Galaga Legions (XBLA)

8 1/2 · Post by **8 1/2** » Wed Aug 13, 2008 12:31 am

Oh, and it's not only analog stick for movement. You'll be able to use that shitty 360 d-pad all you like for ship movement.

Post by **Dave_K.** » Wed Aug 13, 2008 1:33 am

Thanks for the mini-review 8 1/2! (and welcome back?)

8 1/2 wrote:Oh, and it's not only analog stick for movement. You'll be able to use that shitty 360 d-pad all you like for ship movement.

Ah, its a moot point now for arcade controls since the right analog stick is required for option movement.

320x240 · Post by **320x240** » Wed Aug 13, 2008 1:54 pm

So this is a poor mans arena shooter?

sjewkestheloon · Post by **sjewkestheloon** » Wed Aug 13, 2008 3:22 pm

I quite fancy this, it's good being out the loop for a while as you tend to get pleasantly suprised.

8 1/2 · Post by **8 1/2** » Wed Aug 13, 2008 6:01 pm

I put another hour on it this morning, and I'm starting to warm up to it a bit. I wouldn't say it's a poor man's arena shooter, so much as a poor man's Ikaruga. Though it's slow to start, I could see it getting pretty addictive as it progresses. Hunting down the leader and watching a cloud of minions explode in unison has a satisfying feel to it, and some of the patterns are well-thought out in terms of what movements the player needs to do to escape. The strangest addition is the "legion" that you can acquire. By shooting a large orb, you can gain all the minions on screen as your options, and they will respond (all 20+ of them) to the analog stick the same way. The trouble is, that the entire score mechanic is based around precision shots to take out leader ships, and having the legion just washes the screen in bullets and murders everything that comes on screen. It's almost like having a bomb that just keeps going off to the point where it destroys the fun. Skilled high-score play in this game is definitely going involve avoiding the "legion orb" at all costs. It seems just totally counter-intuitive to have the major power-up in the game, one which is part of the title itself (henced Galaga LEGIONS) actually work against a player hunting for high score.

One overriding feeling remains: It's NOT Galaga. Having the ability to move all over the screen, and to aim your options with the right analog stick just destroys the feeling of the classic game. While Pac-Man CE was able to take the classic gameplay and add new twists, this has taken the reverse appoach. It has a lot of new twists, but very little of the classic gameplay. There's even an option to reskin the game in a "vintage" look which just alters the textures on the models to have a blocky old-school look, but this actually seems to add even more bloom, making the game actually less playable with these visuals.

subcons · Post by **subcons** » Wed Aug 13, 2008 6:56 pm

Sounds pretty disappointing, at least for Galaga fans.

Shame too. I was really looking forward to this.

seiatsu · Post by **seiatsu** » Thu Aug 14, 2008 1:02 am

I'm still greatly looking forward to this (supposed to be next week btw). However, I was never expecting it to be like classic galaga though. I was thinking more of a new twist on shooter type game play (with a few classic, not necessarily galaga specific, bit thrown in). I suspected the initial stages of the game would be slow (as is galaga).

Having said that, I've always been a big galaga fan. I think not expecting galaga going in will make this game better.

evil_ash_xero · Post by **evil_ash_xero** » Fri Aug 15, 2008 11:46 pm

caligvla wrote:Pac-Man Championship Edition was the only reason why I bought an Xbox 360... Now I hope they will put Galaga on Disc, I have an xbox w/o HD.

You know, it's quality, but I really wish it had a "stage" mode, instead of just the time based thing.

I hope this game has stages, like SIE.

s/m

Zaarock · Post by **Zaarock** » Wed Aug 20, 2008 5:29 pm

Looks like its out on XBLA now. Great fun so far, the enemy patterns get quite bullet hellish and interesting the further you progress. the game isnt too easy either, which I would have expected. I havent beaten level 3 yet and the achievements dont seem ridiculously easy.

Necronopticous · Post by **Necronopticous** » Wed Aug 20, 2008 5:56 pm

evil_ash_xero wrote:You know, [Pac Man C.E. is] quality, but I really wish it had a "stage" mode, instead of just the time based thing.

Iwatani very intentionally removed simple stage play from the classic formula, and it was no mistake. He truly understood what made his original game so great, and he focused on, and perfected those things. A lot of great classic games may have been good design accidents, but Pac Man C.E. is proof that Iwatani knew exactly was he was doing in the '80s.

I'm going to give Legions a try when I get home from work; can't wait.

escadrille · Post by **escadrille** » Wed Aug 20, 2008 6:15 pm

I found this game to be quite interesting. Swarms of popcorn from all sides that need to be wiped out by carefully placing your satellites. Very satisfying.

I've always been a pretty big Galaga fan, but I wasn't expecting a straight remake of Galaga. The simplicity of the original can't be improved upon, and a bunch of HD lighting effects and bloom wouldn't have made the original any better in my view.

Thunder Force · Post by **Thunder Force** » Thu Aug 21, 2008 1:01 am

As a lifelong Galaga fan I'm disappointed after the hype and attractive screenshots, as the game doesn't seem to play as Galaga-ish or even Gaplus-ish as I expected. It seems to be a pretty interesting shooter, but far from being the definitive game in this series... imo Galaga, Gaplus, Galaga '88, and Galaga Arrangement '95 all remain superior traditional shooters. I will definitely put more time into this though, as at least it seems to be a much more carefully thought out design than the last (PSP exclusive) sequel in this franchise was. I think if they removed those tracer lines that predict for you where the next enemy patttern will be, the game would have a better feel.

Damocles · Post by **Damocles** » Thu Aug 21, 2008 2:40 am

The game (demo at least) doesn't feel like a shooter. Actually, check that, the game feels like it is comprised totally of the bonus stages from the original Galaga. Flashy and score-centric is great, but I don't necessarily think I'd want that to be the entire game.

Zuhzuhzombie!! · Post by **Zuhzuhzombie!!** » Thu Aug 21, 2008 3:26 am

The trouble is, that the entire score mechanic is based around precision shots to take out leader ships, and having the legion just washes the screen in bullets and murders everything that comes on screen.

Not quite.

When you start shooting enemies, your multiplier goes up, all the way to 16. You get your multiplier up by hitting or killing baddies. So, while you do want to hit the leader and chain them all together when you get the multiplier up to 16, you can milk the small enemies for extra points.

Often times the game throws enemy patterns at you with the leader first, so you kill them and everything behind them with little to no multiplier.

Usually after you get the Legion, the game throws a short round at you where you just scramble to destroy everything on screen. Usually get an alart and flashing red lights.

It's NOT Galaga. Having the ability to move all over the screen, and to aim your options with the right analog stick just destroys the feeling of the classic game.

I started to feel the same way at first, but it definitely started to have a Galaga 88'/Galaga Arrangement feel to it. This is really helped by using the retro graphics.

So far, I'm enjoying it. I'm on the fence with it in terms of how good I feel about the game. It starts slow, but the difficulty really starts to ramp up end of world 2. Enemies fly at you from all sorts of angles, you have to watch the tracers and then anticipate them all while placing your turrets and avoiding the enemies that are already on screen. Of course, if you start thinking about playing for score, you'll need to start recognizing what patterns are coming up, and what motions you need to do in order to get the maximum score.

Graphics are fine. There are, as far as I know, three sets to choose from. The Galaxian ship, the Galaga ship, and the updated one. There seems to be some unlockables as well, but I haven't figured out how to get them.

Going from GeoWars 2 to this is fun. It's the absolute opposite in terms of how you play.

Regardless, the game is fairly inventive and pretty fresh.

EDIT

I could be wrong, and the popcorn enemies might not give you any points at all. I dunno, I was more interested in trying to play through it than paying close attention to score mechanics.

Doesn't seem to be any point based 1Ups though.

sideshow · Post by **sideshow** » Thu Aug 21, 2008 3:51 am

They should of threw in some sort of multi player cop otherwise I like how the enemy formations that they throw at you are always a bit different. This is fun game and quite challenging.

subcons · Post by **subcons** » Thu Aug 21, 2008 5:41 am

I only played it for a little bit, but I see myself liking this. Pretty challenging too. I guess I just expected it to be on the easier side in order to appeal to the masses–definitely doesn't seem to be the case.

Can't wait to dig into it some more tomorrow.

Zuhzuhzombie!! · Post by **Zuhzuhzombie!!** » Thu Aug 21, 2008 12:22 pm

subcons wrote:I only played it for a little bit, but I see myself liking this. Pretty challenging too. I guess I just expected it to be on the easier side in order to appeal to the masses–definitely doesn't seem to be the case.

Can't wait to dig into it some more tomorrow.

Yeah, whoever said this was a shmup for the casual crowed/masses was very wrong.

Dragon1952 · Post by **Dragon1952** » Thu Aug 21, 2008 2:56 pm

As a lover of the Galaga series, especially Galaga 88 and similar types of cartoon shooters and after playing this demo, I have to say that I am disappointed!

I was so looking forward to this game but it bears little rememblence to any Galaga game. Granted I love what they did with Pacman CE, and I bought that, but this one is going to take some time to love. It is just so different. Whereas Galaga and other shooters like R-Type require a little strategy, this is just shooting and shoot some more (so far at least).

So far no sale for me!

BTW, I am carefully designing a new arcade shooter for release next year that is built in the "spirit" of the Galaga types of games.

dmauro · Post by **dmauro** » Thu Aug 21, 2008 3:02 pm

There may not be any point based 1ups, but I definitely got a 1up in the demo somehow, but I'm not sure what I did to earn it.

Someone hurry up and figure this game out and write a strat thread because the demo isn't really helping me to fully understand the scoring.

Dave_K. wrote:
8 1/2 wrote:Oh, and it's not only analog stick for movement. You'll be able to use that shitty 360 d-pad all you like for ship movement.
Ah, its a moot point now for arcade controls since the right analog stick is required for option movement.

It's not a moot point. My d-pad is modded, so playing with that is much much better than using the analog stick. It's no sanwa stick, but it works.

Zaarock · Post by **Zaarock** » Thu Aug 21, 2008 3:17 pm

dmauro wrote:There may not be any point based 1ups, but I definitely got a 1up in the demo somehow, but I'm not sure what I did to earn it.

You get one every fourth "stage" of a level, with the big warning screen and all.

Zuhzuhzombie!! · Post by **Zuhzuhzombie!!** » Thu Aug 21, 2008 3:24 pm

Dragon1952 wrote:As a lover of the Galaga series, especially Galaga 88 and similar types of cartoon shooters and after playing this demo, I have to say that I am disappointed!

I was so looking forward to this game but it bears little rememblence to any Galaga game. Granted I love what they did with Pacman CE, and I bought that, but this one is going to take some time to love. It is just so different. Whereas Galaga and other shooters like R-Type require a little strategy, this is just shooting and shoot some more (so far at least).

So far no sale for me!

BTW, I am carefully designing a new arcade shooter for release next year that is built in the "spirit" of the Galaga types of games.

Have you tried changing the skins?

I know this is largely an insignificant change in some peoples opinion, but using the old Galaga style graphics pretty much opened my eyes and made me say, "Yes. This is a NEW Galaga."

We have to remember. Galaga was an incrimental update to Galaxian. Same thing for Gaplus and Galaga 88/Arrangement. This is the first "sequel". There are the Galaga fundamentals, and there are the new additions.

I think it's about as large of a difference as there being no "free" levels in PacMan CE. It doesn't jive with the original game, but the fundamentals are there.

subcons · Post by **subcons** » Thu Aug 21, 2008 4:18 pm

dmauro wrote:It's not a moot point. My d-pad is modded, so playing with that is much much better than using the analog stick. It's no sanwa stick, but it works.

He's talking about the analogue being used to lay down your drones. I guess they could've made it so you lay them down with the face buttons (A for down, B for right, etc.), but I'm really not having a problem with the control scheme at all. Still would've been nice to be able to customize them though.

TodayIsForgotten · Post by **TodayIsForgotten** » Thu Aug 21, 2008 4:35 pm

I think its cool. There is strategy involved in how to avoid certain formations. I also think that since its called Galaga Legions and not Galaga CE or something with the original galaga... would lead me to believe (atleast)that it wasnt going to be a galaga remake. I mean if pacman were called pacman swarm - you would have to think it was going to be a completely different game.

seiatsu · Post by **seiatsu** » Thu Aug 21, 2008 11:06 pm

I've only played a bit but it seems decent...I will play more.

btw: did anyone notice the superplay-esque "demo" on the demo. If you can play like that or better, then you can call this game easy. I thought the final would have more of that but it seems that it is replaced with the replay feature. not sure why they didn't include it but it was nice to look at

dmauro · Post by **dmauro** » Fri Aug 22, 2008 1:51 pm

subcons wrote:
dmauro wrote:It's not a moot point. My d-pad is modded, so playing with that is much much better than using the analog stick. It's no sanwa stick, but it works.
He's talking about the analogue being used to lay down your drones. I guess they could've made it so you lay them down with the face buttons (A for down, B for right, etc.), but I'm really not having a problem with the control scheme at all. Still would've been nice to be able to customize them though.

No, he was saying the fact that the d-pad is usable is a moot point because you still can't play it with an arcade stick, but what I'm saying is that that's not the only reason you'd want the d-pad to be usable for movement. Even if you're stuck with a regular controller, playing with a modded d-pad is superior to the analog left joystick.

But yeah, I'm not sure why they didn't make the options placeable with the four face buttons. Of course that wouldn't be much good unless they also allowed you to remap the controls.

Zuhzuhzombie!! · Post by **Zuhzuhzombie!!** » Fri Aug 22, 2008 1:56 pm

Popcorn enemies do count towards your points, so milking the waves is preferable over simply aiming for the leader to clear them.

dmauro · Post by **dmauro** » Fri Aug 22, 2008 2:17 pm

So it's official then, the demonstration is pretty much worthless?

(edit: fixed)

That reminds me of when my friend was watching ESPGaluda's attract mode saying "what's demon scracion?"

Zuhzuhzombie!! · Post by **Zuhzuhzombie!!** » Fri Aug 22, 2008 2:46 pm

Demonstation?

gennss · Post by **gennss** » Fri Aug 22, 2008 4:41 pm

I didn't like it. It wasn't what i had in mind, and it seemed overly complex. But thats me...

subcons · Post by **subcons** » Fri Aug 22, 2008 5:12 pm

dmauro wrote:No, he was saying the fact that the d-pad is usable is a moot point because you still can't play it with an arcade stick, but what I'm saying is that that's not the only reason you'd want the d-pad to be usable for movement. Even if you're stuck with a regular controller, playing with a modded d-pad is superior to the analog left joystick.

Oh, okay, I see what you're saying. A controller with two d-pads (preferably Saturn ones) would be kind of cool. Sort of the ultimate in old school.

On a side note, I played this for a good hour or so last night and my hand / finger was killing me from jamming down the right trigger. Good fun though sans the hurtin'. Game is still whooping my ass. Can't clear stage three.