Help me choose a japanese cab
Thanks for passing the word, zakk. I will definitely keep an eye on that!
Dave_K., my main usage would be 15khz, so that's good. I would go with the K7400 (15k only), which is said to have better geometry specs for 15k, but it appears to be out of production. I would rather just get the original monitor, but even buying it with a 'salvage' cab is a bit too expensive (quoted $300 for Windy cab w/monitor only+$300 ship=$600).
Dave_K., my main usage would be 15khz, so that's good. I would go with the K7400 (15k only), which is said to have better geometry specs for 15k, but it appears to be out of production. I would rather just get the original monitor, but even buying it with a 'salvage' cab is a bit too expensive (quoted $300 for Windy cab w/monitor only+$300 ship=$600).
The Exceleena Blue has a monitor frame with a pivot bolt on the back. You still have to lift the full weight of the monitor off the mounts and rotate manually with the full weight. The pivot bolt just makes sure you don't knock the back of the tube/frame into the side of the cab. So it is a little easier to rotate than say the Astro or Windy, but not nearly as easy as say the Egret or Egret 2/3.zakk wrote:Can anyone verify if the Namco Exceleena 2 (red) has some sort of 'easy' monitor rotation feature? I seem to recall the Exceleena blue does, but I just want to make sure they carried it over to the next model.
I have no idea if the Red model has this pivot bolt, but I'd assume it does being that its the successor to the Blue model.
The Egret, Egret II, and Egret III all have the round rotating monitor base. Only the Egret III has the monitor which can go up to 31khz.DC906270 wrote:Interesting discussion - does anybody know if the standard Egret II has the easily rotatable monitor and support frequencies up to 31kHz?
Yeah, I know it's not an 'easy' rotate, but at least it requires a bit less dismantling than an astro. I'm only asking because a local arcade is selling a red exceleena+guilty gear X 1.5 for $1000. After paying $1k and selling off the atomiswave MB at the GG cart, It would be almost the same price as having Matsu ship an astro to me. I need to move to the other coast or something!Dave_K. wrote:The Exceleena Blue has a monitor frame with a pivot bolt on the back. You still have to lift the full weight of the monitor off the mounts and rotate manually with the full weight. The pivot bolt just makes sure you don't knock the back of the tube/frame into the side of the cab. So it is a little easier to rotate than say the Astro or Windy, but not nearly as easy as say the Egret or Egret 2/3.zakk wrote:Can anyone verify if the Namco Exceleena 2 (red) has some sort of 'easy' monitor rotation feature? I seem to recall the Exceleena blue does, but I just want to make sure they carried it over to the next model.
I have no idea if the Red model has this pivot bolt, but I'd assume it does being that its the successor to the Blue model.
Do many games require 31khz monitors? I would mainly want to play Cave games like Ibara. Would a 24kHz monitor do?The Egret, Egret II, and Egret III all have the round rotating monitor base. Only the Egret III has the monitor which can go up to 31khz.
Also, are games like Ibara standard JAMMA or is this now outdated? If so, what standard or these modern games?
Cheers!
31khz is not necessary for most games, but recommended when the game is developed for hi-res display. You might think of it as Dreamcast VGA mode, Naomi is the same way. It's utilized in most 2000-up arcade hardware. 24khz is medium res and uncommon. I wouldn't worry about it unless you have a taste for the Model 1-3 Sega games (Zero Gunner, VF, Virtual-On, etc).
Ibara (and all Cave PCB) is JAMMA and low-res 15khz display only. JVS standard is the default in todays hardware (Atomiswave, Cave hardware, some exceptions), however the I/O boards for adapting JVS-->JAMMA are widely available and supported by the manufacturers themsleves. In some cases a seperate 3.3V power supply is necessary even with the I/O board.
Ibara (and all Cave PCB) is JAMMA and low-res 15khz display only. JVS standard is the default in todays hardware (Atomiswave, Cave hardware, some exceptions), however the I/O boards for adapting JVS-->JAMMA are widely available and supported by the manufacturers themsleves. In some cases a seperate 3.3V power supply is necessary even with the I/O board.
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stellarola
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loopyeddie
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Monitors distributed in the US (like Betson Imperial and WG-D9200) are typically marketed as 27" because thats the size of the viewable screen, but the tube is actually 29"...the same size as japanese 29" monitors. So yes US 27" monitors will fit in a japanese cab, but you will probably have to swap out the monitor frame. I'm not familiar with Neo's and even if they use a frame or not...but US monitor mounting points on the frame are not the same mounting points on a japanese cabinet. Thankfully the mountings on the tube iteself is standard across US and Japanese, so either swap the frames or just mount the tube in the cab if thats how the cab is designed.loopyeddie wrote:Sorry if this was mentioned. I didn't read the whole thread. Also sorry for going off the subject. Will a 27" cab fit a 29inch candy cab? I have a Neo29 and a Super Neo29 I'd like to get new monitors for, but never got a solid answer as to what will fit in it.
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loopyeddie
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Man, thanks! I have always thought I wouldn't be able to find a replacement monitor in America. Now I don't have to worry so much!Dave_K. wrote:Monitors distributed in the US (like Betson Imperial and WG-D9200) are typically marketed as 27" because thats the size of the viewable screen, but the tube is actually 29"...the same size as japanese 29" monitors. So yes US 27" monitors will fit in a japanese cab, but you will probably have to swap out the monitor frame. I'm not familiar with Neo's and even if they use a frame or not...but US monitor mounting points on the frame are not the same mounting points on a japanese cabinet. Thankfully the mountings on the tube iteself is standard across US and Japanese, so either swap the frames or just mount the tube in the cab if thats how the cab is designed.loopyeddie wrote:Sorry if this was mentioned. I didn't read the whole thread. Also sorry for going off the subject. Will a 27" cab fit a 29inch candy cab? I have a Neo29 and a Super Neo29 I'd like to get new monitors for, but never got a solid answer as to what will fit in it.
Dave,
I remember seeing you mention somewhere (maybe arcadecontrols.com) that you had to reverse the frame on your exceleena so the monitor would rotate in the correct direction. I just bought an exceleena 2, which appears to have the same rotation mechanism. Looking at the frame, I see what you mean. You have to disconnect the frame and reattach it 180 degrees rotated right? Does that mean the monitor chassis PCB is now mounted upside down on the top? Or did you handle that another way?
I remember seeing you mention somewhere (maybe arcadecontrols.com) that you had to reverse the frame on your exceleena so the monitor would rotate in the correct direction. I just bought an exceleena 2, which appears to have the same rotation mechanism. Looking at the frame, I see what you mean. You have to disconnect the frame and reattach it 180 degrees rotated right? Does that mean the monitor chassis PCB is now mounted upside down on the top? Or did you handle that another way?
Hey zakk, congrats on the exceleena 2! Yep, I posted this on arcade controls. The frame will only rotate one direction and fit back into the grove and mounting points. So what I did was completely disassemble the frame (remove the two bars that connect the top/bottom and hold the PCB, and moved those over to the other side (you should see a similar set of holes you can screw it into). So now the PCB sits off center on the other side of the tube (PCB still on the bottom). Then I think I flipped the back bolt plate over too. And that was it, basically now a mirror image of the frame, and rotates only the opposite direction.zakk wrote:Dave,
I remember seeing you mention somewhere (maybe arcadecontrols.com) that you had to reverse the frame on your exceleena so the monitor would rotate in the correct direction. I just bought an exceleena 2, which appears to have the same rotation mechanism. Looking at the frame, I see what you mean. You have to disconnect the frame and reattach it 180 degrees rotated right? Does that mean the monitor chassis PCB is now mounted upside down on the top? Or did you handle that another way?
I got a reply from a sales rep at Billabs...good/bad news; the price for the 27" 15-31k is $439, however, they only ship the thing via freight carrier. That's good since it wouldn't be thrown and bashed about like UPS/Fedex do it, bad since the shipping costs three times as much that way. I dunno if their 100% flat monitor is worth the extra $200 compared to the Betson and WG offerings.
Do they carry the non-flat monitors? I know Alva amusement can get the non-flat Wei-Ya monitor to me for $547. As neat as the flat monitor would be, I don't think I'm up for the extended fitment session it would require.oxtsu wrote:I got a reply from a sales rep at Billabs...good/bad news; the price for the 27" 15-31k is $439, however, they only ship the thing via freight carrier. That's good since it wouldn't be thrown and bashed about like UPS/Fedex do it, bad since the shipping costs three times as much that way. I dunno if their 100% flat monitor is worth the extra $200 compared to the Betson and WG offerings.
LOL. How did you manage the sub-$550 price? I think I need to call these dudes on the phone to get the exact details (possible local distributor, UPS/Fedex shipping, etc.). Email is not cutting it.zakk wrote:Cheaper+flatscreen wins out over expensive+curved.
Here's the Billabs website for those wondering what the hell we're babbling about. Tri-sync flat screen 27/29" monitor replacement for Astro and other Japan made neo-classic cabinets, sold in North America :) --
http://www.billabs.com/crts.htm (Wei-Ya)
The other vendors/manufacturers/models --
http://www.betson.com/parts/Monitors/ (Kortek)
http://www.wellsgardner.com/wellsgardner31/catalog.cfm
Oxtsu, in looking over my Exceleena last night, I realized that the bezel is NOT sitting flush to the Betson monitor (there are small gaps at the middle of the tube on each side. I also remember the Betson catalog saying the tube was a "dyna flat" model or something....which I guess means not true flat, but not as round as an original 15khz tube. I believe the WGD9200 is also this way. I don't think its enough to take out the dremal to make it perfectly flush, but wanted to make sure you were aware.Dave_K. wrote:With my crappy metric ruler, I'm seeing about the same on the Betson if I measure to the end corner of the tube (the tube's metal casing is slightly different than the Toshiba type tubes which is more sunken into its casing). Anyway, the bezel fits up against it snuggly on my Exceleena (which had a toshiba tube in it previously).oxtsu wrote: Is this measurement of 34-35mm for the tube mounting point the same as Betson/WG tri-sync monitor?
Actually I really wonder if dremeling the bezel is the right approach (to using a true flat tube)...I would think you need to ADD material, not take it away. Anyway, looking forward to the results of Zakk's project.
Thanks for the follow up, Dave and zakk. So most likely the flat screen will be lower than the bezel. Now that you mention it, I recall reading such a thing on Neo-29's homepage. Looks like a substantial gap there, with whatever 15-31k monitor he is using.
About the Betson "Dyna-Flat" model...I believe that one is 31k only, isn't it? The Betson 15-31k model should be less curved than the Astro,etc. monitors, akin to Blast City.
On a side note, I was reading WG's investor presentation, and they said that they will be rolling out new+improved versions of their CRT monitors (not LCD) in early 2006. I wonder if they will fix the geometry issues..and reliability (..most likely not).
About the Betson "Dyna-Flat" model...I believe that one is 31k only, isn't it? The Betson 15-31k model should be less curved than the Astro,etc. monitors, akin to Blast City.
On a side note, I was reading WG's investor presentation, and they said that they will be rolling out new+improved versions of their CRT monitors (not LCD) in early 2006. I wonder if they will fix the geometry issues..and reliability (..most likely not).
Ah, you are right on the "Dyna Flat", its VGA only. The pic in their catalog looks exactly the same as the multisync monitor so I thought it was the same tube (probably). Damn marketing mumbo jumbo.
Thanks for the link to Neo-29's homepage, I haven't been there in awhile. Yeah looks like he used some kind of weather stripping to fill up the gaps. Excellent idea, I'll have to try this out.
Thanks for the link to Neo-29's homepage, I haven't been there in awhile. Yeah looks like he used some kind of weather stripping to fill up the gaps. Excellent idea, I'll have to try this out.
Well it showed up. Unfortunately I think it must have sustained some sort of shock in transit, there's a crack in the neck, right near the neckboard. Probably jolted a bit and the weight of the neckboard cracked the tube.
Makes a nice blue light when you power it on. Wish I'd noticed this before I started dismantling random things to try to figure out how to mount it in the exceleena. Oh well, I'll call them on Friday/Monday and see how they're going to handle this.
From the stuff I did tonight, getting this thing in the exceleena will be interesting. While you can attach the exceleena frame to it, the neckboard would interfere with the plate+peg on the back of it.
Makes a nice blue light when you power it on. Wish I'd noticed this before I started dismantling random things to try to figure out how to mount it in the exceleena. Oh well, I'll call them on Friday/Monday and see how they're going to handle this.
From the stuff I did tonight, getting this thing in the exceleena will be interesting. While you can attach the exceleena frame to it, the neckboard would interfere with the plate+peg on the back of it.
Interesting, so the neck of the tube extends farther than a standard 29"? If thats the case, and you have to remove the back plate&bolt, then you will have a heck of a time moutning the sucker back in the cab. Maybe tilt it on its back and try to line up the holes as best you can with a friend screwing in the bolts.zakk wrote: While you can attach the exceleena frame to it, the neckboard would interfere with the plate+peg on the back of it.
If you mean the metal plate the PCB sits on at the bottom of the frame, I just used the original one that came with the betson pcb, and screwed only one side to the exceleena's frame and rigged the other side with the screws and huge washers (since it was also smaller). It aint pretty, but works. You could also use long zip-ties. Anything just to secure it.zakk wrote:Also the chassis isn't the same size as the one on the exceleena, so mounting it to the frame is interesting. Especially since it's smaller. I think you'd pretty much have to fabricate a metal mount for it.