Skyravens - Dev Log

[n0rtygames]

Yes. Skyravens!

Recently, I have been sucked in to actually working on this game in a very big way making a significant amount of progress on it. But, with the help of Pieterator doing a bunch of graphics for it - I've picked it up and am massaging it in to life slowly.

Features:
* Deathsmiles style left/right shooting
* Player must choose (and be competent with) two ships - not just one
* Boobs
* Mechanical Dinosaurs

Button Config:
(A) (B) (C)
(D)

A = Shoot Left, B = Shoot Right, C = Focussed
D = Break

Scoring System:
* Shoot enemies, collect point items
* Build meter through collection
* When meter is full, activate break mode - this will tag in your second pilot
* For approx 8-9 seconds both characters will be on screen
* After break mode, original pilot leaves screen - second pilot stays in play
* Break mode cancels all bullets on screen and gives 60 frames of invulnerability
* When bullets are cancelled, large gold coins appear in their place for more points
* When enemies are killed when any players break mode is active - gold coins are released instead of regular point items

dev shots only - ignore debug text..

[guigui]

Good news here. Chronoblast had me very interested.

Quick question, will this one be on XBLA also ?

[n0rtygames]

Quick question, will this one be on XBLA also ?

XBLIG, yes.

I decided to ignore all the "Oh no, the xbox 360 is doomed!" shit that's going around and just get it finished

[Reiko]

That's some fancy debug text

Looking good man. I loved Deathsmiles, even though from what I see on this forum, it seems I'm one among few. My little sister likes it too. Will there be a two player mode? Will there be a visible hitbox over your character?

[n0rtygames]

Will there be a two player mode?

Possibly four player, but sanity is telling me to go for just two..

Will there be a visible hitbox over your character?

Yes, due to the animations with the characters moving about, determining the hitbox with a particular focal point would get rather difficult - human bodies do not move like spaceships and thus its hard to make them pivot. So a visible hitbox is used to provide a focal point

[fagin]

Awesome news..... what's the ETA on it?

[Tyjet]

Sounds like my type of game and scoring

Perhaps a bit too early to ask, but do you automatically collect the items or do you have a "suck in" range.

[n0rtygames]

Awesome news..... what's the ETA on it?

Imagine at this point that I've retreated in to the corner, hid my head behind a magazine and mumbled "mmm couple of months or something.. idunno.." in a sort of non committal fashion

Sounds like my type of game and scoring

Perhaps a bit too early to ask, but do you automatically collect the items or do you have a "suck in" range.

Yeah, a little early - but something I'm mindful of. At the moment, there's a suck in range - unless you're in powered up mode where score tokens just go to the nearest player. As ever, with coop mode - I'll combine scores to encourage coop play.

I'm contemplating adding a bit of strategy to the timing of collection, ala Deathsmiles - causing them to bounce - or perhaps degrade in value over time like Raiden medals. Unsure yet!

In other news - after speaking with Shmup Jesus (AKA Frenetic) - I've been trying to get the buttons down as low as humanly possible. I know some people like to tap fire, others hate it and like that rapid C-Shot.

Frenetics advice was that I actually aim to make the game work with just two buttons and if absolutely necessary, have some sort of button combination to activate bombs/supers. This was good advice, something I've tried to adhere to in the past but with the amount of shit going on with this control system - simplifying it was a bit of an arse ache. So I played Deathsmiles using only 3 buttons. Shoot Left, Shoot Right and Bomb.

That's all very well and good, but it still didn't give me the rapid fire without going in to slow mode. So, here's what I've refined it to:

(A) (B) (C)

A = Shoot Left, B = Shoot Right, C = Rapid Fire
A+B+C = Ability

Tada!

edit: Oh um, this game MIGHT have a replay system - but dont hold me to it! It definitely has the ability to record frame inputs.. but I have no idea if I'll be able to maintain sync up to the very end. We'll see!

[mice]

Awesome!
(read: a post full of useful info and encouragment)

[nasty_wolverine]

why not:
A = Shot (hold for focus)
B = Switch
C = Auto
A + B = Break/Hyper/Super/whatever

that way C is only for people who hate tapping, and the game essentially uses only two buttons... and to switch sides, you can keep holding down shot/auto and tap switch to change sides, so you dont have to lift your finger off buttons to change sides, saves you from having to program how to treat holding left and right together (fires on both sides?)

[emphatic]

why not:
A = Shot (hold for focus)
B = Switch
C = Auto
A + B = Break/Hyper/Super/whatever

that way C is only for people who hate tapping, and the game essentially uses only two buttons... and to switch sides, you can keep holding down shot/auto and tap switch to change sides, so you dont have to lift your finger off buttons to change sides, saves you from having to program how to treat holding left and right together (fires on both sides?)

Clever!

[n0rtygames]

why not:
A = Shot (hold for focus)
B = Switch
C = Auto
A + B = Break/Hyper/Super/whatever

that way C is only for people who hate tapping, and the game essentially uses only two buttons... and to switch sides, you can keep holding down shot/auto and tap switch to change sides, so you dont have to lift your finger off buttons to change sides, saves you from having to program how to treat holding left and right together (fires on both sides?)

It already kinda does this. There's a short delay before holding A/B actually goes in to "laser" mode. Holding rapid becomes the standard and tapping to change direction - unless you want to fire your heavy shot of course then you hold it.

Allowing the player to switch at will, instead of building meter.. hmm. That could lead to some button bashing over the top fun.

Fun isn't something I can allow.

[n0rtygames]

Oh, right. Brain is working now. Yeah, the problem I have with this - is that it's not intuitive for a new player. I previously had a button that you tapped for turning and it felt horrible. The most intuitive way is to have the ability to fire in two directions with two different buttons.

Otherwise, it just turns in to a bit of a frustrating experience. Can you imagine the instruction screen for a beginner?

Code: Select all

(complex)
TAP A FOR FIRE
HOLD A FOR FOCUS FIRE
HOLD C FOR RAPID FIRE
PRESS B TO SWITCH CHARACTERS
PRESS C+A TO SWITCH DIRECTION!
PRESS A+B TO GO HYPER!

Versus:

Code: Select all

(simple)
A TO SHOOT LEFT
B TO SHOOT RIGHT
C FOR RAPID FIRE
A+B+C FOR SPECIAL

As I actually like what you're proposing though, there's an argument here for me to add a "Simple" vs "Advanced" control option (Like Marvel 3) so that beginner players don't find themselves unable to control the characters and this adds more depth to the character selection..

[nasty_wolverine]

Oh, right. Brain is working now. Yeah, the problem I have with this - is that it's not intuitive for a new player. I previously had a button that you tapped for turning and it felt horrible. The most intuitive way is to have the ability to fire in two directions with two different buttons.

Otherwise, it just turns in to a bit of a frustrating experience. Can you imagine the instruction screen for a beginner?

Code: Select all

(complex)
TAP A FOR FIRE
HOLD A FOR FOCUS FIRE
HOLD C FOR RAPID FIRE
PRESS B TO SWITCH CHARACTERS
PRESS C+A TO SWITCH DIRECTION!
PRESS A+B TO GO HYPER!

Versus:

Code: Select all

(simple)
A TO SHOOT LEFT
B TO SHOOT RIGHT
C FOR RAPID FIRE
A+B+C FOR SPECIAL

As I actually like what you're proposing though, there's an argument here for me to add a "Simple" vs "Advanced" control option (Like Marvel 3) so that beginner players don't find themselves unable to control the characters and this adds more depth to the character selection..

No, no, no.... I meant B for switcing shooting sides, character change can happen after bomb/hyper with A+B, if you remember playing ikaruga, A for shot, B for special, A+B for color change... DC version added C for color change...

A = shot (hold for focus)
B = change direction
C = auto
A + B = Hyper/Bomb ( C + B doesnt trigger anything )

Hyper to switch characters is interesting, make fire mechanic like futari, so one gets more points on focus and the other gets more points with shot, also one has narrow other has wide or follow (may even offer choice for partners), throw in good stage design around the mechanic, and be ready for awesome...

[n0rtygames]

But this is less intuitive than what I have, surely?

A B C
O O O

A <--- shoot left (hold for focus)
B ---> shoot right (hold for focus)
C ...... full auto in the current direction (if held and the buttons above are pushed, instant laser in appropriate direction)

all three buttons for super

What would adding a turn button back in do? I've found a turning button to be super clunky and just makes the brain go "blargh" with these sort of systems

[Tyjet]

A = shot (hold for focus)
B = change direction
C = auto
A + B = Hyper/Bomb ( C + B doesnt trigger anything )

If you hold A for laser and need to quickly shoot laser at the other direction by pressing B, wouldn't you accidentally initiate Hyper? Unless you mean having to hold A for laser, release, Press B to switch direction and the hold A again?

[n0rtygames]

A = shot (hold for focus)
B = change direction
C = auto
A + B = Hyper/Bomb ( C + B doesnt trigger anything )

If you hold A for laser and need to quickly shoot laser at the other direction by pressing B, wouldn't you accidentally initiate Hyper? Unless you mean having to hold A for laser, release, Press B to switch direction and the hold A again?

I could just bite the bullet and add a fourth button for Hyper/Bomb... depends how people feel about that

A B C
D

[nasty_wolverine]

Fourth button is a better idea, holding 3 buttons down on a controller is hard, unless you have a stick hooked up...

[Reiko]

Why not have the option for both? The player can use the controls they want then.

[Enemy]

Looking good, day 1 purchase for me!

[Nana]

I would like to point out that I VERY MUCH agree with norty on this one. I do not like using a separate button designated to switching shot sides; that's the method Gundeadligne uses, and it feels very unnatural for me, whereas Deathsmiles and Yakouga 5 have separate buttons for each direction, and even on my fucked up motioninjoy setup of Yakouga 5 with the right shot being on the left and vice versa, it still feels more natural than having the separate button for turning around.

[Tyjet]

I could just bite the bullet and add a fourth button for Hyper/Bomb... depends how people feel about that

I would prefer your button scheme with A = Shoot Left, B = Shoot Right. The D button can be an option, but it seems like the game can be played without it. Learning from Deathsmiles, it's much easier to tell which direction you are shooting since your eyes are not always focus on your character. Meaning, you can scan the whole play area and not second guess which direction you are shooting at.

[railslave]

Something worth considering.





Two characters , back to back.. all the time..
Also an ode to one of the best/original shooter franchises...

Gives you the sense of constant threat as well.

Battlemania

[Nana]

Battlemania/Trouble Shooter is awesome. Really novel game.

[n0rtygames]

I could just bite the bullet and add a fourth button for Hyper/Bomb... depends how people feel about that

I would prefer your button scheme with A = Shoot Left, B = Shoot Right. The D button can be an option, but it seems like the game can be played without it. Learning from Deathsmiles, it's much easier to tell which direction you are shooting since your eyes are not always focus on your character. Meaning, you can scan the whole play area and not second guess which direction you are shooting at.

The D button would only be for hyper - allowing a C button for rapid instead of having to mash on a pad. I have no problem doing it the Deathsmiles way for directional fire as quite frankly, despite the shit people talk about it - DS is the only game I've played in recent years that has a directional fire mechanic which doesn't screw with my brain cells. So no worries there

[shaowebb]

Wait...Break Mode? Oh lord I am having delicious flashbacks to Crimzon Clover just hearing that. I gotta say you know how to excite a man by mentioning two ships at once there.

[n0rtygames]

I know it's a hori, but I shall be adding Tate to this thing so I don't have to keep turning my monitor round between games of DDP and making this.

I'm sure this will please somebody else out there!

[emphatic]

I know it's a hori, but I shall be adding Tate to this thing so I don't have to keep turning my monitor round between games of DDP and making this.

I'm sure this will please somebody else out there!

Sure, if you add an option to rotate the controls too.

[n0rtygames]

Videos an' ting

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tsu4Z7d5 ... e=youtu.be

[railslave]

how do you do it !!

Love that intro. Yet again thats nothing less than xbla quality ....i think youve pretty much sown up the hori market as well, already !

Not messing about with bullet density as well i see