What [not shmup] game are you playing now?

[Squire Grooktook]

Play Skullgirls with me Blinge. The one true game.

[null1024]

TFW when you know zDOOM, a free mod and a level editor could happily obviate the rest of your game library.

pretty much this

I downloaded Reelism and spent fucking days playing it to the detriment of everything else. You can easily spend the rest of your life playing nothing but Doom mods.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mrC2YTLYwHw
Doom meets Smash TV. I love it!
Maybe a bit too silly at times [there are times when the RNG just goes "fuck off" and gives you zero hope of survival], and needs slightly better weapons [the starting pistol is maybe a bit too crap, even if you shouldn't be able to really depend on it too heavily], but it's fantastic.

[Ed Oscuro]

I wish reelism was a bit meatier in the gameplay department. Most of the levels are stupid and fail, and who wants to just play that game mode forever? Beyond that, pretty much gold. Especially nice to get the unexpected waves of enemies - honestly, if somebody could figure out how to randomly put enemy waves like that in a more standard FPS (perhaps as per-room replacements) it could be pretty entertaining. There's always the Terrorists! mod (with TekWar, Rise of the Triad and other sprite borrowings) but that wasn't terribly fun to play.

In other news, I just completed a few SWAT 3 missions - not as much restarting as Rainbow Six 3, but things are heating up by the SAM site level. What ruins runs in this game are mostly due to the crazy randomness of the levels, not the difficulty as such.

[Blinge]

I've been trying to get into fighting games too as of late, playing mostly Touhou SWR and Guilty Gear XX. I could make a freak show business over how bad I am at fighting games, but it does seem that bashing your head against the wall does produce results, as long as you aren't getting frustrated.

Haha.. yeah I know it will produce results eventually. It also produces a DSP style rant sometimes. I didn't know touhou fighters were a thing. And why GG:XX specifically?

Play Skullgirls with me Blinge. The one true game.

When the time is right, when fates portend.

[Formless God]

Fire Emblem Fates. I wanna resist writing an essay on it; let's just say it exceeded all expectations.

Looking back, I thought Awakening wasn't too good. All of the maps were extremely open and the latter half of the game was pretty much "pair units (preferably with galeforce) together, sic them at the enemy's direction and finish in 2 turns".

Fates is totally different. For starters, the difficulty and balancing are MUCH better. Lunatic is no longer stats inflation out of the ass and a RNG fest. Thanks to debuffs any enemy unit can kill any of your unit, and vice versa, making everyone usable and babysitting a less torturous task. Weapon durability finally fucked off and replaced with stat penalties instead. Dual mechanics are guaranteed to trigger under the correct conditions and are no longer RNG based. The enemy can also use them against you, so you're not safe just because one enemy can reach you; it can pull its buddy from across the room and the damage can sometimes be enough.

Although it's supposed to be Awakening 2.0, Hoshido maps feel more like PoR Maniac. The maps are chokepoint heavens and thanks to the lack of space you have to do a bit of tossing allies around (for bonuses and enabling dual attacks/guards).
The Nohr route I haven't got to yet, but apparently it's evil. I can't wait to play this fabled "Ninja Rape Cave" map. I also saw videos of this map where wind blows people around i.e. your units either get blown into their neighborhood or you suddenly wake up to find 10 red units in your formation.
The third route has fun things like fog of war and moving platforms.

There are, uh, 94 chapters total.

It's a good game that conveniently plays a bit differently from regular FE, so even old timers can find something fresh in it. I also unironically liked the new My Castle feature. It's pretty relaxing to arrange buildings and molest girls after fights.

[Squire Grooktook]

^^^ That is so good to hear. Only thing I take issue with:

Looking back, I thought Awakening wasn't too good. All of the maps were extremely open and the latter half of the game was pretty much "pair units (preferably with galeforce) together, sic them at the enemy's direction and finish in 2 turns".

I agree with the latter complaint, but not the former.

I actually thought that, aside from late game balance issues, Awakening had really nice map design. Most of the time you needed a pretty specific strategy in mind to optimally clear each stage.

I don't really agree that they were wide open either. The only truly wide open maps that come to mind are stuff like Gangrel's last stand or Wallmart's penultimate battle, and those had so much pressure on that you still needed to progress through them with a very tight game plan in mind. There were also lots of cramped castle missions and choke points. Inexorable Death, for example, is one of my favorite castle missions in the series.

It should be noted though that I tried to avoid grinding as best I could, limiting it to what I felt was nessecary to avoid making the game too hard (I played on hard, not lunatic), so players who really went for optimization might have a had a different experience.

[Formless God]

Wait, you don't remember Validar's room? It's literally a massive square with only you and the enemies. Too many endgames map do that. Mount Prism is the same thing with trees. The first Aversa map was just empty space.

And then there are Noire and Inigo's maps with the fliers bumrushing you where the only tactic is "leave your strongest units in their range while everyone else gtfo" because they flat out don't care about terrain.

I liked the early game maps more. Ch.5 without the Rescue staff was my favorite. And the one that takes place at the tree root.

I grinded some pairs for support points but ditched them afterwards. I think the resulting four 2nd gen units turned out to be even more catastrophic though.

But if Awakening maps weren't too open for you I think you might find Fates' maps downright claustrophobic. Lots of terrains that reduce your movement to nothing, moving around in 3x3 or 5x2 squares, etc etc. When moving units around, you tend to not think "either this or that tile is fine" but rather "only this exact tile will do". That's for the early game at least.

[Squire Grooktook]

Wait, you don't remember Validar's room? It's literally a massive square with only you and the enemies. Too many endgames map do that...I liked the early game maps more.

Actually I was kind of thinking of early-mid game maps. Things get broken in general after Wallmart goes down, so I kind of stop taking things seriously past that point lol. Early-mid game is pretty fun/well designed though IMO, until balance goes out the window.

But if Awakening maps weren't too open for you I think you might find Fates' maps downright claustrophobic. Lots of terrains that reduce your movement to nothing, moving around in 3x3 or 5x2 squares, etc etc. When moving units around, you tend to not think "either this or that tile is fine" but rather "only this exact tile will do". That's for the early game at least.

Sounds great

[pokemon123]

I've heard that fates gameplay has improved quite a bit but the story has been subpar.

(now i'm curious if anyone here has an account on SF lol)

[Squire Grooktook]

I've heard that fates gameplay has improved quite a bit but the story has been subpar.

(now i'm curious if anyone here has an account on SF lol)

I've been told that the story in Hoshido is a pretty big improvement over Awakening's story*, and very good overall.

The main complaint I've heard is that the Nohr story is a lot less entertaining.

*I actually liked Awakening story as a cheesy, goofy alternative to the more edgy entries in the series.

[Formless God]

Man screw SF; the Soleil thread got more pages than several gameplay threads combined lol

From what I've heard the story is better than Awakening, but it's pretty much Radiant Dawn 2.0 or something. What offended people is that some parts are conveniently left out so you have to get the 3rd route for the whole picture. Also near the end it turns into Devil Survivor 2 but that's a good thing to me.

And not that FE stories were any good to begin with, it's always the most basic "you beat up the bad guys" kind imaginable so I'm not setting the bar too high. I think the default 2 routes are some of the more dark, edgy entries in the series though.
That said, I think it actually did a good job with the characters, especially the royals and servants.

[pokemon123]

Man screw SF; the Soleil thread got more pages than several gameplay threads combined lol

From what I've heard the story is better than Awakening, but it's pretty much Radiant Dawn 2.0 or something. What offended people is that some parts are conveniently left out so you have to get the 3rd route for the whole picture. Also near the end it turns into Devil Survivor 2 but that's a good thing to me.

And not that FE stories were any good to begin with, it's always the most basic "you beat up the bad guys" kind imaginable so I'm not setting the bar too high. I think the default 2 routes are some of the more dark, edgy entries in the series though.
That said, I think it actually did a good job with the characters, especially the royals and servants.

I just hang out in FTF lol.

I heard FE 4 had a good story but the game is terrible anyway so it's okay.

[Squire Grooktook]

And not that FE stories were any good to begin with, it's always the most basic "you beat up the bad guys" kind imaginable so I'm not setting the bar too high.

I think a few of them have decent atmosphere and okay/solid plots. Otherwise I think people really over-rate the "military/political intrigue" of the series. I like it for having some very fast paced, almost "arcade-y" missions and a lot of tension (from the sheer length of missions and how easy it is to make a mistake), on top of generally likable characters and decent story. Part of the reason I usually defend Awakening's story: it gave me a few laughs, and the mc's were likable. More then I can say for most games I play.

I heard FE 4 had a good story but the game is terrible anyway so it's okay.

Never heard any complaints about FE4's gameplay.

[Sir Ilpalazzo]

I think FE4 has fairly lackluster stage design and is a real imbalanced mess compared to a lot of games in the series - most of the time the game sticks you in open areas and throws blobs of enemies at you, who you defeat by putting god unit #4098 in their path. No FE game is a masterclass in balance but I think FE4 ends up devolving in a more extreme way than most of the rest of the series.

That's not to say I think it's bad at all - the FE formula is great enough to make it a solid game despite its flaws - but I definitely think it's the weakest of the three FE games on the SNES, at least.

[BrianC]

Is it true that the first FE to come to the US, FE7, is actually the most balanced in the series?

[Squire Grooktook]

Is it true that the first FE to come to the US, FE7, is actually the most balanced in the series?

I like FE7 a lot, but I'm not sure if I can speak for overall balance. I think it has solid balance, pretty great map design and pace, good difficulty curve, and one of the better plots and casts in the franchise. Not sure if it's the best though, since I'm somewhat of a casual who doesn't spend too much time trying to break these games.

[BrianC]

yeah, I'm not an expert on balance either, but I do like FE7 quite a bit. I was thinking on diving into the earlier ones, but I'm on the fence. I read somewhere that FE3 has outdated RNG that was a carryover from the NES games.

[CStarFlare]

I'm pretty behind the times but I've started playing Super Meat Boy. I didn't expect to dig it - I tired of Battle Kid 2 after four or five hours - but SMB is extremely enjoyable. It's brutal but the only real frustration I've felt is when the game crashed on level 3 of The Kid's warp zone. Otherwise the short levels and quick respawn make dozens of deaths almost painless.

I love the experience of establishing and tweaking a route and slowly getting more consistent at executing it. It's kind of like getting better at a shmup, except over the course of five minutes and over and over again. I've A+'d the first six worlds of the light world (got sidetracked and haven't finished Dr. Fetus yet) and I'll grind my way through the dark world, I think. I doubt I'll try for 106%; the lives system in certain zones is infuriating and some of those bandages are bullshit. If the game were just the light world I'd consider doing some light speedrunning - blowing through saws is one of the principal joys of the game and the light world isn't that brutal.

Also, the music is fantastic. The fact that you can buy the soundtrack for $3 is a bargain.

[Squire Grooktook]

Otherwise the short levels and quick respawn make dozens of deaths almost painless.

Exactly why I can't really enjoy it too much.

I like the tension and excitement of knowing you'll have to restart your 10-30+ minute gauntlet if you game over. SMB's instant respawns just leave me cold.

Good game, but it's at a real right angle to the arcade experience IMO as well as what I look for in games in general. Unless you're speed running multiple segments or something.

[CStarFlare]

I'm the opposite. It's the setting me back 5+ minutes that turned me off Battle Kid. Even being set back 2 or 3 minutes is extremely unappealing if I anticipate having to do it half a dozen times. That level of difficulty with that level of punishment just leaves me angry once I start hitting a skill wall. Even if I'm playing a Mega Man game, if I game over at a boss I kind of feel like... ugh, I don't want to do that whole stage again. Unless I'm playing with a specific goal in mind I usually take a game over at the beginning of a stage if I'm coming in with no spare lives.

I really like that Super Meat Boy doesn't slap me hard for just trying to let loose and rip through a stage. Being able to say "whoops!" instead of "FUCK" in response to small mistakes is essential to any sort of long term enjoyment.

[null1024]

Been playing Duke 3D.
Game looks great. Lots of neat little things the engine can do [as far as I can tell, you could probably do a better than reasonable approximation of many Quake levels in it, although you'd definitely run into some pretty tricky issues during the attempt, especially since Quake really uses its vertical space]. Really wonderful weapons, extremely satisfying. Even the pistol.
The level design is bugging me though. I've spent significantly more time wondering where to go in Duke 3D than in Doom.

it's also noticeably harder than Doom, enemies do tons of damage, shit's intense

[Blinge]

the game crashed on level 3 of The Kid's warp zone.

Oh my God.. that is rough, dude. =/

Don't think I ever beat that stage.

[Shepardus]

I don't like SMB's super short iteration time though for a different reason from what Squire Grooktook said (though I also agree with what he said). I find that I burn out and get frustrated a lot faster on games where you keep trying a short level over and over until you beat it. That kind of repetition, doing (and failing) the same thing over and over again, is really tiresome to me and doesn't feel fun at all. I get the feeling that I'm beating my head against a wall until I happen to make it through without any mistakes. When I do complete a level, I don't feel like I really mastered anything, but rather feel like I got lucky (which, considering the short iteration time, is probably what happened) and breathe a sigh of relief that I don't have to play that level anymore.

With longer (15-30 minute) challenges you at least get the variety and well-regulated (read: not 100% all the time) pacing of playing through different stages each attempt, not to mention that you're probably not going to play it as many times in a single sitting as you would a Super Meat Boy level so it's less likely that you'll burn out from repetition. A longer challenge can also afford to be easier on average in moment-to-moment gameplay and more forgiving of individual mistakes since stringing everything together is its own challenge, which is also something I like. The freedom to make some mistakes also makes a game feel more dynamic to me, with unexpected twists and ups and downs, and less like rote memorization and repetition.

It irks me whenever I see people praising Super Meat Boy as the best way of making difficult games fun and fair, because while it is fair, its structure makes it less fun and far more frustrating to me than any of my favorite shmups. That's also why I could never really get into Shoot the Bullet and Double Spoiler despite really liking the concept (I cleared all the scenes in Impossible Spell Card, with items, but that's because it was easy compared to StB or DS).

In addition to that I also detested SMB's controls, but that's another matter.

[Squire Grooktook]

^^^Agree with all of the above, was actually going to mention some of that stuff but decided to keep it short.

There's also something to be said for the lack of "flow" in gameplay, but that ties in to the repetition point.

It's a good game, depending on what you're into. In terms of game structure, it's just completely opposite my tastes. I actually like the controls in SMB though lol.

[Blinge]

When I do complete a level, I don't feel like I really mastered anything, but rather feel like I got lucky (which, considering the short iteration time, is probably what happened) and breathe a sigh of relief that I don't have to play that level anymore.

Many of my 1cc shmup runs were me getting lucky rather than mastering the game. I've mastered fuck all, really. That's fine with me: my skill/routing has improved enough that I succeeded where I would failed before, and a little bit of luck sees me through to the end.

SMB just gives you that in a microcosm; that jump through the two buzzsaws at the beginning of a stage might've killed you before, but now you can do it every single time to reach the rest of the stage. If you want more mastery, go for the bandages, go for the whole chapter no deaths achievement etc: there is stuff there.
The bitesize (meat)chunks make difficult gameplay accessible to a wider audience, It's just another approach which is far less irksome than other ways of 'dumbing down' gameplay. Not everyone can, or wants to knuckle down for the hardcore arcade experience like us.

[Mischief Maker]

I wanted to like SMB, but this is the first time a game's aesthetic was so disgusting I had to put it down. That hospital stage turned my stomach. I don't mind silly gore, it's filth I can't take.

[Lobinden]

I've been trying to get into fighting games too as of late, playing mostly Touhou SWR and Guilty Gear XX. I could make a freak show business over how bad I am at fighting games, but it does seem that bashing your head against the wall does produce results, as long as you aren't getting frustrated.

Haha.. yeah I know it will produce results eventually. It also produces a DSP style rant sometimes. I didn't know touhou fighters were a thing. And why GG:XX specifically?

There are 4 Touhou fighting games (5 if you count hisoutensoku, which is an expansion of scarlet weather rhapsody). They play like "anime fighting" games other than that there is a massive emphasis on aerial movement, lots of projectiles and there is even grazing and spellcards.

I'm playing GG:XX because I'm mostly playing on PC at the moment and XX is supposedly the best Guilty Gear for PC. (Xrd is not on PC/Steam yet)

[Stevens]

Just passed the 45 hour mark with Skies and it has not let me down. It is the finest RPG I have ever played.

[broken harbour]

Just passed the 45 hour mark with Skies and it has not let me down. It is the finest RPG I have ever played.

Is the encounter rate as bad as many internets have claimed?

[Stevens]

Is the encounter rate as bad as many internets have claimed?

It's not even remotely near what the internet makes it out to be, and this is coming from a guy who completed Grandia 2 within the last 8 weeks (if you're not aware there are no random encounters in G2).

So no:D