Micomsoft SC-500N1 RGB Capture Card

[BuckoA51]

The aspect ratio looks correct to me? I think it looks pretty good for Youtube, certainly better than what I've managed so far.

[SunJammer]

Personally I don't think that capture is that great. What's with the aspect ratio as well?

The capture I did using the MS app is much cleaner IMO and you don't have any aspect ratio issues. In my experience the MS app also gives the least amount of lag.

yeah isn't that great really, youtube compresses the hell out of my masterpieces
(I'll try and upload a 60fps un/not-so-shittily-compressed version later tonight)

as far as the aspect ratio, all I've done is double the vertical resolution and then increase the black space around the image to 720x480 so youtube won't screw with the resolution during upload. Every attempt i've made at forcibly changing the aspect ratio to 4:3 has been... less than fruitful.

and as far as the micomsoft capture tool, the only problem i've had is that the built-in codec is inherently lossy, and to my knowledge it can't be switched out.

[fagin]

Apologies on the aspect ratio.... must be my old age eyes playing me up.

[BuckoA51]

If we could figure out why Amarec messes up the aspect ratio it'd be lots better, I've messed around in PowerDirector with various clips for an hour or so tonight and its gashed the aspect ratio up each time.

[Fudoh]

Haven't tried this myself yet, but seems quite obvious: if you the software records in 720x240 than of course the pixel ratio is completely off. You can apply linedoubling in the postprocessing and up it to 720x480p (which is still no square pixel ratio)... Some players ignore the actual pixel ratio, while others ignore any flags and only go by the pixel ratio. 720x480p is treated as 4:3 in most players, but will show up wider than 4:3 on Youtube.

If you put a 720x240 into a file container which supports custom ratios (e.g. MKV) and enter a 4:3 ratio, then it will properly show up in nearly every player. No idea about Youtube though. If you want the original TV ratio in Youtube you have to convert the 720x240 recording to 640x480.

[fagin]

Haven't tried this myself yet, but seems quite obvious: if you the software records in 720x240 than of course the pixel ratio is completely off. You can apply linedoubling in the postprocessing and up it to 720x480p (which is still no square pixel ratio)... Some players ignore the actual pixel ratio, while others ignore any flags and only go by the pixel ratio. 720x480p is treated as 4:3 in most players, but will show up wider than 4:3 on Youtube.

If you put a 720x240 into a file container which supports custom ratios (e.g. MKV) and enter a 4:3 ratio, then it will properly show up in nearly every player. No idea about Youtube though. If you want the original TV ratio in Youtube you have to convert the 720x240 recording to 640x480.

Unfortunately Fudoh we haven't all got an extended frontal lobe like you! But I must admit (for whatever reason) I never even assumed the software was actually recording at 240p. I just assumed it was linedoubling (especially as the live monitor is 100% fine) anyway..... but then that's probably why there is a specific "line doubling" option in AMAREC. However, mine was set to AUTO... so again I assumed it was doing what it needed to do. I'll try forcing it to linedoubling and will see what it does.

The bummer in some way is that the Micomsoft capture application "just works" without any need to do anything. My lack of understanding hasn't helped either. lol

[BuckoA51]

Some players ignore the actual pixel ratio, while others ignore any flags and only go by the pixel ratio.

That explains a lot, looks like we could use a best practices for Youtube tutorial from one of you more knowledgeable people that could then go on the Wiki, perhaps.

[SunJammer]

so if you start with 240x720 video from the capture tool and want to force it to 640x480, i gather the best method would be to:
-remove 80 pixels total from the horizontal overscan area
-double the vertical resolution to 480, but leave the vertical overscan as-is (typically 8 pixels on top and bottom)

I've also noticed that if you have 4:3 aspect enabled in Amarec (shortcut key: 3) it can mess with the pixel aspect to a serious degree, especially depending on whether or not you have any cropping applied to the picture. i usually keep the aspect turned off (shortcut key: 1) but to each their own

and again, i personally recommend keeping "filter processing" turned off in the recording pane, which will keep amarec from effing with your precious image. like so:

[Fudoh]

so if you start with 240x720 video from the capture tool and want to force it to 640x480, i gather the best method would be to: -remove 80 pixels total from the horizontal overscan area

if you do it this way, you can leave it at full 720 right from the start, since you won't change the AR by doing this.

[fagin]

Right..... you know when you have it bashed into your brain that any form of processing should be switched off to reduce lag.

Turn "Filter Processing" on under the RECORDING tab and ensure you have "Scan Line Doubler" set to AUTO on the PREVIEW tab - it then records in proper format. I haven't done any lag tests, but I can't help but think this would have a detrimental effect on processing lag surely.

Anyway.... that's the AMAREC recording ratio sorted.

[Fudoh]

got the Startech card today. Will order a PC mainboard, CPU and case this week.

[fagin]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rqbbbncN2eY

It's only a short video so crank the res up to 1080p quality. Apart from the YT framerate issue, I'm happy with the quality of that.

Micomsoft Driver
AmarecTV
Startech card

[SunJammer]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rqbbbncN2eY

It's only a short video so crank the res up to 1080p quality. Apart from the YT framerate issue, I'm happy with the quality of that.

Micomsoft Driver
AmarecTV
Startech card

lookin good! what SNES revision are you using there? (another thread about SNES board revs inc)

oh and if you'd like to remove that watermark you'll need to switch codecs

[BuckoA51]

That's certainly good Youtube quality. I suppose when it comes down to it there isn't an awful lot of point capturing non-linedoubled 240p content unless you were going to play it back on a 240p capable device. Perhaps file sizes would be a little smaller but I doubt it would make any significant difference. Think this is how I'll capture from now on too.

Do you need Filter processing on if you linedouble btw? We've got Sunjammer there saying turn it off while Fagin says turn it on?

[fagin]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rqbbbncN2eY

It's only a short video so crank the res up to 1080p quality. Apart from the YT framerate issue, I'm happy with the quality of that.

Micomsoft Driver
AmarecTV
Startech card

lookin good! what SNES revision are you using there? (another thread about SNES board revs inc)

oh and if you'd like to remove that watermark you'll need to switch codecs

Original JDM launch model, so has a very very slight ghost to the image.

[fagin]

That's certainly good Youtube quality. I suppose when it comes down to it there isn't an awful lot of point capturing non-linedoubled 240p content unless you were going to play it back on a 240p capable device. Perhaps file sizes would be a little smaller but I doubt it would make any significant difference. Think this is how I'll capture from now on too.

Do you need Filter processing on if you linedouble btw? We've got Sunjammer there saying turn it off while Fagin says turn it on?

That's the only way you'll invoke linedoubling in the recorded footage, by enabling the processing. No processing, no linedoubling. That's where I was going wrong with the ratio.

I'm not sure what Sunjammer is referring to about, not keeping the processing enabled. The quality looks good enough to me. The RAW capture footage is pretty much mint if you ask me (obviously better than the re-encoded and then YT'd video).

[SunJammer]

TDo you need Filter processing on if you linedouble btw? We've got Sunjammer there saying turn it off while Fagin says turn it on?

if you leave it off you'll need to fix it in post, but since I run my captures through VirtualDub anyway it's not a problem. also leaving it off will cut the file size considerably while recording.

[fagin]

TDo you need Filter processing on if you linedouble btw? We've got Sunjammer there saying turn it off while Fagin says turn it on?

also leaving it off will cut the file size considerably while recording.

Who cares about capture filesize.... don't we all re-encode before YT submission anyhow - I know I do?

[SunJammer]

file size is an issue if you capture using a lossless codec, especially looking down the road to longer captures, 1CCs and the like

[dieKatze88]

TDo you need Filter processing on if you linedouble btw? We've got Sunjammer there saying turn it off while Fagin says turn it on?

also leaving it off will cut the file size considerably while recording.

Who cares about capture filesize.... don't we all re-encode before YT submission anyhow - I know I do?

Well capture filesize is a huge thing if you're doing 720p. If you have a single, quality SATA II disk, you can capture 720p with a good lossless codec. I suppose that if you aren't doing this professionally (Like we all aren't) you probably don't have a ton of good quality gear laying around to do this on, and capture size matters more to you.

Why is this video of a 240p SNES game a 1080p video?


Yeah I have a 160gb video of an Otomedius X run I did recently. 51 minutes. Capture size can be an issue.

[blizzz]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rqbbbncN2eY
It's only a short video so crank the res up to 1080p quality. Apart from the YT framerate issue, I'm happy with the quality of that

Looks great, a lot better than my two SNES consoles. I'll do some tests with my new 1CHIP when I finally get it (it's stuck at customs since saturday, guess the people there also value good retro games).

My capture chain so far is: Amarec 720x240, VirtualDub postprocessing and linedoubling and then encoding with x264 (via Handbrake).
Capture size is a factor to consider when using Lagarith, but not really for SD material. Even a 2TB drive can hold tons of that, especially because older games are usually only a few hours long at most. With 720p it's a different story, that will even fill up a 12TB raid eventually.

[fagin]

Like I said.... I always re-encode after capture and I didn't think anyone didn't have at least 8 terrabytes free on their working drives. lol I stand corrected on your examples guys... I never capture for that length of time so never think about size too much.

It's 1080p as that was my default re-encoding option I chose.

Yeah my SNES is fine imo.

[dieKatze88]

Like I said.... I always re-encode after capture and I didn't think anyone didn't have at least 8 terrabytes free on their working drives. lol I stand corrected on your examples guys... I never capture for that length of time so never think about size too much.

It's 1080p as that was my default re-encoding option I chose.

Yeah my SNES is fine imo.

I re-encode too. Said 160gb video file compressed quite nicely to an overbitrate H.264 AVC file, 6gb in the end. Good stuff. Just, I only have 500gb to capture to.

Ahh that explains that.

I have a US SNES so I only capture with Svideo. The quality is passable, but I really only ever play games nobody wants to watch so I don't record much.

[BuckoA51]

What's the process for resizing/linedoubling a 240p capture in Virtualdub then?

[SunJammer]

What's the process for resizing/linedoubling a 240p capture in Virtualdub then?

i use the resize filter, disable the aspect ratio and increase the vertical size to 200%

[GregI]

Captured my first speedrun with this card. 480p from the Wii. Looking fantastic. Almost emulator quality.

http://i.imgur.com/fWDr6.png

I can play reasonably comfortably from the monitor screen. Have to agree on 1 or 2 frames of lag.

I experimented with both Lagarith and Huffyuv. Although Lagarith gave slightly better compression rates, it had my CPU at around 23%. Huffyuv was only slightly worse on compression but had my CPU at 9% constantly, so using Huffyuv. Pretty good.

[dieKatze88]

Captured my first speedrun with this card. 480p from the Wii. Looking fantastic. Almost emulator quality.

http://i.imgur.com/fWDr6.png

I can play reasonably comfortably from the monitor screen. Have to agree on 1 or 2 frames of lag.

I experimented with both Lagarith and Huffyuv. Although Lagarith gave slightly better compression rates, it had my CPU at around 23%. Huffyuv was only slightly worse on compression but had my CPU at 9% constantly, so using Huffyuv. Pretty good.

What CPU Have you? How much ram?

[blizzz]

I re-encode too. Said 160gb video file compressed quite nicely to an overbitrate H.264 AVC file, 6gb in the end. Good stuff. Just, I only have 500gb to capture to.

Why not encode directly to H264 (x264vfw) then? The difference in the end product is so small anyway. I'm quite sure that I couldn't tell the difference between something that was recorded as Lagarith or x264 with high bitrate in a normal release mp4/mkv.

[GregI]

i5 2500k at stock speeds for now. 8GB RAM.

[dieKatze88]

i5 2500k at stock speeds for now. 8GB RAM.

That's odd. the difference wasn't that drastic for my i7 2600k with 16gb.