The ship's speed

[Elaphe]

For me, 90% of the playability in a game lies in how you interact with the game. In shmups, the speed of the ship or character you are in control of is very important and, however, this is rarely mentioned when reviewing a game. A wrong speed affects playability very badly. A game such as Raiden III would be 10 times better if the ship were not so sluggish. The excess of speed is even worse, because it doesn't let you dodge bullets and move your ship with enough precision. A name that comes to my mind is Battle Bakraid, although I guess there are better examples. It's like when you get too many speed items in Gradius and the ship gets hard to control.

This is one of the things that makes Cave games almost perfect shmups, especially because of the invention of focus/slow movement. I've noticed, however, that not all the games by this manufacturer have the same ship's speed. Could you confirm that Mushihime Sama, for instance, is a little slower than ESPGaluda, which for me is the perfect game in this sense? What about other recent games which have still not been released in MAME or consoles? Do you know whether Cave has decided to establish a standard speed or it is something that depends upon every game released?

I've also noticed another interesting issue with shmups by Raizing, also present in Ibara: the speed on the vertical axis is higher than the speed on the horizontal axis. I don't know if this is a way to make the ship reach the vertical and bottom tops of the screen as fast as it reaches left and right. It doesn't make sense for me, and it really spoils the control. I can't believe players have not noticed this or do not find it a reason to complain.

[DMC]

But in raizing games you don't need to be as precise in your movement as in Cave games, there's simply not that many bullets to dodge. Instead you need to be fast enough to colleect all the falling medals, avoid other types of attacks, etc. Also, it seems that raizing-players in general prefer the faster ships (could be due to other reasons ofc, but look at what wild snail types are more populare in garegga for example).

Faster movement at vertical axis is pretty common I think.

[MathU]

I have absolutely no problem with Raiden III's ship speed, and I was genuinely surprised when I found out that others did.

[RHE]

For me, 90% of the playability in a game lies in how you interact with the game.

How about the remaining 10%?

[emphatic]

Also, ESPGALUDA has different speed for different character, while Mushihimesama has different speed on different weapon types. You'll need to be a bit more specific.

[Ruldra]

Dogyuun is one game they didn't get the speed right. The ship is too slow to dodge the bullets at max rank, and the speed power-up is way too fast. If you're not careful with it you just end up bumping into another bullet or enemy.

Raiden and Viper Phase 1 are also frustrating with their slow ass ships. And Gradius at the lowest speed contributes a lot to the Gradius syndrome.

[Ed Oscuro]

Raiden 1's ship speed seems alright to me, it isn't too bad in say stage 3 if you have the wide shot. Using the laser becomes an exercise in frustration though.

[antron]

random speed thought:

Truxton is nuts. 5k for picking up a speed means you must. I thought, "this is stupid", until I tried it and got further than I ever had before.

[Andi]

I like any speed as long as it is fixed. I hate having the option to change my speed or (worse) having to collect speed power-ups.

...that being said, as noted by Antron, maxing out the speed power-ups in Truxton for max score is awesome.

[Icarus]

Funny, but unlike the OP, I seem to have none of the problems adjusting to the different speeds in any shooting game I try my hand at. That's what I consider to be an important playing skill: adaptability.
And I come from the old-school era of shooting games, when ship speed varied from game to game, and ranged from snail-paced to rocket-fast. In terms of preference, I actually like slower ships better than faster ones, as a slow-speed ship is easier to control with precision.

[Ed Oscuro]

random speed thought:

Truxton is nuts. 5k for picking up a speed means you must. I thought, "this is stupid", until I tried it and got further than I ever had before.

Haha yeah

[Ganelon]

It doesn't really matter. When you're good at a game, you go the same basic path every time, at which point the speed no longer plays a noticeable part. Plus, you'll know how to properly anticipate bullets at that point.

I do prefer quickness and generally play at the fastest adjustable speed in most games though (works great with any light-resistance JP stick).

[fogelmir]

I hate those games like R-Type that put speed-ups with no way of slowing down your ship, so having too many speed ups becomes a deathtrap.

In my opinion, I really think that "Treasure" seems to have a very good and balenced ship, in terms of speed. Ikaruga and Gradius V have amazing control. Even at max speed, your ship in Gradius V seems to be very controllable.

[E. Randy Dupre]

I hate those games like R-Type that put speed-ups with no way of slowing down your ship, so having too many speed ups becomes a deathtrap.

That's the point. You're allowed to select the speed that best suits your playing style, but that's offset by the need to pay attention to precisely what it is you're picking up.

[evil_ash_xero]

Radiant Silvergun's ship is too damn slow, especially for the screen being as wide as it is. It's like you can't even get to one side of the screen fast enough to shoot some enemies, so you kind of have to prepare by hanging to one side if you want to take out enemies on one side. Gah.

Thankfully you can adjust the speed, but I wouldn't be up for playing it in the arcade or anything.

[lgb]

Funny, but unlike the OP, I seem to have none of the problems adjusting to the different speeds in any shooting game I try my hand at. That's what I consider to be an important playing skill: adaptability.

This. I'm pretty sure that the developers picked a particular speed for the ships in their games for a reason.
I prefer fast ships mostly, just so I can get to everything... even better is to have the option to slowdown alongside. I like such fixed speeds above games that require you to pick up speedup powerups or so.
That said, when multiple characters come into play, what ship I actually choose is entirely dependent on the game. I like speedy ships with powerful shots and less range, yet I would generally prefer playing Reimu (slower, homing) over Marisa (faster, forward).

[toaplan_shmupfan]

I don't mind slow ships/planes as long as the enemy does not have an unfair navigation advantage.

Examples where the player is way too slow vs. the enemy include:

1942 (those green planes that rotate all over the screen vs. the slow and large plane, major disadvantage)
Fire Shark (returns to the slowest speed after a ship is lost and the speed powerups must be collected all over again)
Raiden III (mainly due to the smaller yellow bullet pattens in boss attacks, not so much for the pink bullets)
Truxton (same developer as Fire Shark, same reason)

Examples where the speed of the player is too fast to control precisely:

Fire Shark, Outzone, and Truxton (same developer, all three of these games have an IMHO recklessly high max speed)
Some of the planes in Aero Fighters.
Some of the planes in Strikers 1945.
Some of the planes in Raiden Fighters.

Just to name a few.

Honestly, I think the only game that did speed control "right" was Thunderforce IV/Lightening Force. Speed could be adjusted in 25% increments by pressing and releasing the button, but it could also fine-adjusted in one percent increments by holding down the button after pressing it, then releasing it when the exact percentage was reached (so it was possible to have something like 87% ship speed or 92% ship speed).

[themachinist]

I didn't find the ship speed in RIII to be a big problem. A good tap tap tap and you can dodge everything, even the boss patterns. There's always an avenue where no bullets are, just gotta position your ship in it and wait for the bullets to pass. New salvo, another tap.

[Rozyrg]

As much as I love 8 and 16-bit era shooters, I absolutely DESPISE speed ups. Let me set the speed I want or just leave it at a nice balanced speed everyone can be happy with.

[Danbo]

I like it like Garegga where you get the basic speeds of the ships but you can modify them further with B/C/ABC variant.

[Shatterhand]

Raiden 3 ship speed is perfect for that game. It's slow because the whole game was designed for a slow speed.

[Obiwanshinobi]

A game such as Raiden III would be 10 times better if the ship were not so sluggish.

I utterly disagree. Raiden games are, essentially, all about relatively slow ship movement, relatively sparse bullets and most shots being aimed. Without all these features combined, they wouldn't be "better". They just would be no more Raiden games.

[fogelmir]

I think the speed of the raiden ships are fine, however, I wished they were a little faster for those times when You have to pick up powerups. I can't tell you how many times I have died trying to grab shot upgrades.

[antron]

I think the speed of the raiden ships are fine, however, I wished they were a little faster for those times when You have to pick up powerups. I can't tell you how many times I have died trying to grab shot upgrades.

that's why I like IV's magnet

[E. Randy Dupre]

Actually, thinking about it some more, R-Type Final nails this issue perfectly by giving the player the ability to speed up or slow down at will. As much as there'll always be a very vocal group of players here hating on the game, I think that's the one thing about it that *nobody* could moan about.

[emphatic]

In Image Fight you can set the speed yourself at the start of the game.

[Ghegs]

In Image Fight you can set the speed yourself at the start of the game.

No, Image Fight has a dedicated button for changing speed so you can change it whenever. Maybe you're thinking of Dangun Feveron?

[emphatic]

In Image Fight you can set the speed yourself at the start of the game.

No, Image Fight has a dedicated button for changing speed so you can change it whenever. Maybe you're thinking of Dangun Feveron?

I'm pretty sure about this for the arcade version. As you've picked up the "shield", the secondary button (speed button) controls that instead of the speed. But I might remember wrong, haven't played it for a long time. Are you referring to the PCE port, or the arcade version. Of course I know I could be making an ass of myself right now.

[Ghegs]

In Image Fight you can set the speed yourself at the start of the game.

No, Image Fight has a dedicated button for changing speed so you can change it whenever. Maybe you're thinking of Dangun Feveron?

I'm pretty sure about this for the arcade version. As you've picked up the "shield", the secondary button (speed button) controls that instead of the speed. But I might remember wrong, haven't played it for a long time. Are you referring to the PCE port, or the arcade version. Of course I know I could be making an ass of myself right now.

You mean the pods? You shoot them out by pushing buttons 1 and 2 at the same time. I guess most people just keep button 1 pressed down for constant fire, so the confusion is understandable. Pressing just button 2 controls your speed no matter what the ship's equipment.

(Referring to the Image Fight/X-Multiply pack, btw, but it should be the same on all around.)

[BIL]

Yeah, Image Fight (Arcade) has two buttons. 1 is shot, 2 is speed change. 1+2 fires the pods. PCE version is the same; Arcade Gears allows a third button for pod firing.