Regarding Roguelikes

[Damocles]

I've been playing a fair bit of Rogue itself lately. 5.4 to be exact. However, I have run into a major issue on two occasions. After loading a previously saved game, my avatar occasionally randomly warps around the map. I initially thought this was due to a directory change perhaps making the game think I tampered with the save. However, it has happened again without me moving any files around. Ideas?

Despite that, pretty fun game. Apparently not overly long, and the interesting enemies start showing up fairly quickly.

[BryanM]

So one of the ideas I had for awhile from now is to put together an action based, stressless roguelike. The current idea was to use a theme kind of like Hellgate: London:





But of course I want to get quite a bit away from that. I've got some ideas, man. Ideas that would make you poop yourself.

But I guess we've all got irons in the fire like this.

My point being, my first reaction to seeing photos of Hack Slash Loot was "son of a bitch!" The bastard is too adorable for words.

Actually playing it, and seeing its crudish mistakes, is actually relieving in a way. I mean, who presents their game in zoomed out, windowed mode?

In Nethack, there's that one guy who proved that almost all games spawned are possible to win, right? It just seems prudent, that you wouldn't spawn a guy in a room full of goblins that are armed to the teeth. When Nethack is the merciful one, something fishy's going on..

On the flip side, the game is speedy and superficial enough that perma-death isn't a thing to care about. You don't spend hours delicately picking out skills, exercising magic, IDing what the hell it is you've got, finding magic anti-rust blankets, you just get in there.

[Damocles]

So...Cave Noire. Not a full-on roguelike but pretty damn fun. I've cleared all dungeons except the Orb one. Apparently I saved the hardest for last. Searching for the last orb on B15F with only one item slot left is a bit tense.

[Icarus]

You hardcore roguelikers probably skipped over it, but Zaga 33 was ported to iOS. Free versions for Mac and PC available.
It's basically roguelike distilled and simplified to its core features - survival with limited hitpoints (+1 for each screen passed), randomised items and screen layout, two-hit mobs etc. I've found it quite compelling for the daily commute, since it's a short score-attack style roguelike.
If you've got an iDevice, Sword of Fargoal is the best thing on iOS in terms of roguelikes. there is 100 Rogues but I find that has some major UI issues.

[Ruldra]

If you've got an iDevice, Sword of Fargoal is the best thing on iOS in terms of roguelikes. there is 100 Rogues but I find that has some major UI issues.

I played them both and I didn't like Sword of Fargoal one bit. No hunger system so you can stay around and grind as much as you want, extremely big floors (due to the tunnels) so exploring a whole floor will take ages, annoying music, the VERY annoying trap that explodes your map and erases all your explored areas...the only thing I liked about the game was the automatic fights and the Atari sounds.

On the other hand, 100 Rogues has nice music and graphics, different characters with very different playstyles, and quite challenging. Took me a lot of effort and luck to beat normal mode with the Crusader. I was able to beat Rogue mode with the Wizard too, that was fun.

I'd recommend 100 Rogues way over Fargoal. Heck I'd rather play The Dungeon (a rather simple but fun iOS roguelike) over Fargoal.

[OBSCVRA]

100 rogues was one i had a hard time getting into, until i updated it recently, its UI feels a little more polished than it used to. Fargoal i havent gotten much enjoyment out of either, the lack of a food clock doesnt bother me so much as the auto health potions though. In all i still feel as if i just dont get it with that game, maybe it will grow on me?? I'd recommend Rogue Ninja for a simple little ios roguelike, its 99c, and feels like a stripped back Shiren. Rogue Touch is another one i have enjoyed.

[greg]

Yesterday, I went game shopping today at a store called Kanteidan in Shizuoka City to do some game shopping. I bought Waku Waku Puyo Puyo Dungeon on a whim. I haven't noticed the game there before. I figured it wasn't like Madou Monogatari, the RPG where the Puyo Puyo characters come from, and it turns out to be a Roguelike dungeon crawler. I figured it was such a game, judging by the few screenshots on the back of the game, plus the word "dungeon" in the game's title. It is very fun! I only played through the first dungeon so far yesterday afternoon, and I'd say it doesn't seem to require much Japanese reading ability at all... just some memorization of the menus and such. Very cute, very fun!

[CMoon]

Anyone notice the release of Legasista on the PS3? It's a little steep ($30), but it looks to be a rogue-like with all the standard NIS bells & whistles including an overly complicated game engine with enormous amounts of customization. Any of you guys checked this out?

[Damocles]

Anyone notice the release of Legasista on the PS3? It's a little steep ($30), but it looks to be a rogue-like with all the standard NIS bells & whistles including an overly complicated game engine with enormous amounts of customization. Any of you guys checked this out?

Damn that art direction looks horrid. Real-time battle system as well? Ah well, it's got Prinny in it.

[Damocles]

Goddamnit. Finally made it to the Spider Mastermind and was summarily smoked. I'm thinking about ditching Ironman and sinking a level or two in Finesse, hopefully allowing me to play hide and seek with him around corners. Dodgemaster makes the Cyberdemon a pansy, but is less effective for the chainshot enemies. Any ideas?

--------------------------------------------------------------
DoomRL (v.0.9.9.6G) roguelike post-mortem character dump
--------------------------------------------------------------

X, level 9 Former Human Lance Corporal Marine,
let the Spider Mastermind pwn him on level 8 of Hell.
He survived 101325 turns and scored 64899 points.
He played for 1 hour, 43 minutes and 3 seconds.
He didn't like it too rough.

-- Traits ----------------------------------------------------

Class : Marine

Ironman (Level 3)
Hellrunner (Level 2)
Reloader (Level 2)
Dodgemaster (Level 1)
Shottyman (Level 1)

Rel->Rel->SM->HR->HR->DM->Iro->Iro->Iro->

-- Equipment -------------------------------------------------

[a] [ Armor] nothing
[ Weapon] elephant gun (12d3) [0/1]
[c] [ Boots] protective boots [2/2] (70%)
[d] [ Prepared] micro launcher (5d5) [1/1]

-- Inventory -------------------------------------------------

[a] tactical shotgun (8d3) [5/5]
shotgun shell (x50)
[c] shotgun shell (x9)
[d] shotgun shell (x50)
[e] shotgun shell (x50)
[f] shotgun shell (x50)
[g] shotgun shell (x50)
[h] shotgun shell (x50)
rocket (x10)
[j] rocket (x10)
[k] rocket (x10)
[l] rocket
[m] small med-pack
[n] shell box (x100)
[o] shell box (x100)
[p] rocket box (x20)

-- General ---------------------------------------------------

17 brave souls have ventured into Phobos:
17 of those were killed.

--------------------------------------------------------------

[Moniker]

Goddamnit. Finally made it to the Spider Mastermind and was summarily smoked. I'm thinking about ditching Ironman and sinking a level or two in Finesse, hopefully allowing me to play hide and seek with him around corners. Dodgemaster makes the Cyberdemon a pansy, but is less effective for the chainshot enemies. Any ideas?

Hrm.. I'm not up to date on the latest version, so take this build advice with a grain of salt. Ironman isn't worth it until the very end of a build. If you want to spend those 3 traits on defense, do Tough as NailsX2 and Badass instead. As it is, you put barely anything into offense. For arachnotrons the main thing is to make sure they're dead within a few turns of discovery. I'd recommend a dual pistol build with Badass - Son of a Gun gives you more damage output per trait point than really anything else, and you can get it right away. You'd even have room for dodge master, if you wanted (I'd probably put those points in the last SoG and the rest in Son of a Bitch instead, then you can just knock them out of range most of the time). Shotty builds aren't that great until you either get a unique or Army of the Dead.

Since Spider's Lair is wide open, you'll want to start out with a run, and keep moving by diagonals, and head for a corner. Make sure you have some health packs so you can start running again as soon as you get tired.

Obviously finding a Berserk/Supercharge/Invulnerability powerup right before you hit the stairs would be ideal. I usually skip this level unless I do.

[Damocles]

Goddamnit. Finally made it to the Spider Mastermind and was summarily smoked. I'm thinking about ditching Ironman and sinking a level or two in Finesse, hopefully allowing me to play hide and seek with him around corners. Dodgemaster makes the Cyberdemon a pansy, but is less effective for the chainshot enemies. Any ideas?

Hrm.. I'm not up to date on the latest version, so take this build advice with a grain of salt. Ironman isn't worth it until the very end of a build. If you want to spend those 3 traits on defense, do Tough as NailsX2 and Badass instead. As it is, you put barely anything into offense. For arachnotrons the main thing is to make sure they're dead within a few turns of discovery. I'd recommend a dual pistol build with Badass - Son of a Gun gives you more damage output per trait point than really anything else, and you can get it right away. You'd even have room for dodge master, if you wanted (I'd probably put those points in the last SoG and the rest in Son of a Bitch instead, then you can just knock them out of range most of the time). Shotty builds aren't that great until you either get a unique or Army of the Dead.

Since Spider's Lair is wide open, you'll want to start out with a run, and keep moving by diagonals, and head for a corner. Make sure you have some health packs so you can start running again as soon as you get tired.

Obviously finding a Berserk/Supercharge/Invulnerability powerup right before you hit the stairs would be ideal. I usually skip this level unless I do.

I always forget about running. Considering that there are no detrimental effects for running with a shotgun, I really should make that a point. Arachnotrons are fairly easy as long as I'm not out in the open. The Elephant Gun can take them down in a few shots, as does the Tactical Shotgun. If I bump up the difficulty I'm sure I would be screwed, however. The Mastermind, however, if a frickin brick wall. YASD just now with a half-dozen med packs. It seems like every time he hits he takes off half my health and armor. 2x Finesse didn't help as he was still faster than me so I couldn't get around corners to safely take potshots.

Ah well, time for another crack at it.

[Eno]

Since nobody commented, UnReal World started an experiment with donation-based freeware versions just some days ago. Might be worth looking into it.

[Damocles]

--------------------------------------------------------------
DoomRL (v.0.9.9.6G) roguelike post-mortem character dump
--------------------------------------------------------------

Adam Ring, level 9 Former Human Lance Corporal Technician,
defeated the Mastermind on level 8 of Hell.
He survived 79807 turns and scored 78749 points.
He played for 1 hour, 22 minutes and 47 seconds.
He didn't like it too rough.

He killed 350 out of 384 hellspawn. (91%)
He held his right to remain violent.

He saved himself 2 times.

-- Statistics ------------------------------------------------

Health 60/60 Experience 35078/9
ToHit Ranged +0 ToHit Melee +0 ToDmg Ranged +0 ToDmg Melee +0

-- Traits ----------------------------------------------------

Class : Technician

Ironman (Level 1)
Finesse (Level 2)
Hellrunner (Level 2)
Reloader (Level 2)
Dodgemaster (Level 1)
Shottyman (Level 1)

Rel->Rel->SM->HR->HR->DM->Iro->Fin->Fin->

-- Equipment -------------------------------------------------

[a] [ Armor] red armor [4/4] (65%)
[ Weapon] elephant gun (12d3) [0/1]
[c] [ Boots] protective boots [2/2] (100%) (T)
[d] [ Prepared] missile launcher (6d6) [0/4] (T1)

-- Inventory -------------------------------------------------

[a] tactical shotgun (8d3) [5/5]
blue armor [1/2] (14%)
[c] red armor [2/4] (49%)
[d] shotgun shell (x48)

About damn time. Oddly enough, I was using the weaker Technician for experimental purposes...and didn't end up experimenting at all. I tackled the Arena and the Wall for an early rocket launcher and missile launcher/backpack respectively, which seemed to work out. I basically ran like a bitch against the Spider Mastermind. I stocked up on rockets and phase devices using hit-and-run with the elephant gun. Whenever I couldn't outrun him I teleported away and fired off rockets. Pistol build next.

[Moniker]

Anyone playing any FTL? The game made little sense to me until I realized that you need to explore as much as humanly possible in each sector. Basically, until I realized it's a pretty traditional roguelike, all things considered. Now I'm hooked.

I'm getting close to a win on easy with the Torus ship. Second form of the final boss is absolutely wrecking me, though. Any tips?

[BulletMagnet]

I don't play roguelikes often, but I couldn't help but chuckle when I saw this - no idea if it'll work all that well in practice, but it does have my attention.

[Ruldra]

^Not sure if that will really work. There are plenty of times in roguelikes where you need to sit tight and think about the situation at hand to come up with a way to escape. Rushing your moves - especially at the pace of the trailer - is a sure way to get killed fast.

[Moniker]

Not to mention it looks just like Cardinal Quest except you can only move on quarter notes... Hopefully they'll mix up the beats a little.

[BareKnuckleRoo]

^Not sure if that will really work. There are plenty of times in roguelikes where you need to sit tight and think about the situation at hand to come up with a way to escape. Rushing your moves - especially at the pace of the trailer - is a sure way to get killed fast.

Yeah, roguelikes are more of a slow paced RPG than an action-based genre. It'll be interesting to see if they find a way of making it work.

[Eno]

Picked up ToME couple of days ago. It's basically Action RPG: the Roguelike, heavily biased towards combat, heavily streamlined(inventory management is pratically out of the equation) and the early game feels quite easy. The roguelike player in me doesn't like it, the progress-bar filler is addicted.
And before I forget: goddamn escort missions. They are optional, but the rewards are okay and the game is filled with them.
Also of note is the engine it's built on, scriptable in Lua with no C hacks needed at all(devs words). It's not really popular yet, but there's a promising Incursion-inspired D20 module being developped with it.

Also been playing FTL on and off. Trying to like it, but easy mode takes too much time before it gets interesting, and some runs just don't get interesting at all. Might just ditch the general advice and go get pwned in normal instead.

[Squire Grooktook]

What's a good traditional roguelike (not action based or super streamlined) that's an easy introduction to the genre?

[Eno]

What's a good traditional roguelike (not action based or super streamlined) that's an easy introduction to the genre?

Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup and Nethack, I'd say.
Both are classics(or forks of one, at least ) and extreme opposites, in a sense. DCSS being quite balanced and less lol so randum, while Nethack will get you killed in the most absurd and random ways every five minutes(unless you read some spoilers).

Edit: just cranked ToME up to Nightmare. Got instagibbed in the second dungeon and now stabbed to death while blinded in the first. Now that's how it's done

[Drum]

^Not sure if that will really work. There are plenty of times in roguelikes where you need to sit tight and think about the situation at hand to come up with a way to escape. Rushing your moves - especially at the pace of the trailer - is a sure way to get killed fast.

Yeah, roguelikes are more of a slow paced RPG than an action-based genre. It'll be interesting to see if they find a way of making it work.

Slow-paced my eye - they can go as fast as you're capable of inputting. There is no RPG yet made that moves as briskly as Nethack - not even close.

[Squire Grooktook]

What's a good traditional roguelike (not action based or super streamlined) that's an easy introduction to the genre?

Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup and Nethack, I'd say.
Both are classics(or forks of one, at least ) and extreme opposites, in a sense. DCSS being quite balanced and less lol so randum, while Nethack will get you killed in the most absurd and random ways every five minutes(unless you read some spoilers).

Edit: just cranked ToME up to Nightmare. Got instagibbed in the second dungeon and now stabbed to death while blinded in the first. Now that's how it's done

I hadn't heard heard of Stone Soup. Looks very user friendly, I'll be sure to check it out. Thanks.

[Moniker]

What's a good traditional roguelike (not action based or super streamlined) that's an easy introduction to the genre?

Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup and Nethack, I'd say.
Both are classics(or forks of one, at least ) and extreme opposites, in a sense. DCSS being quite balanced and less lol so randum, while Nethack will get you killed in the most absurd and random ways every five minutes(unless you read some spoilers).

I'd throw in Brogue and ADOM, as well. Brogue is formally similar to NetHack, in that they're both fairly direct descendants of the original Rogue, but Brogue takes a page out of DCSS's book and is more focused on balance and mechanics. ADOM is the only roguelike that really matches the sense of grandeur and discovery that NetHack provides.

[Icarus]

Crypt of the Necrodancer is out on Steam at the end of this month, and from what I've seen from people streaming the closed-beta release, it looks really good.
It's a mix of roguelike and rhythm game, with actions taking place on- and off-beat, the beat is obviously controlled by the BPM of the current track (which you can customise). Some great bundled-in music as well, really catchy stuff.
Devs are saying it'll go up for $15.

[Doctor Butler]

You hardcore roguelikers probably skipped over it, but Zaga 33 was ported to iOS. Free versions for Mac and PC available.
It's basically roguelike distilled and simplified to its core features - survival with limited hitpoints (+1 for each screen passed), randomised items and screen layout, two-hit mobs etc. I've found it quite compelling for the daily commute, since it's a short score-attack style roguelike.
If you've got an iDevice, Sword of Fargoal is the best thing on iOS in terms of roguelikes. there is 100 Rogues but I find that has some major UI issues.

http://doctorbutler.blogspot.com/2012/04/zaga-33.html

I love Zaga

[Necronopticous]

Absolutely can not wait for Necrodancer.

Zaga is a quality game, but goddamn that iOS port has the worst controls possible. Pretty much unforgivable seeing as the game is basically nothing but precise strategic movements. Seriously, what the fuck were they thinking? I'm getting pissed off just thinking about it right now.

[Ruldra]

How exactly does Necrodancer works? Do you need to move according to the beat and you're punished if you don't, or is the movement automatic and you simply choose a direction?

[Necronopticous]

The basic idea of Necrodancer is that time steps forward on each beat of the music rather than upon player action. The player is restricted to one action per time step (unless you have an item that allows you otherwise, speed boots for example) and failing to take a meaningful action (moving, digging, using an item or ability, etc) in sync with the beat/time step will reset your coin multiplier, which severely limits the amount of money you can accumulate and thus the upgrades available to you (there is a shop on every level). Your coin multiplier is also reset when you get hit by an enemy.

Movement is definitely not automatic, and there are certain instances where it is highly beneficial/will save your life to take no action at all, even at the expense of losing your multiplier. There is even an item (ballet shoes) which will allow you to take no action on beats without losing your multiplier.