PS4 / Xbox One console war

[Ed Oscuro]

I rather like the segmented design, your thumb rests nicely in it. And yes, Nintendo would probably throw a fit and fall in it if somebody copied their d-pad design...and they would bring lawyers.

[Friendly]

I rather like the segmented design, your thumb rests nicely in it. And yes, Nintendo would probably throw a fit and fall in it if somebody copied their d-pad design...and they would bring lawyers.

There's nothing they can do about it. Nintendo's d-pad patent expired in 2005, so anyone can use cross-shaped pads nowadays.

[ST Dragon]

Wasn't the only reason PlayStation controllers had a segmented d-pad to try to be different from the Nintendo design? The time to pretend to be an auteur of controller design has long passed. They might as well connect the directions.

Or would their customers complain that the segmented pad is TRADITION?

Indeed the Playstation is probably the only console with a segmented d-pad to date and it's by far the worse and most unresponsive D-Pad ever, utterly useless for shooters with horrible diagonal movement! In fact, its only actual practical use is to cycle around the various option menus which don't need diagonal movement, just pressing: up, down, left, right.
Today all Playstaion games are basically controlled with the analog sticks, not the D-Pad any more.

[ST Dragon]

I rather like the segmented design, your thumb rests nicely in it. And yes, Nintendo would probably throw a fit and fall in it if somebody copied their d-pad design...and they would bring lawyers.

There's nothing they can do about it. Nintendo's d-pad patent expired in 2005, so anyone can use cross-shaped pads nowadays.

But there have been so many other consoles since the 80s & 90s that have used Cross shaped D-Pads with connected directional buttons (PC-Engine, MD, Saturn, DC, etc...), I didn't see Nintendo filling law-suits against them. So SONY has no excuse continuing this segmented d-pad parody design.

[Despatche]

"parody"? only from stdragon

i don't like the ps1 d-pad either but i don't like any pad really.

it's obviously doing something right, people swear by it. also it's not actually segmented; the pad itself is all one button still, each jutting side is just separated by a bit of plastic.

[null1024]

I rather like the segmented design, your thumb rests nicely in it. And yes, Nintendo would probably throw a fit and fall in it if somebody copied their d-pad design...and they would bring lawyers.

There's nothing they can do about it. Nintendo's d-pad patent expired in 2005, so anyone can use cross-shaped pads nowadays.

But there have been so many other consoles since the 80s & 90s that have used Cross shaped D-Pads with connected directional buttons (PC-Engine, MD, Saturn, DC, etc...), I didn't see Nintendo filling law-suits against them. So SONY has no excuse continuing this segmented d-pad parody design.

nitpicking, but the PC-Engine, MD and Saturn pads are circles, even though they have a raised cross on the circle, and I always assumed that was how they got around it, because the underlying part is a circle
The DC pad on the other hand fits the description. It's a shame it's so bad.
It probably got around it by having a different internal structure, but that's pure conjecture.

"parody"? only from stdragon

i don't like the ps1 d-pad either but i don't like any pad really.

it's obviously doing something right, people swear by it. also it's not actually segmented; the pad itself is all one button still, each jutting side is just separated by a bit of plastic.

It's a fairly nice pad that takes my inputs enough of the time compared to many other designs [at least the one on the PS1 and PS3, I have never had good success with a PS2 controller's D-pad]. And yeah, it is just one whole part, underneath the plastic top of the controller, the d-pad is just one molded bit of plastic. I have used a controller with separate d-pad buttons, and it was horrible.

[Ed Oscuro]

I have used a controller with separate d-pad buttons, and it was horrible.

The keyboard?

I rather like the segmented design, your thumb rests nicely in it. And yes, Nintendo would probably throw a fit and fall in it if somebody copied their d-pad design...and they would bring lawyers.

There's nothing they can do about it. Nintendo's d-pad patent expired in 2005, so anyone can use cross-shaped pads nowadays.

Right you are, thanks for reminding me.

[ST Dragon]

"parody"? only from stdragon

i don't like the ps1 d-pad either but i don't like any pad really.

it's obviously doing something right, people swear by it. also it's not actually segmented; the pad itself is all one button still, each jutting side is just separated by a bit of plastic.

Yes I know it's still one plastic button beneath the case, but its diagonal movement is still horrible & unresponsive. I realized this back in the day in 1997 when I 1st bought the PS1 with RayStorm, it was so tough & stiff performing diagonal movements on these segmented D-pads to avoid the bullets. For a shooter this is unforgiving!

I still consider the MD pad the best of its kind for 2D games and have been using it for years with my AMIGA games.

[Ed Oscuro]

The Dual Shock's d-pad is indeed horrible, but the later versions (including that found on the PSP) is fine.

[null1024]

I have used a controller with separate d-pad buttons, and it was horrible.

The keyboard?

It was actually an assy USB PS1 controller ripoff.
The inverted-T on a keyboard is pretty fine, although that's because you have fingers on each button, so there's no worrying about diagonals being mis-input.

and I hope you mean the 2000 and above d-pad on the PSP, the 1000 d-pad is actually just about unusable


Looking at the PS4 controller, I hope the back shoulder buttons don't feel so off like they do on the PS3 controller, bleh.

[Friendly]

During PlayStation Meeting 2013, Sony showed such a strong vision. Now we have to decide how to find our own victories within that and present games that express the Grasshopper world. And that makes me horny again.

[Ex-Cyber]

I can't tell whether he's expressing genuine interest in Sony's "strong vision" or implying that it's going to be awesome to subvert it. Or both.

[Friendly]

UPDATE 7/6 It's official: No renting, loaning, private sales, mandatory 24 hour checks or Xbone is locked down.
http://news.xbox.com/2013/06/main

UPDATE 5/26 Xbone is region locked

Xbox One spec analysis by Digital Foundry:
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digit ... s-xbox-one

Summary: PS4's GPU is 50% more powerful than Xbox One. Xbox One's DDR3 RAM is much slower, and much less of it available for running games. Fewer of its CPU cores are used for gaming. Xbox One's internal 500GB HDD is not user-replacable.

UPDATE 5/21
-Xbox 3 will be called Xbox One.
-Games will feature a kind of DRM that requires activation; a fee will have to be paid to activate a used game or play a game you own on a different console.
-Will have DRM that requires you to go online once every 24 hours
-It will have 8GB of RAM, but unlike PS4's memory it is only DDR3, 3GB of which are reserved for the OS


A new hardware overview document has just been leaked:

http://www.vgleaks.com/durango-xdk/

- Always on, always connected
- Low powered mode
- Kinect sold with every console, wider FOV, no motors, better tracking
- Kinect is required to be plugged in
- Low latency controller with "improved ergonomics", simplified interaction with console OS
- Bluray drive
- All games must be installed on HDD [you can start playing few secs after installation starts], game data streaming from optical disc not supported
- Only digital audio out

Big brother is watching you. 24/7.

-

Update: http://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.ph ... 12#p897212

[KAI]

Ugliest name ever.

[Friendly]

It's just the name of the prototype. You know, like Nintendo's "Revolution". Which was then named "Wii". Ugh.

[Marc]

What a load of shite. That would be a death sentence for what's probably gonna be the last generation anyway. I'll shit gold bricks if anything bar the Kinnect shit comes true.

[Ed Oscuro]

Better pucker up, then, 'cuz there's not much in there that looks particularly impossible to do with modern hardware.

Anyway, who really disconnects their 360 from the 'net when it's not in use (besides me, but that has as much to do with surge protection as anything else)?
They will have to count me out, though, if developers start encoding their digital output to prevent capture, for the simple reason that my hardware doesn't support such junk. A lot of sound and fury on behalf of the old content lobby is what that is, but I don't see many developers needing it (at least not for general release stuff); it would piss off a huge chunk of their fans. Maybe they would use it to lock down certain material (especially pre-release video and audio, but again, how would they get hype from the press without allowing content to be shown?).

The "move engines" sound useful for game developers, although having x86-64 should already make using generic libraries simple.

The main thing I'd be interested to know about Kinect is whether it improves on the lag reported in the current version.

Anyway, I'm expecting Kinect to be used as a "flail your controller around" replacement for QTEs in most games.

[louisg]

Anyway, who really disconnects their 360 from the 'net when it's not in use (besides me, but that has as much to do with surge protection as anything else)?

Hopefully you can still play your games after your DSL takes a dump

[system11]

I think the always on aspect is actually just talking about it never really being switched off, and doing 'things' in the background.

Which is why I'll be using a remote on/off power socket, running 24/7 in not-quite-standby is irresponsible with electricity. Of course it may be an option.

The Kinect shit is more of a problem though, Kinect doesn't even work in our lounge even if I wanted it to.

[MOSQUITO FIGHTER]

I thought the Kinect thing was pretty much over. Seems like I don't see very many new games for it on the shelf anymore.

[Stormwatch]

Microsoft is keen on shoving unwanted junk down users' throats, just look at Skype and Windows 8.

[trap15]

Calling it now:

PC hardware.

[BareKnuckleRoo]

Anyway, who really disconnects their 360 from the 'net when it's not in use (besides me, but that has as much to do with surge protection as anything else)?

I actually do this, mostly because I can't stand the ads that show up when you're connected to the net. Albeit you still get advertising anyways...

I imagine smart devs won't bother forcing the Kinect to be used in gameplay (unless Microsoft demands at least one element involving the Kinect in each game...). I wonder if you could use the system but have the Kinect turned around and facing a wall or the floor or something. "YOU CAN'T PLAY UNLESS I CAN SEE YOU, WHERE'D YOU GO?"

[Ed Oscuro]

Anyway, who really disconnects their 360 from the 'net when it's not in use (besides me, but that has as much to do with surge protection as anything else)?

Hopefully you can still play your games after your DSL takes a dump

For me, DSL is already the equivalent of taking a dump.

Calling it now:

PC hardware.

X86-64, DirectX 11 GPU, some kind of rebaked DLLs - I'd say that sounds right.

Anyway, who really disconnects their 360 from the 'net when it's not in use (besides me, but that has as much to do with surge protection as anything else)?

I actually do this, mostly because I can't stand the ads that show up when you're connected to the net. Albeit you still get advertising anyways...

I imagine smart devs won't bother forcing the Kinect to be used in gameplay (unless Microsoft demands at least one element involving the Kinect in each game...). I wonder if you could use the system but have the Kinect turned around and facing a wall or the floor or something. "YOU CAN'T PLAY UNLESS I CAN SEE YOU, WHERE'D YOU GO?"

Wow, shows what I know. So an element of Kinect is basically the Sony EyeToy? Always on, that's a bit spooky.

[BareKnuckleRoo]

I'm just speculating, really. I have no idea if the Kinect needs to be able to 'see' a player in its field of vision for the console to function (scary) or if it just needs to detect it's plugged in.

What'll people do at gaming tourneys? If you can only play with a net connection, it makes it impossible to take an Xbox 3 anywhere unless you're sure you can get an ethernet/wireless connection.

[Ed Oscuro]

I don't know either, but seeing the level of dickishness out of game companies lately, it wouldn't be too shocking.

Meanwhile they will be selling a game about defeating evil Big Brother.

[EllertMichael]

BAD ADVICE: Buy it at launch!

[Ed Oscuro]

I think Durango '95 has held its value better than Durango '13 will.

Durango '13 will still be at the extremes of styling, but turning it on will be horrorshow and vibratey on your insides.

Edit: MYSTERIOUS CHEWING MAN HAS BEEN DISAPPEARED

[Cuilan]

Calling it now:

PC hardware.

Assuming the rumors are true, the PS4 is more like a PC than the Durango is, since the Durango has ESRAM and Move Engines.

[Skykid]

I'm going to really enjoy not buying anything next gen for a loooooong time.