB usage)?
http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/116/eg ... ramye4.jpg

The negative of the L speaker is wired to both the jamma L pin and the stereo connectors F/P, that's why the wire is split. The positive of the R speaker is wired (through the volume pot) to the Jamma 10 pin when the sound switch is set to mono and to the stereo connectors F/P when the switch is set to stereo, that's why the wire doesn't need to be split. The negative of the R speaker is wired to the positive of the L speaker when the switch is set to mono (speakers are wired in series). When it's set to stereo the 4 wires from the stereo connectors are wired to the respective speaker tabs.
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Re: Egret 2: fixing the JAMMA loom!

Post by emphatic »

MKL wrote:
emphatic wrote:Great thread. But this won't cancel out the +5v going up to the control harness will it? Also, does anyone know why the "SPEAKER -" is split? I figure that they go to 1 speaker each, but then why aren't the "SPEAKER +" from the JAMMA split as well (for mono/PCB usage)?
http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/116/eg ... ramye4.jpg

The negative of the L speaker is wired to both the jamma L pin and the stereo connectors F/P, that's why the wire is split. The positive of the R speaker is wired (through the volume pot) to the Jamma 10 pin when the sound switch is set to mono and to the stereo connectors F/P when the switch is set to stereo, that's why the wire doesn't need to be split. The negative of the R speaker is wired to the positive of the L speaker when the switch is set to mono (speakers are wired in series). When it's set to stereo the 4 wires from the stereo connectors are wired to the respective speaker tabs.
Great explanation, thanks!
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Re: Egret 2: fixing the JAMMA loom!

Post by PC Engine Fan X! »

This handy thread should be sticked for our fellow Egret II owners to digress over. Interesting that Taito didn't go with the normal Jamma standard with their Egret II jamma loom setup. What were they thinking bypassing that standardized setup though?

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Re: Egret 2: fixing the JAMMA loom!

Post by Michaelm »

Thanks a lot for the hard work guys !
This thread has helped me out nicely this week so it deserves a bump :)
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Re: Egret 2: fixing the JAMMA loom!

Post by StarCreator »

As someone who owns an Egret 2 but was completely unaware that this was a thing, the bump is appreciated!

I'm not a fan of modifying things from the way they came out at the factory, so I might go the JAMMA extender route of working around this problem. I haven't had issues with any of the game boards I own though.
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Re: Egret 2: fixing the JAMMA loom!

Post by ELabit »

Not sure if anyone has bad this issue with their egret but the Jamma edge is so tight that thicker old boards won't even go in. I had to make a jamma finger board connector for my friend so he could play his Tatsujin board.
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Bluechen
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Re: Egret 2: fixing the JAMMA loom!

Post by Bluechen »

Well i know im new and i know this thread is pretty old and im sorry for bumping it! Maybe u can upload the fixing pictures again because they are down after all this time. I think they still can help ppl (like me :P ) fixing their looms. Thank you!
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Re: Egret 2: fixing the JAMMA loom!

Post by XtraSmiley »

Bluechen wrote: Wed Sep 27, 2023 7:53 pm Well i know im new and i know this thread is pretty old and im sorry for bumping it! Maybe u can upload the fixing pictures again because they are down after all this time. I think they still can help ppl (like me :P ) fixing their looms. Thank you!
Another option is that some JAMMA extenders, like this one, fix the issue without having to re-work your loom. This one is sold out right now, but you can likely build one yourself.

https://rgbslab.com/products/jamma-extension-harness
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Re: Egret 2: fixing the JAMMA loom!

Post by orange808 »

Photos reup:
Spoiler
Image
Spoiler
Image
We apologise for the inconvenience
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Re: Egret 2: fixing the JAMMA loom!

Post by Bluechen »

Late, i know but thank you very mutch :)
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