Difference between S-video and RGB

[andykara2003]

Hi, sorry for the noob question - I've only ever used RGB scart for my consoles!

What is the real-world difference in quality between s-video and RGB scart? I've heard there's not much difference but others say there's a huge difference. In this case, I'm using an N64.

Cheers

[EmperorZelos]

S-video is composed of 2 signals, Luma and Chroma
RGB is 3 signals, Red green and blue
Colour information requires 3 pieces of information to give the correct colour and as S-video only sends 2 it means 1 of the signals, chroma, contains 2 pieces of information at once multiplexed, multiplexing causes degradation in quality because due to real world inteference, theoreticly multiplexing is a non-issue but we live in reality not theory, so it is hard for the TV to get the 2 pieces of information from chroma otu perfectly, it is impossible, so it leaks out, spreads and stuff.

The differens is noticible

[andykara2003]

S-video is composed of 2 signals, Luma and Chroma
RGB is 3 signals, Red green and blue
Colour information requires 3 pieces of information to give the correct colour and as S-video only sends 2 it means 1 of the signals, chroma, contains 2 pieces of information at once multiplexed, multiplexing causes degradation in quality because due to real world inteference, theoreticly multiplexing is a non-issue but we live in reality not theory, so it is hard for the TV to get the 2 pieces of information from chroma otu perfectly, it is impossible, so it leaks out, spreads and stuff.

The differens is noticible

Cool, cheers.

[ApolloBoy]

RGB is 3 signals, Red green and blue

Actually, RGB requires a fourth signal which is the synchronization signal, without it you have no picture.

[EmperorZelos]

RGB is 3 signals, Red green and blue

Actually, RGB requires a fourth signal which is the synchronization signal, without it you have no picture.

well technicly for a single pixel about colour information sync is not neccisery but for a TV to display the picture iti so f course neccisery, I just went by the colour information alone

[fagin]

I've heard there's not much difference

Who said that..... Mr Magoo?

[RGB]

What is the real-world difference in quality between s-video and RGB scart? I've heard there's not much difference

I disagree

[trap15]

Yeah, there's a significant difference.

[andykara2003]

Great thanks guys - S-video is officially permanently out

[davyK]

You may not have a choice - the N64 doesn't support RGB apart from some early JPN models that can be modded - s-video is most likely your only option.....you may try getting an RGB cable and end up with crappy composite - be careful.

For what it's worth I find s-video on both my PAL and JPN N64s to be pretty good - on both CRT and my LCD. (Sony Bravia 32")

[andykara2003]

You may not have a choice - the N64 doesn't support RGB apart from some early JPN models that can be modded - s-video is most likely your only option.....you may try getting an RGB cable and end up with crappy composite - be careful.

Thanks - although mine's already RGB modded, this was for another project.

[Asbrandt]

It's also worth mentioning that while RGB is cleaner and sharper, there are some cases people may prefer the "quality loss" caused by S-Video.
Either for personal taste reasons, such as with early 3D games on the PS1/N64/Saturn or for technical ones, such as with the dithering-heavy Genesis.

So while I don't know the context of your project, there's a case for making both available, if that's what this was about.

[andykara2003]

It's also worth mentioning that while RGB is cleaner and sharper, there are some cases people may prefer the "quality loss" caused by S-Video.
Either for personal taste reasons, such as with early 3D games on the PS1/N64/Saturn or for technical ones, such as with the dithering-heavy Genesis.

So while I don't know the context of your project, there's a case for making both available, if that's what this was about.

That was exactly what this was about, thankyou!

It's for an N64. I'm looking to mitigate the N64's fuzzy output signal, The sharper image can bring out the picture's flaws.

One other issue is that my 25" Sony's aperture grille screen gives relatively strong scanlines. (I don't like smaller screens)

In my opinion, strong scanlines are great for anything before the N64/PS1 era because of the nature of the 2D graphics. With the 3D graphics of an N64, they don't work in the console's favour.

My next move in my quest for the perfect N64 screen is a 25" Loewe E3000 chassis - which should smooth out the image a bit with it's Shadow mask.

After that, I might try the S-video trick & see if that helps.

[Fudoh]

Just my opinion: On the N64 the RGB signal's much closer to the s-video signal as on any other system. Due to extreme blurriness of so many 3D titles on the N64 I even prefered s-video to RGB back in the 90s on my Sony CRT due to a little extra kick in sharpness. That's the only exception though.

N64 is also the only 240p source which I prefer in 1080p without scanlines on my XRGB, while I used 720p with scanlines for all other 240p sources.

[Daigohji]

I didn't notice much of a difference between S-Video and RGB on my old Panasonic Quintrix CRT, but once I switched to an LCD TV the difference became pretty stark.

[Arasoi]

.

[Ed Oscuro]

RGB is 3 signals, Red green and blue

Actually, RGB requires a fourth signal which is the synchronization signal, without it you have no picture.

well technicly for a single pixel about colour information sync is not neccisery but for a TV to display the picture iti so f course neccisery, I just went by the colour information alone

Are you fuckin' kidding me

wow, this thread blew up though.

@ Arasoi: Why does your RGBS pic look worse than the component one? (I guess it's just bloom which could have multiple causes.)

[EmperorZelos]

Are you fuckin' kidding me

wow, this thread blew up though.

@ Arasoi: Why does your RGBS pic look worse than the component one? (I guess it's just bloom which could have multiple causes.)

about what would I be kidding?

[andykara2003]

Due to extreme blurriness of so many 3D titles on the N64 I even prefered s-video to RGB back in the 90s on my Sony CRT due to a little extra kick in sharpness.

Sorry Fudoh, do I take this to mean that you found the N64 s-video image sharper or blurrier than RGB?

[andykara2003]

Also, I just read somewhere that the image from a US N64 will be darker on a Pal TV than a NTSC TV- is this true? If so, will it apply to s-video?

[fagin]

Due to extreme blurriness of so many 3D titles on the N64 I even prefered s-video to RGB back in the 90s on my Sony CRT due to a little extra kick in sharpness.

Sorry Fudoh, do I take this to mean that you found the N64 s-video image sharper or blurrier than RGB?

In the case of the N64, s-vhs is slightly sharper.

[Fudoh]

indeed. RGB is cleaner (which is better for processing), but s-video's a little sharper on CRTs.

[andykara2003]

indeed. RGB is cleaner (which is better for processing), but s-video's a little sharper on CRTs.

This is news to me, thanks guys. This simplifies things a bit - also no more RGB shift problem!

[andykara2003]

indeed. RGB is cleaner (which is better for processing), but s-video's a little sharper on CRTs.

Just to be clear here - we're talking about RGB modded n64 vs s-video (unmodded) N64 here - not plain old RGB scart from an unmodded console?

[Fudoh]

of course.

[andykara2003]

of course.

Cheers

[andykara2003]

of course.

Sorry to harp on - I have an RGB modded N64 with the THS7317 amp chip. Am I right in saying I should buy a new NTSC N64 to use with s-video as the s-video capabilities of my existing N64 will probably have been destroyed in the process of the modding of the console?

[Asbrandt]

Unless they removed the original encoder from the board, adding RGB should have had no effect on Composite/S-Video.

[andykara2003]

Unless they removed the original encoder from the board, adding RGB should have had no effect on Composite/S-Video.

Cool thanks for that

[andykara2003]

So to connect the S-video to the back of the TV via scart input, is there any degradation in signal by using a s-video to scart adapter?

If not, what would be the best quality adapter to get?