schmup repos....what are your thoughts on reproductions ????

[carlal8989]

What are your thoughts on shmup reproductions....

I'm usually against bootlegs, since i like having the original packaging on my shelf and i like playing games on the original system and original controllers.
However I can't in good conscious spend 200 on one megadrive game, so I think I came to a compromise (in my mind anyways).... I of course can just download the roms, but it's not the same.... so I found out about people are now doing reproductions, basically reprogramming old cartridges with roms/hacks and putting them on original SNES or genesis games. So this feels a little more tangible then just selecting download and playing it off a list on my wii. Then (especially with genesis games) you can print out copies of the covers, and put them in original genesis cases, and you have something (packaging wise) that looks identical to the original release, so you have something nice to display on the shelf.

It sounds like like a sales pitch for these things, but I was just kinda excited about this new aspect of being able to collect some rare SNES / genesis games.... yes, I would rather have the original games and yes it bothers me they are bootlegs.... but that's overcome quickly knowing if I had the original and had paid 200 for it would make me feel very guilty. Since they are bootlegs, they get segregated into their own little section at the end of my genesis collection, but they do look pretty on my shelf. Yes, i realize the packaging is not the identical of the japanese release, but I decided to go the custom cover route cause i will always not they're not real anyways

I found these reproductions on ebay and after the cost of getting cheap cases and printing out covers they cost me 20.00 each with packaging total.... it was kinda fun to print out the covers, put the packaging together like some sort of art project for school

pictures....

http://s1174.photobucket.com/user/srviv ... sort=3&o=4
http://s1174.photobucket.com/user/srviv ... sort=3&o=5
http://s1174.photobucket.com/user/srviv ... sort=3&o=6
http://s1174.photobucket.com/user/srviv ... sort=3&o=1
http://s1174.photobucket.com/user/srviv ... sort=3&o=3

[trap15]

Ugh.

[Nana]

Sometimes, when you save up for ages to buy something you really want, instead of making you feel guilty, it actually makes you value and treasure what you got. You know, when you actually had to work for it.

[Captain]

This is....ok at best.

both the collection and your opinion.

[Xyga]

No.

[broken harbour]

I honestly have no problem with this.

So long as it's a game that was never released, like Star Fox 2. Or a new game for and old system, like Pier Solar, or something.

[trap15]

From what I'm understanding, it's basically the opposite. Just bootlegging.

[Nana]

Okay yeah -- that's different. I totally approve of "repros" of games that were never released, or say unofficial translation hacked versions of games that were never localized/released stateside. But at that point, they're hardly reproductions, since it's original content being pressed on there. But if it's designed to be as close to possible as the original -- if the original already exists -- then I don't think it's too cool.

So, for example: bootleg Alien Soldier? Absolutely not. But I would love to own a version of Wonder Project J2 with english text inserted so I could play it on my N64. (unfortunately, this does not exist, since bootleg n64 carts don't seem to in general.)

[Captain]

What about romhacking? Related?
And making discs/cartriges/pcbs/whatever from romhacks?

[Pteriforever]

I don't get the big issue, personally.

As long as you can play the game at the end of the day, who cares how expensive its packaging is?

[trap15]

It's not about packaging, it's about bootlegs. Bootlegs are the problem. ROM hacks and translations are not a problem, they serve a legitimate purpose and solve a problem that's not "I DON'T HAVE ENOUGH MONEY".

[chempop]

Bootlegs are only a problem when they are being sold unethically as originals. There is a big difference between a repro advertised for what is is rather than as some rare collectible. I think $20 for a repro is fair, but I don't think I'd pay any more. I do own 1, Gleylancer. I don't think I'll be buying any more (maybe, we'll see).

I agree with you that it's nicer than using a flash rom cart, something tangible that you can put on your shelf helps to remember it exists.

People crying BOOTLEGS ARE THE PROBLEM, I ask "what problem?" Companies that developed the games are making or loosing anything, it doesn't seem to have an effect on the price and collectability of the genuine copies, so I don't really see what the "problem" even is.

[drauch]

I'm mainly just upset about all those Madden cases and carts that are being destroyed to make these poor imitations.

[Bloodreign]

I've only done the repro thing for one game, Mega Man Wily Wars. It cost me a mint to do, but for far less than the original costs, plus it has a better save format from what I've heard over the real carts.

Other than that everything else I own is the real genuine article.

Edit: looking at the carts, my repro looks nothing like these, mine look like it was an official release and at least tries to imitate a real Genesis cart (it has fooled a couple friends of mine). These imitate bootlegs or are bootlegs.

[gray117]

Similar to playing on emulation...

Using as a backup, sure, fine... might be some grey areas on certain systems, i.e. copy protection etc., but you're unlikely to invoke ire.

Ethically having it in your collection - like a fan remix version - there's good and bad in that. Hopefully you either own at least a port, or made some form of similar attempt in rewarding the creators/copyright owners.

Making a business out of it - basically bootlegging :/

Edit: looking at the carts, my repro looks nothing like these, mine look like it was an official release and at least tries to imitate a real Genesis cart (it has fooled a couple friends of mine). These imitate bootlegs or are bootlegs.

^ Isn't that worse in your case? Your's is attempting to pass itself off as an original whereas the others do at least declare their modified nature? [Not necessarily criticizing you for picking it up, but suggesting that as a product it appears less ethical to present itself as a legitimate version in such situations.]

[cools]

I'm mainly just upset about all those Madden cases and carts that are being destroyed to make these poor imitations.

A shrewd person would be buying up stock of these. Future rares.

[drauch]

I'm mainly just upset about all those Madden cases and carts that are being destroyed to make these poor imitations.

A shrewd person would be buying up stock of these. Future rares.

The future is now. I'm paying $50 a pop, cart only. Keeping the legend alive.

[Kollision]

don't take it as an insult but, as a collector, if I ever come across one of these I'll feed it to my 5-year old nephew for playground destruction fun

[BIL]

I don't care about them as long as they're clearly marked. The day I buy an unmarked boot someone's getting their fuck caved in.

[Friendly]

Reproduction is a euphemism for bootleg. Making money off intellectual property for which you don't have the rights is a criminal offense.

Instead of paying some pirate for these, you should get a flash cartridge for the retro console of your choice.

[Astraea FGA Mk. I]

It is either legitimate or illegitimate. There is no middle ground.

I either want an authentic copy of a game with its original contents (the vastly superior option), or I will emulate it and/or I will play it as backup on a modded console.

[chempop]

Reproduction is a euphemism for bootleg.

It is either legitimate or illegitimate.

True, I guess what I meant was that from a consumer standpoint, you can either be duped into buying a bootleg at full value of an original (not the case here), or buy a boot that is being advertised as such for a very fair price point. By having these megadrive exclusives done up with the US genesis art, that's enough warning that they aren't original (unless the buyer hasn't done their homework).

In the end I probably do wish they didn't exists at all, but it could be a lot worse (see AF3/N-G/TonK)

[drauch]

I don't care about them as long as they're clearly marked. The day I buy an unmarked boot someone's getting their fuck caved in.

True dat. Obvious Mega Drive games in Genesis cases aren't hurting anything except people's wallets that like paying for emulation.

[Ed Oscuro]

There is a good argument that "the socially useful level of piracy is not zero" although it needs be said that it comes at the cost of something somebody would like.

When it's publishers repeatedly re-issuing ancient games on an online service, like a dealer selling hits of air, there are of course many great reasons why you and I probably shouldn't be fussed that we do whatever with an ancient property.

It's harder to know how to parse out something like this because it now it hitting our own self-interest, making a careful analysis harder.

Of course the one obvious disanalogy is between the types of markets: Digital reissues should not be held to the same standard as fake items in the original channel, you would think, although the reason here is the perceived value of an item to different partners. Publishers sold out their original stocks of classic games long ago - and given highly inflated modern prices for sealed old games, you'd think that they might have wished to have a few left in stock still. For them, the return must come very soon, for the game in that particular format. Today, somebody who still has that particular game has the recognized right of having the right to any non-copyright value in that game (the idea is enshrined in the first sale doctrine).

Exactly how to resolve this without being hypocritical escapes me. Good of piracy against digital reissues: Pressure for publishers to step up their game. Good of piracy against physical goods: Pressure on collecting communities to police their own markets and also a good of being able to play on original hardware, also potential pressure on publishers to license official reissues.

It is either legitimate or illegitimate. There is no middle ground.

I either want an authentic copy of a game with its original contents (the vastly superior option), or I will emulate it and/or I will play it as backup on a modded console.

There is also a glaring inconsistency within this post...such things do not coexist well with "there is no middle ground" type views.