Dodonpachi Saidaioujou general thread

[Bananamatic]

but people did 1cc shot on the 1st day

[qmish]

pretty sure there was a video of someone getting to the final boss on the 1st try

But , the question is, who was the player?

Someone who eats shmups for breakfast doesn't equal someone who didnt 1cc anything in his life

[Shepardus]

Well of course you'd have to be a good player to get to the stage 5 boss on the first try, but the point there is that apparently it's still reasonable without having memorized everything.

[Nameschonvergeben]

A shmup is only fair if my mom could 1cc it on her first credit, everything else in artificial difficulty

[Squire Grooktook]

Not really. A good game designer can easily create something that's doable on the first try (it's called telegraphing, it's a really basic game design concept) and yet remains challenging even when everything is memorized.

but who the hell Ofwants to play a shmup you could easily 1CC on your first try?

You may want to reread my post. That's not what I said.

I said doable. As in theoretically doable. Not easily doable. A first try 1cc could be the hardest thing in the world, the stuff of legends, but it doesn't need to be impossible (and, in my opinion, should never be for a variety of practical reasons that are not worth going into here).

or keeping bullet speed at a moderate level.

Really, you don't even need to do this. The limit of human reaction is about 10 frames at 60 fps. You can theoretically react to the fastest shit without knowing it's coming. It's just really really hard.

But yeah, otherwise, all you have to do is not create traps that result in unavoidable death if you're not pre-positioned in a specific non-telegraphed location. You can easily do this with no negative consequences for the other aspects of the game.

[Shalashaska]

The best way I can put my feelings about the game is that, while I like a lot about the way things are put together, the game felt "mean" to me in a way that no other title in the series did. Even DOJ, while tough, never felt like it was outright stealing lives from you; this one, though, for whatever reason, always seemed to kill me in spots where I could swear I should have gotten away with it. I don't know whether it's the aforementioned input lag, a change to the hitbox I never adjusted to, my own imagination, or something else entirely, but I never felt "comfortable" with SDOJ, almost every death made me say "whuh?" I really have no concrete explanation for why the bugger rubbed me that way, since so many other things about it make me want to consider it the best of the series (enough to throw it a zero vote, anyway), but if other challenging shooters I've enjoyed are intimidating tough guys with hearts of gold, this one's just a big, strong, handsome jerk.

That pretty much sums up my feelings for SDOJ as well. I'm a big fan of the DDP series and was really excited when they announced SDOJ but once I finally received my copy (X360) and tried it, I felt mixed. As you said, BM, it's pretty brutal, or at least feels that way. I also can't decide if I just suck (most likely), it's the input lag, or what but I just can't seem to find my groove with SDOJ.

My motivation to stick with it and progress was also severely dampened by the fact that 90% of your score comes from stage 5 (or at least, it seems that way). I never became practiced enough to consistently make it to stage 5 anyway; it just never felt like I was ever making much progress.

It also seemed like (to me) A-Shot was the only good ship/shot combo to play as. The other DDP games I would settle on a favorite, of course, but I could usually do alright with all the combos. I don't know what it is but every other ship type besides A-Shot feels way off to me in SDOJ. This lack of useable variety was also kind of off-putting.

If a Steam port appears and they eliminate the input lag, I'll probably double dip to give it another shot. I really want to love the game but as of right now I feel pretty lukewarm toward it.

[Bananamatic]

i thought the shot types were pretty much perfectly balanced

[Squire Grooktook]

Yeah, they felt pretty good to me. I usually rotated between red and green ships. Blue seemed solid too.

[Jeneki]

Request to change the topic title to: Anyone else feeling the Saidaioujou meh?

[RHE]

Request to change the topic title to: Anyone else feeling the Saidaioujou meh?

I played this a lot lately and I liked it, but I found the game got worse until Stage 3... it got worse and worse from that stage on but could be just me.

Edit: I think I misunderstood your real purpose of your posting though. Nevermind.

[Strikers1945guy]

How can you be upset a Donpachi game is "mean"? Thank the heavens it's a challenge and not some beginner friendly milestone pushover of a game.

[CStarFlare]

I kind of know what they mean. I've got a few solid cave clears under my belt and got the DOJ clear, but I was lucky to get past the stage 3 mid boss in SDOJ. It does feel "meaner" than a lot of those. I've always wondered if the lag had anything to do with it - hopefully there will be a PC version that answers that question.

[BulletMagnet]

How can you be upset a Donpachi game is "mean"? Thank the heavens it's a challenge and not some beginner friendly milestone pushover of a game.

It's not the raw challenge level itself that bothered me - again, DOJ always struck me as perfectly fair - but rather the way the game makes things difficult for you. In DOJ I always felt like the game gave me all the tools I needed to succeed, and that despite the high level of execution needed to win, the game wants to instill some measure of comfort and confidence and as I practice and improve; SDOJ, on the other hand, feels like someone handing me a dented hammer and bent screwdriver while smirking "go ahead, fix it, what're you waiting for?" and then regularly leaning in to shout "WRONG!" in my ear as I fumble around.

Again, part of it could be just me personally, but I just wasn't ever able to "settle in" with the game to any notable extent; I always ended up thinking less about how to no-bomb a bullet pattern or squeeze some more points out of a level than worrying about where the game would suddenly decide to nickel-and-dime me out of a life next. My experience is hardly universal, obviously, but I really wish I'd liked the game more than I did, as in many other ways it's one of my (potential) favorites.

[DQ187]

I'm a big fan of Dodonpachi, the Saturn one being my favorite. I was excited to get this one and play it but found myself not being as into as I am the original or even Resurrection. I feel the hit box is larger than the other ones so if you're use to those it makes for some cheap deaths. I havnt played it for a while so I'll have to pop it back in and give it another go. I remember liking 1 of the game modes quite a bit though. Not a bad game but not as enjoyable as the previous entries, in my opinion anyway.

[Cagar]

Well of course you'd have to be a good player to get to the stage 5 boss on the first try, but the point there is that apparently it's still reasonable without having memorized everything.

And no-one ever claimed that it isn't reasonable.
It's just less fun/satisfying when you have to bomb or die time to time because of not memoing. Obviously it can still be an easy clear for a good player, but certainly not as fun.

[d0s]

How can you be upset a Donpachi game is "mean"? Thank the heavens it's a challenge and not some beginner friendly milestone pushover of a game.

Man you shit on milestone in every other post and I'm starting to think you have a complex about them. Games don't have to be incredibly difficult to be good or fun. I agree about Donpachi games specifically though, it would be weird if it wasn't hard as fuck

[Bananamatic]

It's just less fun/satisfying when you have to bomb or die time to time because of not memoing

literally every cave game ever

[Feedbacker]

SDOJ difficulty curve is steeper than the usual 'Pachis because it is a 1 loop game. Keep in mind that when you 1-ALLed DDP or DOJ you actually cleared less than 50% of the games. Thus the right comparison you should go for is : are SDOJ shot/laser modes stage 4 and 5 meaner than DDP/DOJ late second loop stages ?

[Bananamatic]

by that logic sdoj should count with inbachi which is probably almost unbeatable

[Shepardus]

Well there is expert mode which is kind of like a second loop. How does it compare to, say, Mushihimesama or Mushi Futari's modes?

[Bananamatic]

without hibachi it's easier than DOJBL
with hibachi it's harder than futari ultra

[Feedbacker]

by that logic sdoj should count with inbachi which is probably almost unbeatable

You can clear the stages without encountering her, right ? So that would be something like clearing 95 % of the complete game, still better than a DOJ 1-all.
Putting aside TLBs, my point was I dont think it's fair to compare SDOJ shot/laser stages to DDP or DOJ first loop only.

[SMC]

Was the lionmanggg inbachi clear ever confirmed to be legit or not legit?

[KAI]

Just played a few creds on it and deleted the game from my HDD. Dodonpachi Saidaiclusterfuck wasn't my thing.

[Chaos Phoenixma]

Was the lionmanggg inbachi clear ever confirmed to be legit or not legit?

It was on the leaderboard, so the only way I could think of to cheat would be pause abuse(there were some rerecorded stuff before that though). It's been a while since I've seen the replay, so I'm not sure if there was anything suspicious before Inbachi, but Inbachi is where the main problems would be if there were any.

[monouchi]

This game needs a Black Label version so bad.

This. Add more Yagawa.

[Bananamatic]

Was the lionmanggg inbachi clear ever confirmed to be legit or not legit?

It was on the leaderboard, so the only way I could think of to cheat would be pause abuse(there were some rerecorded stuff before that though). It's been a while since I've seen the replay, so I'm not sure if there was anything suspicious before Inbachi, but Inbachi is where the main problems would be if there were any.

the 1st form is definitely legit but the final doesn't seem doable to me

[Blinge]

It's just less fun/satisfying when you have to bomb or die time to time because of not memoing

literally every cave game ever

Eh, it's true.

I don't own SDOJ, only tried it at shmupmeets.
I hope they port it to Steam one day with the lag issue fixed.

[Strikers1945guy]

How can you be upset a Donpachi game is "mean"? Thank the heavens it's a challenge and not some beginner friendly milestone pushover of a game.

Man you shit on milestone in every other post and I'm starting to think you have a complex about them. Games don't have to be incredibly difficult to be good or fun. I agree about Donpachi games specifically though, it would be weird if it wasn't hard as fuck

Milestone games are atrocities (in my opinion). The only thing they do right is music and sometimes art style. Shmups don't have to be balls to the wall hard but milestone games are about as fun as watching paint dry.

[qmish]

Kai, where are you?