OK, I understand why NiGHTS is awesome now...

[icepick]

But Naka himself said he doesn't want to make a sequel. What an arrogant jerk.

I hope that you're not instigating. Aren't you a big Sega fan? Anyway, NiGHTS was so good that even he doesn't think that he could match it in the same way a second time. I heard that they started on 'Air NiGHTS' for the DC, but, decided not to go through with it. Remember that one time that news places reported that there would be something like ten or eleven Sonic Team games over the span of two years, and that only two or three of them would actually have Sonic in them?

Anyway, NiGHTS is the best. The music, the visuals, the feelings. Indeed, I myself didn't realize how nuts it can be until I tried to get a better grade than C. It's like a whole new world opened! Then, in Christmas NiGHTS, I thought that the Link Attack present wouldn't be very fun, but after I was ready to move on from Time Attack, I decided to give it a shot. It's funny as to how nervous you get when you're streaming at breakneck speed through the first mare of Frozen Bell with an ever-increasing link count and a fine margin for error.

This talk makes me want to look around for a high score list with those bonus trick count things... I don't think that I've ever gotten past... "Amazing Eight!"? Well, whichever one "eight" is.

[jp]

I think I got to 10 ONCE. Typically I'm just in the 5-7 range though.

[Tomtom]

I was just playing and realized that all the music in the game had changed subtly. That is awesome, and I wish I knew what triggered it. I've gotten A's on everything but Stick Canyon and Mystic Forest now.

And Frozen Bell's first mare is awesome, yes. So far I've only gotten around 50 links on it, but I know how to do it now. It seems there are a few places where you may be able to loop infinitely like that.

OK, one thing that makes me mad, though, is the boss that throws cards at you. I have no idea how to beat that one, and it seems like a 50/50 chance of getting past it when I get it.

[Specineff]

Not to brag about it, but I was able to pull a nine, later a ten, and up to 11. It was back in 2001. And it was more by luck than skill. Or maybe it was a 10, max.

Getting all A's is not that hard. The museum, and canyon stages though, are really, really hard.

The music changes randomly, depending on the mood of the nightopians you hatch. It's one of the most amazing features of the game, that the music changes tones and octaves, so basically you are never flying to the same tune.

[E. Randy Dupre]

It's not totally random - like you say, it's tied into the AI, and the AI changes depending on how you interact with it.

There's an infinite loop on the first section of Claris' first level too, iirc. I lent my copy out to a friend a couple of years ago, so can't remember exactly.

The one thing that people tend to either ignore or not realise about NiGHTS is that, great as it is, one of the levels is fundamentally broken. It's *far* easier to complete Stick Canyon with an A just by walking around the level as the kid than it is with NiGHTS. That's the one and only point where the level design is broken, and it's massively broken. A real shame - I wanted the last world to have plenty of hidden infinite looping opportunities, but Sonic Team's inability to stop fiddling (seriously - they always manage to screw things up by hitting on a near-perfect formula, then can't stop themselves from adding bits to it until it all falls apart) made that one area disappointing.

A sequel would, I think, be a bad idea. That doesn't mean that there isn't room for a remake, though - a smoother framerate would be a godsend for those of us who feel they've maxed out the points available.

[icepick]

I was just playing and realized that all the music in the game had changed subtly. That is awesome, and I wish I knew what triggered it.

That's the only bad thing about the official soundtrack CD, if anything could possibly ever be said badly about it -- It includes only the default, 'line-level' if you will, versions of all of the songs. If anyone's played Christmas NiGHTS with a NiGHTS save file in the Saturn and has completed the standard NiGHTS levels (I think), then, once they've opened the 'music box' present in Christmas NiGHTS, they'll see just how many versions of each song there can be... For pretty much every couple of bars, there are something like five or six variations, aren't there? It's nuts, and such a creative idea, in my opinion.

(Every so often when I'm producing some electronic music, I'll have more than one idea for a particular section, and it would be sad to have to cut all but one out for the final mix, but it wouldn't have the same feel if all of the parts were included sequentially. Nightopian mood-based music is perfect!)

As for Jackle (spoiler): My younger sister had a big problem with him, too. The trick, I think, is firstly to make sure that you're approaching him from the shortest distance (as the arena is circular/cylindrical, and he'll try to stay on the far side chucking cards). Since it takes him a little bit to change directions, you might try suddenly changing to approach from the opposite direction. Next, NiGHTS is much slicker than the cards, although the cards are quite a bit faster -- Fly near the top or the bottom, and then, right as a card approaches you, dart sharply downwards or upwards at a trajectory which will allow you to... 'outstream' the card. Once you've knocked Jackles cloak off, he'll keep trying to get back to it by whichever direction is shorter--keep him away from it, and the match should be over!

I love this game.

[judesalmon]

Couldn't they just remake it for GC with some new levels? That'd be fine by me.

The Saturn's clock affects the music too.

[E. Randy Dupre]

God, I hope not. Given the recent quality of Sonic Team's output, I dread to think how much they could fuck the game up with a set of new levels. I'd like to see them give it to the UGA people who they gained in Sega's last big reshuffle, though - could see them doing something very special, given the opportunity. Just as long as Naka kept his hands off.

[judesalmon]

God, I hope not. Given the recent quality of Sonic Team's output, I dread to think how much they could fuck the game up with a set of new levels. I'd like to see them give it to the UGA people who they gained in Sega's last big reshuffle, though - could see them doing something very special, given the opportunity. Just as long as Naka kept his hands off.

I think they're governed by market forces now unfortunately. They turned a bit of a corner with Feel The Magic, so hopefully their output is set to improve in quality.

NiGHTS is further evidence of why when in its prime (Saturn and DC days), Sega wiped the floor with Nintendo.

[E. Randy Dupre]

I think they're governed by market forces now unfortunately. They turned a bit of a corner with Feel The Magic, so hopefully their output is set to improve in quality.

I've not played it myself yet, but from what I've seen it looks *very* UGA in terms of visual design. The whole silhouette thing bears a striking resemblance to some of the presentation in Space Channel 5 Part 2. It's a promising sign, but I think the real answer to whether or not the new members can help ST make good games again will come with the new Sonic game they're canvassing opinion on. If any series needed an injection of new blood, it's that one.

[sininenat]

This talk makes me want to look around for a high score list with those bonus trick count things... I don't think that I've ever gotten past... "Amazing Eight!"? Well, whichever one "eight" is.

Through a singular stroke of luck, I once managed to achieve a 12. A reputable source tells me this is the maximum possible.

I was just playing and realized that all the music in the game had changed subtly. That is awesome, and I wish I knew what triggered it. I've gotten A's on everything but Stick Canyon and Mystic Forest now.

As some nice fellows have already mentioned, the music is tied to those cute little cone headed denizens of the dream world, Nightopians. If things are going well for them - e.g. there's a thriving population, and all of the male Nightopians are getting lots of sex - then the music has a more cheerful ring to it. However, they don't like it when you destroy entire civilisations in one go, with a single paraloop. Try to avoid this. Nightopians may also be adverse to advanced genetic splicing experimentation, so be wary of that when you're knocking enemies about with your head.

If you've got Christmas Nights, one of the presents looks at your Nights save file, and lets you check how each of your Nightopian eco-systems are coming along in the main game.



Finally:

The Saturn is all the videogame technology needed - who needs N5, Xbox 2 and PS3 when we have the Saturn?

Signed.

[alpha5099]

Can anyone give me some NiGHTS pointers? I'm completely dead in the water when it comes to fighting the bosses. Maybe I'm missing some basic gameplay mechanics, but I'm barely able to make a dent in the boss' health before time runs out. I've tried circling them, but I can't make that big a circle yet, it never comes out complete. And grabbing them and throwing them seems to do so little damage.

[Tomtom]

Well, all of the bosses have different ways to beat them. I don't really know how to do the dragon boss yet, I just keep running into its head until the ending music starts playing. As for Puffy, just throw her through the bars in the walls. Eventually you'll get to the corner and a cage will fall and trap her.

Jackle still makes me very mad. I would've gotten an A more than once on Soft Museum if it wasn't for that one...

[E. Randy Dupre]

I don't really know how to do the dragon boss yet, I just keep running into its head until the ending music starts playing.

This is from memory, because even though I just got my copy back after lending it to a mate years ago, I forgot to pick up my analogue pad. Boo. Anyway, iirc what you need to do for a good time bonus here is get a way in front of the boss, then start the movement for a giant paraloop, timing it so that the boss is inside the loop when you finally form it. It's difficult to do when the boss is full length, but if you knock it down to a smaller size to begin with by starting off just spinning into its head, it'll get easier to fit him inside the paraloop.

I think. I might be misremembering. Try it and see.

[Morden]

Does anyone remember the TV ad for NiGHTS? Where they rave about the one of a kind, all free 3D enviroment and all that? And then you get to see the PlayStation being dropped from a building. There was some sharp talk to it too. Something like

"There never was a game as great as NiGHTS. Not ever. Especially not on that other platform. Because with just one processor it simply doesn't
have the power. Fly, you're not ready"

I actually booted up my NiGHTS last week just to dust it off and it still rocks, as it did a few years back. I will never understand why Sega Saturn ended up like it did, despite all the awsome games. You'll never find another Fighters Megamix, Radiant Silvergun, NiGHTS, Panzer Dragoos and so on.

Btw. get the Christmas Edition if you get the chance. Same game, only... not. :)

[E. Randy Dupre]

I will never understand why Sega Saturn ended up like it did, despite all the awsome games.

Ah, y'see that's got nothing to do with the games and everything to do with Sega's business and marketing decisions - in the run-up to the Sat's release, during its life, and even in the years before it was a twinkle in their eyes.

[jp]

Does anyone remember the TV ad for NiGHTS? Where they rave about the one of a kind, all free 3D enviroment and all that? And then you get to see the PlayStation being dropped from a building. There was some sharp talk to it too. Something like

"There never was a game as great as NiGHTS. Not ever. Especially not on that other platform. Because with just one processor it simply doesn't
have the power. Fly, you're not ready"

"Fly plaything fly, you're not ready"


I've got that in my sig at some forum (IGN I think).