Footage of Raiden II/Raiden DX different variants/revisions

[Furry Fox Jet Pilot]

So I know there were many different variants and revisions of Raiden II/DX, including the "New" versions with inferior sound hardware and changed stage layouts and orders. Does anyone have any footage of gameplay from any of these changed versions, or at least know where I can find videos of gameplay? I've been curious to see just how all the changes were implemented.

[Sinful]

Me too. Why I still patiently wait for this game to be emulated in MAME so I can fill that OCD behaviour of mine that includes comparing the same game via many ports & revisions. ... And doubt you'll find one magical video with everything you need in it until they work in MAME, is the sad truth. You're gonna have to dig through many individual vids for hopefully some answers? Then let us know too.

And wow, you must really be in a Raiden mood to be asking all these Raiden related questions? That's pretty cool. Always love it when I'm really into a single game, especially if it's part of a series & dev company (then the fun never ends).

[Furry Fox Jet Pilot]

Me too. Why I still patiently wait for this game to be emulated in MAME so I can fill that OCD behaviour of mine that includes comparing the same game via many ports & revisions. ... And doubt you'll find one magical video with everything you need in it until they work in MAME, is the sad truth. You're gonna have to dig through many individual vids for hopefully some answers? Then let us know too.

And wow, you must really be in a Raiden mood to be asking all these Raiden related questions? That's pretty cool. Always love it when I'm really into a single game, especially if it's part of a series & dev company (then the fun never ends).

When am I not in a Raiden mood? It's my favorite shmup series! Regarding the search for footage of these mysterious versions, I have always been looking for videos, but with no luck. Out of all the people in the world who own these different variants of the PCBs, not one of them have recorded any gameplay from them? I find that very hard to believe indeed. Perhaps anyone who is familiar with searching on NicoVideo could help me find some footage on there perhaps. In the meantime, this is all I've found: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mIdm5-Kj ... re=related

[Ghegs]

Out of all the people in the world who own these different variants of the PCBs, not one of them have recorded any gameplay from them? I find that very hard to believe indeed.

The Raiden PCBs run at a weird Hz which can make capturing direct footage from them problematic. Of course this can fixed with proper hardware, but it does limit the amount of people who can record footage from them, to those who not only have the PCB, but also have the right capturing setup.

Or then you could end up with videos like the one you linked, shot with an external camera and they don't even tweak the settings so that there's no rolling flicker from monitors.

[Crafty+Mech]

I have a Raiden II & Raiden DX board, but no way to record. If there is some particular information you'd like to know about game play, I could provide that for the versions I have.

Are you looking for info like do all DX boards provide auto fire on the 3rd button, or more granular like when enemies appear, how many, power up frequency, etc.. ?

[Furry Fox Jet Pilot]

I have a Raiden II & Raiden DX board, but no way to record. If there is some particular information you'd like to know about game play, I could provide that for the versions I have.

Are you looking for info like do all DX boards provide auto fire on the 3rd button, or more granular like when enemies appear, how many, power up frequency, etc.. ?

Which versions do you have? The original or the "New" 1996 versions? Also, I've heard that there are also countless other variants of Raiden II floating around out there, such as an "easier version", as well as the version in the video that I linked to, which according to saucykobold, was released BEFORE the original 1993 "common" version, and does not have any micluses. I was curious to know how the stage layouts are different, where and what kind of enemies appear, different enemies, bullet patterns, etc., because I've played a 1993 version of Raiden II that was unsually generous by giving me a lot of bomb items. It also had different enemy placements, and in Stage 3, the offshore gun platforms had a different setup and had different gun types than the common version, yet there were micluses when I played. I'm also curious to know as to how the "New" Raiden DX has the stage and enemy layout changed.

[Crafty+Mech]

For Raiden DX, the silkscreen on the edge of my board says "(C) 1993 Raiden II DX Seibu Kaihatsu"

"Licensed by Fabtek" appears on the title screen, so I'm assuming it is the US version.

My Raiden II is also the 1993 board, and the title screen just says "Seibu Kaihatsu". It is not the Japanese version, and not a Fabtek licensed board, so I assume it is just the "International" release.

I purposely avoided the "new" versions because of the reported sound issues, but someone here on Shmups is bound to have a board and can hopefully chime in.

[Sinful]

There are that many differences between them?!!!! Oh man, oh man, how much longer till they're emulated? But in the meantime I'd like to hear of these differences in detail. So whatever anyone knows, please write about it. Thank you in advance.

[cools]

Mine is a Great Britain version.

[BPzeBanshee]

I've personally seen an Australia version, being in Australia and all, but it's been a while since I saw it last.

[IseeThings]

the region code is typically a byte, so I wouldn't read too much into if you have a GB, Australia or Japan version (although I guess the game balance might alter depending on the region)

it's the actual game code revisions that are potentially interesting, although there are multiple Raiden (1) revisions and multiple Raiden Fighters series revisions and I'm not sure anybody has pulled those apart extensively, so I have my doubts anybody will for Raiden 2 even if it was emulated tomorrow!

It's possible some of the revisions are just minor bugfixes, and a fair number of the differences people have reported simply come from the difficult dips, although yes, there is at least an 'easy' version, it's the one that displays a different background on the high score table compared to the rest..

[Sinful]

it's the actual game code revisions that are potentially interesting, although there are multiple Raiden (1) revisions and multiple Raiden Fighters series revisions and I'm not sure anybody has pulled those apart extensively, so I have my doubts anybody will for Raiden 2 even if it was emulated tomorrow!

On to Raiden 1 then!

[Ed Oscuro]

Or then you could end up with videos like the one you linked, shot with an external camera and they don't even tweak the settings so that there's no rolling flicker from monitors.

I like how you make this sound easy.

[Crafty+Mech]

The "Gallentry" theme has been stuck in my head since last night when I fired up my DX board to check the version.

[Furry Fox Jet Pilot]

It's possible some of the revisions are just minor bugfixes, and a fair number of the differences people have reported simply come from the difficult dips, although yes, there is at least an 'easy' version, it's the one that displays a different background on the high score table compared to the rest..

On the version I played, the high score tables showed the Raiden Mk-II fighter with a black background, instead of the usual background of the fighter ascending over the mountains, so it might have been the easy version you are referring to.

The "Gallentry" theme has been stuck in my head since last night when I fired up my DX board to check the version.

I think you just triggered a relapse of my drug addiction (my drug being Raiden and its music) The first time I ever played Raiden DX when I was a kid, I could not get that song out of my head when I fell asleep that night. Nothing beats listening to that music on the original, good quality arcade sound hardware. The PSX port's music is much lower quality, I immediately noticed a HUGE difference in the sound; the guitars in the music sound way too soft, the drums sound weak, and a lot of the explosion sound effects are missing that aggressive, deep, crunchy bass from the arcade PCB version. I swear that no one else on this forum is as addicted to Raiden's music (Raiden DX's Gallantry in particular) as I am.

[Crafty+Mech]

I don't think I'm as addicted to the soundtrack as you are But the first time I played Raiden I in the arcade it blew me away. The visuals were so rich and over the top compared to other Shmups that I was used to playing (1943 being my favorite in the 80s). And the big blue laser, I remember thinking that was the biggest shot type I had ever seen!

Love the auto fire feature on DX, was it included on all releases?

[Ghegs]

Or then you could end up with videos like the one you linked, shot with an external camera and they don't even tweak the settings so that there's no rolling flicker from monitors.

I like how you make this sound easy.

It is pretty easy.

[Furry Fox Jet Pilot]

I don't think I'm as addicted to the soundtrack as you are But the first time I played Raiden I in the arcade it blew me away. The visuals were so rich and over the top compared to other Shmups that I was used to playing (1943 being my favorite in the 80s). And the big blue laser, I remember thinking that was the biggest shot type I had ever seen!

Love the auto fire feature on DX, was it included on all releases?

The visuals certainly were excellent for their time, and I feel that Raiden DX perfected the amount of detail shown in the destruction; debris flying everywhere, burning craters in roads, buildings, and all over the ground, and especially releasing a payload of cluster bombs over the forest to watch the poor trees burn As for the autofire, I'm not too sure which versions had it included, because I have played an original 1994 version that had it, while another 1994 version that I played only had the single-fire and bomb buttons.

[Ed Oscuro]

Or then you could end up with videos like the one you linked, shot with an external camera and they don't even tweak the settings so that there's no rolling flicker from monitors.

I like how you make this sound easy.

It is pretty easy.

We're talking about Raiden II / DX here.

Even when you use good methodology, you don't get perfect results (with almost all equipment). Genlocking is out of the question for obvious reasons. Despite the article's title, the best they can promise is slowing down the rolling shutter effect when the source frame rate doesn't match the capture frame rate.

"Set the DSLR's shutter speed," they say. OK. (Shutter speed on DSLR video is more akin to shutter angle in classic film cine cameras, so this really should be "set the frame rate.") How many DSLRs or home video cameras can you name which support a 54Hz capture resolution? I'm betting none. The only interest most camera makers and cine users have for variable framerates is in slow- and fast-motion effects, but implementation is rare (and doesn't immediately get us what we want anyway). You can reportedly get a variable framerate on a Canon 7D with Magic Lantern (which I might have to try out sometime). Some Lumix cameras might support this, but then again I think all their fast/slow motion frame rates are at set speeds only. Even on pro equipment, there's not universal support for variable frame rates. Canon's EOS-1D C doesn't support it, but their EOS C300 and C500 series do, except it "records at a different frame rate then the playback rate." You'd have to correct that framerate in software after - hopefully easy enough; I've no idea. I've also got no idea how well 54Hz playback would be on most computer devices, but recall that even the XRGB-3 has to use a framerate adaption method to support 54Hz. At the very least, we're looking at a post-production step just to correct the framerate.

All the same, I intend to give this a shot, once I find my Raiden II board, just to see how good I can get things.

Shooting stills of CRTs is, itself, a bit of a fine art (unless you get lucky with a point and shoot on fully automatic settings, as 99% of people taking photos of CRTs in this hobby seem to do), but thankfully you have the benefit of more shutter speeds.

[Ghegs]

My fairly cheap Sony HDR-CX190 had settings that got rid of the rolling flicker completely, leaving only a small light flicker, which I found acceptable enough. I can record footage off a non-60Hz game easily with that, though since I don't have a Raiden board, I can't be sure if it would work with 54Hz equally well.

[Ed Oscuro]

Ahh, the famous automatic settings lottery. That's totally up to chance and whether it works or not is basically beyond your control. Doubtful it works with 54Hz although you didn't specify what non-60Hz framerates you were capturing so I can't speculate. The camera seems to record only 60Hz video though.

[rtw]

It's possible some of the revisions are just minor bugfixes, and a fair number of the differences people have reported simply come from the difficult dips, although yes, there is at least an 'easy' version, it's the one that displays a different background on the high score table compared to the rest..

The different versions of Raiden 2 may be identified by the high score screen. The easy version has the Raiden MK-II in colour on a black background whereas the hard version has a sepia shot
of an ascending fighter.

On a sidenote the NEW versions or Raiden II and Raiden DX are exactly that: new. The stages differ.

Does anyone know if the different regions of Raiden 2 and DX influence the game balance ?

And on the subject of SEIBU, does anyone know if the different regions of Viper Phase 1, Raiden Fighters, Raiden Fighters 2 and Raiden Fighters Jet influence the game balance ?

[Furry Fox Jet Pilot]

On a sidenote the NEW versions or Raiden II and Raiden DX are exactly that: new. The stages differ.

Does anyone know if the different regions of Raiden 2 and DX influence the game balance ?

And on the subject of SEIBU, does anyone know if the different regions of Viper Phase 1, Raiden Fighters, Raiden Fighters 2 and Raiden Fighters Jet influence the game balance ?

That's what I want to know; exactly how the New Raiden II/DX stages differ from the original. Also, I've heard that the Japan region of RF Jet has more scoring secrets than other regions, but I can't confirm that.

[BPzeBanshee]

I'm pretty sure it does for US to Japan for at least JET, I noticed quite a difference playing Japan version from the US and Tuning License edition when I was seriously playing last. Micluses take longer to appear as well, but not sure about other "general" scoring secrets.

RF2 I think was the case as well, not sure about others. Raiden Fighters Aces uses the Japan sets apparently, even in the US release (so they brought the translated text over).

[trap15]

Pretty sure the only difference in RF2 at least is that the US version loops. I doubt RFJ is significantly different either.

[rtw]

There are multiple sets of RF, RF2 and RFJ, for sake of argument I have picked RF SPI Cart version.

On later production series SEIBU locked down the code in MASK ROMs leaving only ROM 1 as an EPROM so they could change the region byte.

Code: Select all

The following versions differ only by the region byte 

rdftam,     "Seibu Kaihatsu (Metrotainment license)", "Raiden Fighters (Hong Kong)"   ***
rdftadi,    "Seibu Kaihatsu (Dream Island license)",  "Raiden Fighters (Korea)"       ***
rdftit,     "Seibu Kaihatsu",                         "Raiden Fighters (Italy)"       ***
rdfta,      "Seibu Kaihatsu",                         "Raiden Fighters (Austria)"     ***

I am trying to determine if it's the region byte which changes the game balance/behaviour or the actual code base. The code base is wildly different between: rdft, rdftj, rdftu, and rdftau. By wildly different I mean that none of these sets share the same program code (EPROM 1 - 4)

Could someone proficient in RF please try to compare rdfta and rdtftam and post the results here ?