Anyone ever do better after not playing for a while?

Milkgoat · Post by **Milkgoat** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 6:33 am

About a month ago, I was shit at ESP.Ra.De., (couldn't get past the tank in the mall), but tonight I played it for the first time in a while, and on my first try made it to Stage 4's boss, before losing my credit.

Macaw · Post by **Macaw** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 7:07 am

When heading into a game I havnt played in ages It usually takes me a few credits to remember everything (boss patterns, tricks etc) then I usually dominate the game hard in the ass, more so than I previously had done.

BIL · Post by **BIL** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 7:15 am

I've noticed that a bit, in a few games. I think part of it is feeling more enthusiastic about a shooter after you've had some time away. In my case it's usually limited to matching my previous best with little effort / doing slightly better than I was before, though; never much in the way of huge score / survival gains.

iatneH · Post by **iatneH** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 7:15 am

I hooked up ESP RaDe and Ketsui last week after about a year of not playing them, and I am absolute crap.

In the past I've reached stage 6 of RaDe, but I don't think I could even clear stage 2 now. I cannot remember how to take apart the shopping mall boss safely.
Same with Ketsui, it's hard for me to reach stage 3 now.

DirtyMonk · Post by **DirtyMonk** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 7:24 am

I didn't play Ketsui for about a month since I was focusing on Espgaluda II, and when I suddenly had the chance to play it one day, I beat my highest score by like 10 million points.

Like how you described it, it just came out of the blue, and I don't understand how it happened. I think it has a lot to do with forgetting about your need for perfection, and so it relieves a lot of anxiety. I notice whenever I'm doing badly, I'll start developing a habit of making mistakes, and soon thereafter, I am sucking hard, dying on the first level and everything.

Now when I don't play a game for a long, long time, like for at least several months, then I start out sucking really bad at first, especially for games that require more memorization, like R-Type or Ikaruga. But since I've had past experience with those games, I'll then pick it back up a lot quicker than when I played it for the first time, and after subsequent runs, I'll be back to where I once was. It's like when you haven't worked out in a while, you get weaker, but then you still retain your muscle memory, so the strength comes back faster. So after all that playing, nothing is lost or gained. It's all still there, adding up with every run you put in.

kengou · Post by **kengou** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 8:18 am

I find a play a LOT better if I just take a week off of a game.

MJR · Post by **MJR** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 9:16 am

Sometimes yeah, but I've learned that if I really want to go to the top scores I need to practice very hard for two weeks at least, and at least 2 hours per day.

another thing is of course not to play if you are stressed out - it won't work.

Bloodreign · Post by **Bloodreign** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 9:48 am

That's happened to me with Fire Shark on the Genesis, though I died at the same place I had 3 months earlier, my scores finally broke a million after taking a break from the game, seems as though I was no longer trying to break my score, it just happened. Now after taking a 6 month hiatus from it, different story, I can't do diddly squat on it anymore, practice again would be the only way.

Post by **spadgy** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 1:39 pm

For me it works best just to not session a game too long. I do best when I play regularly, but having very breif goes. Perhaps three one credit gos at most.

Byut yeah, I've definately had instances of an inexplicable one-off good jump in standard after a long break. Sadly though, it's only ever a one off...

moozooh · Post by **moozooh** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 3:10 pm

Macaw wrote:When heading into a game I havnt played in ages It usually takes me a few credits to remember everything (boss patterns, tricks etc) then I usually dominate the game hard in the ass, more so than I previously had done.

Seconded. That's why I started taking breaks from the games I run after I notice the amount of early restarts increasing.

dpful · Post by **dpful** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 4:44 pm

There's the idea that muscle memory works similar to how a plant grows. So if you give your muscles an instruction, it will henceforth be developing the ability to follow that instruction. And the speed at which that muscle memory developes depends on the frequency and appropriateness of the instruction (like a gardener tending to a plant).

As in, if you never ride a bike after childhood, and get on as an adult, not only will you still remember how, but you'll be a little bit better at it then when you were a kid. Of course, if you never stop riding bikes, you'll be a lot better.

The reason it seems you play better after a break is analogous to how it seems that plants hold absolutely still, but a week later they are noticeably different and bigger----- a lot bigger if you visit and tend them properly (ironically, harder notice this way), yet still a little bigger no matter what (ironically easy to notice like when you take a break on a shmup).

on a side note,
I study this stuff while teaching music lessons and how to deal with frustrations of operating different instruments (at my job). As a side note, I believe that's why anyone has any problems playing instruments (or any other similar thing)--- it's because our minds see time in moments, and our muscles see time in days and months (like plants do), and it's really hard to be efficient and productive as they miss each other.

lgb · Post by **lgb** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 6:54 pm

Milkgoat wrote:About a month ago, I was shit at ESP.Ra.De., (couldn't get past the tank in the mall), but tonight I played it for the first time in a while, and on my first try made it to Stage 4's boss, before losing my credit.

I have done that. Same situation.

I also did that with various fighting games.

stuminator · Post by **stuminator** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 10:52 pm

Same for me. I can take a month off, then, after a practice credit or two to get back into the game, suddenly figure out how to pass some area that was giving me problems.

Arvandor · Post by **Arvandor** » Sun Feb 17, 2008 1:42 am

Yeup, I've noticed that a bunch. When I brought it up with my roommate on how instead of getting "rusty" I actually improved after a sizable break, he gave me a similar muscle-memory spiel as dpful, only without the analogies.

dpful · Post by **dpful** » Sun Feb 17, 2008 7:22 am

Arvandor wrote:Yeup, I've noticed that a bunch. When I brought it up with my roommate on how instead of getting "rusty" I actually improved after a sizable break, he gave me a similar muscle-memory spiel as dpful, only without the analogies.

I kind of like the analogies. I think they shed some light on the attitude that is required for you to deal with your muscle memory growth in an efficient way. (act like a gardener would- which is a very counter-intuitive attitude, and which requires a lot of patience and faith)

Arvandor · Post by **Arvandor** » Sun Feb 17, 2008 8:33 am

Yeah, I can definitely see why you like the analogies. But when it comes to my roommate and I, A: He's not very good with analogies, and B: He knows I'm intelligent enough that they arne't going to help me a whole hell of a lot =) I'm better off drawing my own analogies.

unsane · Post by **unsane** » Sun Feb 17, 2008 1:59 pm

dpful wrote:(act like a gardener would- which is a very counter-intuitive attitude, and which requires a lot of patience and faith)

Heh yeah, that can be frustrating for the impatient, me wants instant gratification!

Carmen · Post by **Carmen** » Sun Feb 17, 2008 7:21 pm

I think as long as you're still playing quick games, even if they're not the same... there is a sort of 'communal' skill that isn't restricted to any one game, as so what feels like a big improvement is just coming back to something with a lot more technique.

dpful · Post by **dpful** » Sun Feb 17, 2008 10:58 pm

I think that's the most effective way to deal with how muscle memory works-- spend time on as many varied things as possible that will utilize similar muscle memory.

To use the analogy again, it's rediculous to try and grow a specifically shaped plant, but easy to grow a bush and then trim it to a specific shape.

elfhentaifan · Post by **elfhentaifan** » Mon Feb 18, 2008 12:03 am

there was lots of stuff i messed around so hard with, about 5 years ago, and now i easily clean the bottom with them.
Sometimes its good to take a nap of a shmup, and continue one or two weeks later, that helped me out several times, too.

Enhasa · Post by **Enhasa** » Mon Feb 18, 2008 9:41 am

Generally no, but depends on the game for me.

puzzle-like: can see things differently so often helps
most: no
pvp: feels like you forgot everything about the game completely

BryanM · Post by **BryanM** » Mon Feb 18, 2008 12:40 pm

Sleep is very important for the learning process. It becomes a lot easier to pull off Matrix moves when they're all you dream about night and day.

A prolonged mental lethargy on the subject does make it wane a little bit - my Starcraft skills have to be worse than they used to be right now. But with a week of effort, I'd surpass where I used to be.

powerfuran · Post by **powerfuran** » Mon Feb 18, 2008 2:31 pm

Anyone ever do better after not playing for a while?

It happened so many times I begin to think it's sort of a rule, at least personally speaking.

It's just like you need some break, to relax.

Skyline · Post by **Skyline** » Mon Feb 18, 2008 3:03 pm

I played Mushihimesama for the first time in quite a bit yesterday and forgot how to chain.

escadrille · Post by **escadrille** » Mon Feb 18, 2008 5:10 pm

I've always found a break is great for helping you get past a particular spot you are stuck at. Can't beat a certain boss after repeated tries? Give it until tomorrow and you'll beat it easily. Long layoffs are no good for me though. I just forget everything.

unsane · Post by **unsane** » Mon Feb 18, 2008 7:35 pm

BryanM wrote:Sleep is very important for the learning process.

powerfuran wrote:It's just like you need some break, to relax.

I think what happens is in one session we overload our brain trying to learn new stuff. Before long it needs a break, to subconsciously mull it over, also some sleep processing (memory). Then when that grokking is done and you go back to it, it's ready for the next step. Repeat.

Hardstepah · Post by **Hardstepah** » Mon Feb 18, 2008 11:22 pm

i hadnt played DDP DOJ in about a week. i actually made it to the final stage with 1c but died right away because my girlfriend walked right in front of the tv. i wasnt to mad because it takes me 3 ships to kill the last boss. (sometimes another credit). previously i could get to the first before last boss on 1c and die but i made it through

PROMETHEUS · Post by **PROMETHEUS** » Tue Feb 19, 2008 12:01 am

Skyline wrote:I played Mushihimesama for the first time in quite a bit yesterday and forgot how to chain. :D

lol this happens to me in DDP a lot

although it always comes back very very fast

black flag nc · Post by **black flag nc** » Thu Feb 21, 2008 12:47 am

Yup, I find if I walk away for a couple of hours, let my blood pressure return to normal, I do much better.

shmups.system11.org

Anyone ever do better after not playing for a while?

Anyone ever do better after not playing for a while?

Re: Anyone ever do better after not playing for a while?