XRGB-mini Framemeister

[springman]

Well ... this is what I have with Saturn@240p and DC@240p (SF3.3 with Start+L pressed at startup), both with sync set to Auto on Mini:

http://tinypic.com/r/16adrtd/8

I didn't count seriously but the flash comes up around twice in 180 secs.

Tried everything from caps and resistors. Still there.

I believe I got my Mini around your shipment too. I bought it in Japan last month through Amazon Japan. I'm gonna drop Micomsoft a message.

I'm very frustrated. Damn.

Yeah, that's pretty similar to my problem, that same flash of rainbow colors, though mine definitely occurs more often. Is your 480 stuff playing just fine, though?

Man, this is such a bummer - I was all excited and now I'm spending the whole weekend troubleshooting and doing anything but playing.

EDIT: I think I found the issue! I turned off the auto sync mode for each input setting, and it works perfectly now. Does anyone know where I can go to for information on why that was the case? So happy it works - now I can just stare at these amazing looking games the rest of the day.

Man, that's the problem. I mentioned it as well, it's all okay if you turn syne to off. But it's less than perfect. The most desired is running everything with Auto sync that means it locks the refresh rate to what the source is.

[Fudoh]

yes, that's definitely not a solution. Disabling the sync option increases the lag and causes stutter, since all input refresh rates are strictly converted to 59.94Hz straight.

[enigmaxtreme]

Hi

I just updated to v1.11 in hopes that it would solve some problems I'm having but instead it just brought on new ones.

The big problem I've been having is that when I capture HDMI devices like my Wii U and PS4 which I plug into the FM's HDMI IN 1 and out into my Avermedia LGP I notice a thin black line on the left side of the footage.

But now I updated to v1.11, I tried setting it to HDMI DIRECT, only for Avermedia RECentral to only show either a Blank screen or just a really distorted image.

Help?

[Ms. Tea]

I'm having trouble getting my SFC working, and wondered if anyone had any advice... I've tried searching around but I couldn't find anyone who seemed to have the same problem.

I've tried my Saturn and my SFC on the Framemeister so far. I've had glorious results with the Saturn, using a retro_console_accessories JP21 cable, but I'm having no luck with the SFC. I can't seem to get a video signal. I connected audio directly to speakers and it's coming through fine, however I'm just getting a black screen for video. I've tried my retro_console_accessories csync JP21 cable, and a combo composite/s-video cable I have (in both composite and s-video modes). The TV flashes "no signal", so it looks like the Framemeister sees some kind of signal, but it fails to actually display. I also can't access the Framemeister's menu until I turn off the SFC.

I've tried futzing with the "sync level", setting it between 9 and 15, with no change. (I also set it to 31 just to see what would happen - there the Framemeister doesn't even register a video signal, but it does send the audio to the TV.)

I don't have another TV to test with, so I can't rule out the possibility the SFC's video output died while it was in storage... it worked perfectly the last time I used it though. Any thoughts?

EDIT: false alarm, it seems to have been the SFC's framerate drifting too much for my monitor to handle. Setting "sync mode" to "off" fixed it. I could have sworn I tried that earlier and it didn't work... but it does now.

[aoiddr]

[deleted]

[blizzz]

false alarm, it seems to have been the SFC's framerate drifting too much for my monitor to handle. Setting "sync mode" to "off" fixed it.

That's interesting. The SFC outputs at roughly 60.10 Hz, the Saturn at 59.82 Hz. Both are original Japanese consoles. So if you just go by the difference, then the Saturn is even further away from the standard.

[Ms. Tea]

false alarm, it seems to have been the SFC's framerate drifting too much for my monitor to handle. Setting "sync mode" to "off" fixed it.

That's interesting. The SFC outputs at roughly 60.10 Hz, the Saturn at 59.82 Hz. Both are original Japanese consoles. So if you just go by the difference, then the Saturn is even further away from the standard.

Hm, interesting! Maybe it's the refresh rate being above 60Hz that my monitor couldn't handle, not that it was too far from the standard?

[springman]

Well ... this is what I have with Saturn@240p and DC@240p (SF3.3 with Start+L pressed at startup), both with sync set to Auto on Mini:

http://tinypic.com/r/16adrtd/8

I didn't count seriously but the flash comes up around twice in 180 secs.

Tried everything from caps and resistors. Still there.

I believe I got my Mini around your shipment too. I bought it in Japan last month through Amazon Japan. I'm gonna drop Micomsoft a message.

I'm very frustrated. Damn.

Yeah, that's pretty similar to my problem, that same flash of rainbow colors, though mine definitely occurs more often. Is your 480 stuff playing just fine, though?

Man, this is such a bummer - I was all excited and now I'm spending the whole weekend troubleshooting and doing anything but playing.

EDIT: I think I found the issue! I turned off the auto sync mode for each input setting, and it works perfectly now. Does anyone know where I can go to for information on why that was the case? So happy it works - now I can just stare at these amazing looking games the rest of the day.

A little bit of update ...

Actually I got my XRGB-Mini last month through Amazon Japan. A friend of mine had a trip in Tokyo and he picked it up for me. At the same time he bought one for himself. I borrowed his last night, and ...

Dreamcast@240p and Saturn@240p have the same issue on his XRGB unit.

So ... it's either my DC and Saturn, or that batch of XRGB unit-----I've checked the full status of his and my units. Both mine and his were produced 2013-01-31. For now, I'd rule out my RGB cables. I've tried caps and resistors.

I submitted a form at micomsoft.com a few days ago and no response yet.

[scottmog]

Vertical moving horizontal bars disappeared once I got a genuine Super Famicom power adapter and step down.

[Windfish]

N64 RGB via the Framemeister is a weird beast. Some games look good (SM64, SSB, etc.) and others look quite bad (both Zeldas). It's a shame.

[MojoBox]

Hello all,

First I just want to say this thread has been an amazing resource for me and I appreciate all the experts here sharing their knowledge.

I've been trying to run down a problem I've been having with my retro systems, I think it's the Framemeister but I'm not sure. I get a scrolling bar of some kind of interference with both my SNES and N64. It presents slightly differently, on the SNES it's a thick but faint dark "bar" that is most prominent in the greens that scrolls from the top of the screen to the bottom. Most of the time it's unnoticable but for some scenes (i.e.: Final Fantasy 6's field) it's rather distracting. On the N64 it behaves the same way, scrolling top to bottom, but instead of a thick bar it's a thin line that seems to skew pixels ever so slightly. I wouldn't even connect the two as the same problem except that the scrolling behavior is exactly the same. The only other system I use on the Framemeister is the Wii, but this either isn't affected or I haven't been able to notice it yet, and my other HD consoles exhibit no such interference.

I'm inclined to think it's interference from the power line, I already have to use a 50 hz hum filter to keep my AVR from buzzing, and I'm wondering if getting a different, US native AC adapter for the Framemeister itself would be worth trying. If anyone could give me any guidance or point me in the right direction to troubleshoot this it'd be much appreciated.

[CkRtech]

N64 RGB via the Framemeister is a weird beast. Some games look good (SM64, SSB, etc.) and others look quite bad (both Zeldas). It's a shame.

Yeah. The N64 Vaselined graphics don't really give higher quality analog output something to boast about. I am a scanlines off type of guy for all of my old consoles on my xrgb->hdtv setup, but I tend to turn them on when it is N64 time.

[blizzz]

Windfish, what are your settings for the N64? The Zelda games rely on the CRT blur and extra blur filter. I haven't tried it, but I imagine they should look decent in 480p output mode with scanlines.

[austin532]

Even on CRT both Zelda games don't look that great. They have not aged very well.

As for the CRT blur, I've come close at recreating it with the Mini but requires setting the H and V scaller to bizarre numbers.

[broken harbour]

Even using the recommended settings in the Wiki, 480i PS2 is still a blurry mess. I was playing Street Fighter Alpha anthology and even turning the in game sharpness up its blurry, maybe I'm just used to the games in 240p Saturn glory but damn... is this the best we can do with 480i content?

[andykara2003]

I've tried practically everything to make the N64 look good - it became a bit of an obsession (I love the Nintendo stuff).

After testing lots of CRTs including a very nice NEC XV29 and a BVM-20E1E, I found that for me, a low use 21" consumer Trinitron is the only display that the N64 looks acceptable on. At this TV size, the density of the apperture grille is high enough to produce a cohesive image & has only very slight scanlines. The otherwise blurry pixellated graphics come together and actually look quite nice - much like I remember them back in the day.

High end monitors tend to highlight the negative aspects of the N64's image, as does blowing it up on a big screen. Even my 25" Trinitron looks much worse than the 21" model and also looks strongly scanlined (I don't like heavy scanlines for 3D graphics). It makes big difference if the TV hasn't had much use and the N64 has been RGB modded.

[Josh128]

Andy, have you tried the 64 on the F4500? While certainly nowhere close to as good as a small SD CRT, I find the 240p mode is actually acceptable when using a minimum sharpness of 50 and gaming at least 5 feet from the 51"er. Looks much less harsh/staircasey via straight RGB than all other flat panels Ive tried it on.

Of course, Im using my F4500 as my main gaming set with 6 consoles connected to it, so my version of "acceptable" may not quite be the same as yours.

[andykara2003]

I haven't tried it yet, I'll have to give it a go. I'm going to wait for the break in before any more gaming on it to get the best impression. I'm following your suggested method & am on 16 cell light. One week to go

[austin532]

Not surprised that it looks best on a smaller CRT. The game was most likely developed on a 20" PVM. If I remember correctly the average TV size that gamers played on in the 90's was between 19"-25", at least from my experience. This would also explain why playing on a 21" Trinitron reminds you of what it looked like back then.

[andykara2003]

29" was common in that era as well. Not sure what it was developed on but the PVMs and BVMs certainly don't do the N64's image any favours in my opinion. The result is a pixellated mess. Actually I think it's much more likely it was developed on a computer monitor style display than a PVM.

[ahnslaught]

A little bit of update ...

Actually I got my XRGB-Mini last month through Amazon Japan. A friend of mine had a trip in Tokyo and he picked it up for me. At the same time he bought one for himself. I borrowed his last night, and ...

Dreamcast@240p and Saturn@240p have the same issue on his XRGB unit.

So ... it's either my DC and Saturn, or that batch of XRGB unit-----I've checked the full status of his and my units. Both mine and his were produced 2013-01-31. For now, I'd rule out my RGB cables. I've tried caps and resistors.

I submitted a form at micomsoft.com a few days ago and no response yet.

Hey springman, do you get the same problem on different tvs/monitors? I ask because I tried changing TVs, and today tried a Panasonic 720p set I had with auto sync on. No problems at all with the Framemeister, which I take to mean something with the previous TV (a Toshiba 1080p TV) couldn't handle what the framemeister was outputing with auto sync on, for whatever reason. That said, hey, everything works just great now.

Man, I had no idea how finicky stuff like this can get. To think, I used to think HDMI cables were a pain!

[BuckoA51]

Even using the recommended settings in the Wiki, 480i PS2 is still a blurry mess. I was playing Street Fighter Alpha anthology and even turning the in game sharpness up its blurry, maybe I'm just used to the games in 240p Saturn glory but damn... is this the best we can do with 480i content?

That doesn't sound right, last time I played 480i on the Mini it looked great. I was playing Gregory Horror Show as I recall.

[Fudoh]

480i is great, but who knows how bad SF Zero has been converted. Original 240p material running filtered in 480i isn't exactly the benchmark here. There's only so much you achieve with processing and it certainly will never look like a real 240p conversion (Saturn that is).

[TrendyNinja]

Hi guys, can anybody help me with a niggling issue I have trying to get my RGB modded N64 to work? I've been unable to get a stable picture using the euroscart to framemeister mini converter. I've taken auto sync off and tried manually adjusting and still unable to get a steady picture. It's very nearly there but refuses to stay permanently stable. So I've bought the mini converter with the built in sync stripper but now all I get is sound and no picture. Please help!

It does say on the sync stripper that it requires 5-12 volts on scart pin 8 to operate internal cleaner circuit but I'm not too sure as to what that entails?

Feeling a bit thick here so sorry.

[Juza]

Hi,
what are the best xrgb mini settings for playing psp emulators on Playstation TV ?
How can I increase scanlines height?

Thanks.

[TrendyNinja]

Well I've fixed my issue with my RGB modded n64 not showing a stable picture...but the resolution makes no sense to me whatsoever! Using the Euro scart mini converter I've decided to try using my original xbox again with the xrgb mini and have got much better results. If I disconnect the xbox scart lead and plug in my scart for the N64 BOOM! I get a rock solid clear picture. No flickering, nothing. Looks superb to me. Make any adjustments though such as going from 480p to 720p and I lose the picture and message stating no signal. Plug the xbox scart back in wait a few secs to get a picture, disconnect and plug N64 scart back in and lo and behold a rock solid, steady picture again. What on earth is going on here? This just makes no sense at all to me. Any ideas at all?

[Windfish]

Yeah, I am bummed about the N64 situation. The best games on that system are bonafide gaming monuments, especially Mario 64 and the Zeldas. So it sucks that they look pretty bad. It seems that the best legitimate way to play these games is on Wii VC. But no rumble! Ugh.

If there is some way - any way - of improving the N64 situation, lemme know!

[MojoBox]

I've found switching to 1080p/Smart x2 makes a big difference for the n64. It comes with some obvious drawbacks but the improved sharpness helps a lot I find.

[Rongolian]

Hey everyone, long time lurker here, wanted to share some results I've had with my N64 through the Framemeister.

I, too, was pretty disappointed with the output from the N64. I RGB modded my console, and I felt like I was just able to see a better-colored crappy image.

The problems I have with the image are difficult to explain, I see "jaggies" or "glitches" from some of the 3D models. The easiest way to explain it is to boot up Super Mario 64, and look at his idle animations. You'll notice some shapes that appear for just a few frames when his arms meet his legs, and it looks just glitchy. The same can be seen in the title screen if you look at his eyes, you'll see that they occasionally have little artifacts that aren't the normal circle shapes.

Anyway, I've given up on removing this, as I think it's just either the way the graphics are rendered or a way Nintendo has applied some filter to make the game run smoother.

I have, however used these settings to give the N64 a "CRT blur" enough to where I'm really happy with it:

Image Mode: Picture
Auto_scaler: Disabled
H-Scaler: 15 (I know this seems high, but try it. Notice the nice bump between 14 and 15 as well)
V-Scale: 6
HDMI Output: 720p
V-Line: On (scanlines enabled)

Hope this helps some N64 fans out there!

[blizzz]

The artifacts are caused by the anti-aliasing filter, or maybe it should just be called blur filter on the N64. It don't really understand all the complaints about the N64's graphics though. I played Majora's Mask just last week on a real N64 and CRT and it looks good. I prefer the soft look compared to the extreme jaggies of the PSX.

I think it looks good enough on the Framemeister on 480p or with a high H-Scale setting on 720p with scanlines. Maybe you're expecting too much? You can't get smooth edges from the console.