Make Your Next-Gen Predictions!

[replayme]

I think your love for your 3DS is clouding your judgement.

I don't have any love for my 3DS unless it produces good games. There's not much on the horizon bar LTTP2, that's why I bought a Vita.

As a console hardware manufacturer, Nintendo haven't been relevant for about 10 years. The Wii paid off, yes, but that still doesn't change the fact that it was a fluke. The Wii U is making people realise that.

This coming generation is finally making people realise, and sales testify to this, that Nintendo are outclassed and outmatched when it comes to hardware.

These statements feel based on what you would prefer to be the truth, rather than what is the truth. Nintendo's policy is to be outmatched on hardware and deliver on games - they're one of (if not the) only company who chooses to sell hardware for profit. If that format made the Wii a fluke, that would also go for every console preceding it. Whether or not, now the gimmick has faded, it's a strategy that will continue to work is for the future to decide.

Edit: and correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't you dismiss the Vita interface as being too "kiddie", when you're now using the very same argument to justify your reasoning?

No, I dismissed the interface as terribly ugly and lesser than the company's former XMB.

The sales (and third party support) of the Wii U testify to the fact that "under the TV" console hardware is not Nintendo's strength, and this achilles heel actually hampers their AAA First Party software division (both in profitability and software sales penetration).

The Wii U doesn't single-handedly signify a track record. I don't know what the point is in so regularly referring to it.

Every console that Nintendo has had post Snes has been a relative failure (barring Wii - and even that didn't have the desired long tail lifespan despite its 100 million sales success). Couple this with dire third party support, as evidenced by their failure to help support the likes of Konami etc, and you can see as to how the company's policies make it look like the modern day Atari that is hell-bent on driving industry down the sink-hole.

This is something that Nintendo fanbots refuse to acknowledge, and their lack of market awareness contributes towards their delusion.

You think Nintendo deliver on games, but barring the upcoming Mario title, the Wii U has had to wait one solid year for this "policy" to take effect. And even then, where is the third party support, as this track record of poor third party support shows that the industry hasn't needed Nintendo hardware for a very long time (10 years).

[Drum]

I really don't know. I think the Wii U is not going to turn around, but Nintendo will do what it takes to raise it a bit over Gamecube levels. I think the PS4 is going to drop off quite a bit after the launch - software just isn't there. It's also not going to steamroll the Xbone like a lot of people seem to think (hope) it will. XBO and PS4 aren't going to see the numbers their predecessors did,that's for sure. Wii U is it's own special failure so I don't think you can point to it to show the beginning of a trend, but there's something there. Tablets and phones are drawing interest away from consoles in the west the way they did in Japan. People who think that only affected the 3DS/Vita are fooling themselves. The long tail of this gen and the lack of a really obvious jump will negatively affect the new gen not just in the short term.

I hope for the sake of the industry, Nintendo don't turn the Wii U around. That console is a disease that needs to be wiped out.

I don't hope anything for the sake of the industry. The industry can go eat a dick.

[replayme]

I really don't know. I think the Wii U is not going to turn around, but Nintendo will do what it takes to raise it a bit over Gamecube levels. I think the PS4 is going to drop off quite a bit after the launch - software just isn't there. It's also not going to steamroll the Xbone like a lot of people seem to think (hope) it will. XBO and PS4 aren't going to see the numbers their predecessors did,that's for sure. Wii U is it's own special failure so I don't think you can point to it to show the beginning of a trend, but there's something there. Tablets and phones are drawing interest away from consoles in the west the way they did in Japan. People who think that only affected the 3DS/Vita are fooling themselves. The long tail of this gen and the lack of a really obvious jump will negatively affect the new gen not just in the short term.

I hope for the sake of the industry, Nintendo don't turn the Wii U around. That console is a disease that needs to be wiped out.

I don't hope anything for the sake of the industry. The industry can go eat a dick.

Every console that Nintendo has had post Snes has been a relative failure (barring Wii - and even that didn't have the desired long tail lifespan despite its 100 million sales success).

Post-snes? Before the Wii U, the snes was Nintendo's biggest relative failure.

Are you on drugs?

[Drum]

Turns out I am, I thought the SNES did around 40 mil. Gamecube was a bigger drop from N64 than SNES was from NES.

[replayme]

Turns out I am, I thought the SNES did around 40 mil. Gamecube was a bigger drop from N64 than SNES was from NES.

You also have to consider the size of what the industry was at the time. 40 million in 1992 was pretty damn successful (although I think the number might have been higher) relative to development costs and the niche size of the market.

It was only with the N64 did Nintendo actually start to begin their downward spiral descent.

[Drum]

No, the SNES was absolutely a relative failure. Sega ate Nintendo's lunch and expanded the market. It just wasn't their biggest relative failure - I overreached .

[replayme]

No, the SNES was absolutely a relative failure. Sega ate Nintendo's lunch and expanded the market. It just wasn't their biggest relative failure - I overreached .

In Europe? Definitely. But in Japan, the Snes ate the Megadrive/Genesis for breakfast.

But if one goes along with what you say, then it's only been the Wii that's been a success, as every other console Nintendo has manufactured (barring Nes) has been a relative (N64) or utter failure (Wii U).

Nintendo still had a history of raking it in with (diminishing over time) third party license fees though. But they can't even rely on this with the Wii U.

[Drum]

k

[Skykid]

Turns out I am, I thought the SNES did around 40 mil. Gamecube was a bigger drop from N64 than SNES was from NES.

You also have to consider the size of what the industry was at the time. 40 million in 1992 was pretty damn successful (although I think the number might have been higher) relative to development costs and the niche size of the market.

It was only with the N64 did Nintendo actually start to begin their downward spiral descent.

In all honesty, you seem to be making up facts to suit your stance. Fiction is nice, but the N64 still vastly outsold the saturn and owns two of the greatest games ever written.

The industry we had then, in pure quality terms, is far superior to the claptrap that lines today's shelves. We're guilty as consumers for supporting it, and as drum nobly pointed out, there's nothing worth arguing about if there's nothing worth saving.

[replayme]

Turns out I am, I thought the SNES did around 40 mil. Gamecube was a bigger drop from N64 than SNES was from NES.

You also have to consider the size of what the industry was at the time. 40 million in 1992 was pretty damn successful (although I think the number might have been higher) relative to development costs and the niche size of the market.

It was only with the N64 did Nintendo actually start to begin their downward spiral descent.

In all honesty, you seem to be making up facts to suit your stance. Fiction is nice, but the N64 still vastly outsold the saturn and owns two of the greatest games ever written.

The industry we had then, in pure quality terms, is far superior to the claptrap that lines today's shelves. We're guilty as consumers for supporting it, and as drum nobly pointed out, there's nothing worth arguing about if there's nothing worth saving.

Retro games in general haven't aged well. Go to GOG etc to find out this.

We have more games now, of higher quality, hence why so many games get a 9-10 rating yet still don't make a profit. Compare this with games of yesteryear, where companies could afford to throw out substandard tat (movie tie ins etc), yet still make a profit, and this trend alone shows how high the bar has gotten.

[Skykid]

You and I are in such vast disagreement it's impossible to maintain a conversation, so I'm out!

[devilmanozzy]

For the heck of it....

I am going to go with the Sony's PS4 will take the lead and will remain the lead throughout the eight years or til the next gens get released. X-Box 1 will do better than the fan circles claimed, but will still be seen as a step back. Ultimately, Microsoft will stay second place but will be closer to PS4's sales as the years go on. The Wii U is not going to last 7 more years and most likely the 9th gen will see Nintendo going back to its roots with a almost retro device that will be closer to the Gamecube than to either of the Wiis.

So Watch out for Nintendo before the end of the 8th gen, but it will be Sony leading with Microsoft not far behind.

[Obiwanshinobi]

It's just really odd, that person who would rather have a basic over a U... then again they're asking for twice as christfucking much for one.

I don't think remote, nunchuck and sensor bar come bundled with Wii U (otherwise there would be little need for handsomely priced remote-nunchuck-sensor bar kits one of which I purchased some time ago).

It's not entirely retarded. I mean, it's pretty awesome if you want to play with your Wii while you're on the toilet. Or wanna play a two-player monster hunter type thing off the same machine. Or anything that would have been a split screen in the old dark ages.

I can think of pretty rad things that can be done with multiple screens (nothing really superior to ye olde LAN, be it wireless on the train, though). I just don't expect it to render split-screen obsolete. At the end of the day one player will get a bigger screen, while the rest get smaller ones - disparity in the old dark ages alleviated somewhat by the picture equality.
It's not like you get extra pixels per square inch and frames per second for free either. Performance-wise it's the same old split-screen.
If anything, bigger screens of today and their high resolutions leave more room for traditional split-screen than we have ever had before.

[MJR]

Retro games in general haven't aged well. Go to GOG etc to find out this.

We have more games now, of higher quality, hence why so many games get a 9-10 rating yet still don't make a profit. Compare this with games of yesteryear, where companies could afford to throw out substandard tat (movie tie ins etc), yet still make a profit, and this trend alone shows how high the bar has gotten.

GOG represents only small fraction of retro gaming, as it mostly concentrates on PC.

Today's games have better production values and are much less frustrating, but they more often just copy each other, more than ever before. In the 80's and 90's we had lots of more crap published, true, but those which were good were much more groundbreaking and original. We haven't had much evolution in ten years.

In general, mainstream game industry is so expensive and inbred, that we will have only couple of AAA titles around in the next 5-10 years as people will inevitable get bored with them. All the innovation ever since has moved onto iOS or indie gaming scene.

[replayme]

I appreciate the manner in which you were able to articulate what I was trying to say. At the time, I only had a few scant moments to really get my point across, so wasn't able to articulate myself as best I could. You have done this for me beautifully.

I would however like to also argue that the leaps in technology have enabled game designers to craft new game experiences - which weren't at all possible on older tech. I may be generalising slightly, as the cookie-cutter approach of having higher production values also yields games which offer similar experiences. That's just the nature of the beast, as you say, as higher (financial) risks equals an inversely proportionate desire to innovate or to stretch (creative) boundaries.

And you're right. The majority of innovation has moved into IOS and indie projects. Nintendo continue this trend also, as the company is increasingly experimenting to see as to what works on its handheld platform, before bringing the tried and tested formula to its "blockbuster" platform.

Finally, and in light of my "unwillingness to accept" Nintendo as they are now, I just read a music interview which I think I can apply to how I feel about the company:

"Leave a penny, take a penny. We lose some people and gain new ones. It really mirrors life. Some people grow and move with you and others are left behind clutching to the past. New faces appear as old ones fade".

Maybe I am clinging to the past, and I haven't been able to grow with Nintendo. Or maybe Nintendo are clinging to the past, and haven't been able to grow with gaming audiences. I guess time will tell. I do however (stubbornly?) cling to my belief that my criticisms are valid, but also understand the context in which they've been applied may irk some people. And just like how people in this day and age still cling on to the old-school shmup genre, maybe there is (enough) room for others to appreciate Nintendo from a perspective which I can no longer (and am unwilling to) appreciate.

Maybe my gaming tastes have moved on from Nintendo, to Microsoft, to (now) Sony - in that these are the companies that have offered products that have (resonated and have) appealed to me at various stages of my life. I'm sure that Nintendo will appeal to me again (like how they are doing with the 3DS at the moment), and I would like to be diplomatic on this occasion and say that in time, the Wii U will offer up plenty of games that will appeal to die-hard Nintendo fans, even if I don't quite understand the extent of their appeal.

Edit: had to edit a few bits in case my argument was misconstrued.

[BulletMagnet]

Anyone who predicted a decoupling of the Kinect from the XB1, take a bow.

[BryanM]

Classic "We can't just flip a switch to turn it off, the console was built around it /flips the switch" microsoft

The next generation will start off with the XBox Alpha needing to give you an anal probe everytime you turn it on.

[broken harbour]

The next generation will start off with the XBox Alpha needing to give you an anal probe everytime you turn it on.

Put's the 'Bone' in Xbone.

[Lord Satori]

Make Your Next-Gen Predictions!

No.

[Specineff]

It will be like the 16-bit wars, except it's between Sony and Microsoft, but not as cool. Nintendo survives on the 3DS, while the Wii U languishes with occasional Zeldas and Marios released until it's put out of its misery.

[BryanM]

It's 2014, we have numbers already. There is no "war", it's a murder.

It'd take ~3 years for XBone to close the gap in hardware sales with the U, and never in software. There's a reason they're de-boning it, and it's not because they love their customers.

But with how toxic everything's been with it, I don't think it'll make much of a difference unless they can severely undercut the PSX4's price point.

[Ed Oscuro]

Anyone who predicted a decoupling of the Kinect from the XB1, take a bow.

For me the question was "are they just gonna sit on this, or is it hurting them enough to care?" I mean, after losing money on the original Xbox and all.

This might help their loss position a bit, but they still gotta make games. I actually don't care much about the performance aspect (both are in the ballpark) but the Xbox case, being OMG HUEG LIEK XBOCKS!!1 may be more reliable over time, especially in revisions with cooler chips. But then again the PS4 can make use of process shrinks in much the same way, although it has reportedly to close a 15-25 degree Fahrenheit temperature delta (positive).

uhh, more posting about stuff I don't really care about, sheesh.

What I wanna know is, when did replayme get the boot? Edit: Now I know. Bah. Not worth it.

[Doctor Butler]

The industry crashes.

The end.

[Ed Oscuro]

Hope springs eternal!

[Xyga]

NEC-Hudson resurrect and build a new pcengine console that lets you play VR-bomberman online (1000 players matches).