Dreamcast STGs that I should play.

[n0rtygames]

So, my family brought over all the old stuff sitting in their garage the other day. Amongst it, my Dreamcast. Sadly though - not my Utopia disc and collection of dubious burned-to-cdr titles.

I'm looking to rebuild a collection with games that I'll actually want to play. Primarily shooters, as I hear there's a lot of good ones on the DC!

Bear in mind that when I actually played my Dreamcast, I was not as big in to STGs as I am now... so my collection was a little lacking back then. But hopefully, this will be fixed.



Are there any "Must Have!" titles I should be on the lookout for, to start building a DC collection?

Cheers!
Steve

[Pyongyang]

I like Karous. Lots of people don't though.

[Special World]

Mars Matrix, absolutely and without a doubt.

[n0rtygames]

Mars Matrix, absolutely and without a doubt.

You know, for some reason there's a voice in the back of my mind saying "Go play Mars Matrix"... Maybe I should listen to you both.

[TransatlanticFoe]

Burn yourself another boot disc, as you'll need it. Only a handful got PAL/US localisations.

http://www.racketboy.com/retro/sega/dre ... d-shooters

Many aren't cheap. I guess Giga Wing is a reasonable starting point, as it's not expensive but still loads of fun.

[z0mbie90]

I like Karous. Lots of people don't though.

+1 also Radirgy from Milestone. And another game that don't get much love but I like is Trizeal. After that you have games like Zero Gunner 2, Border Down, Triggerheart Exelica.

[dark]

Almost all of them are very good, but in different ways. I suppose " must haves" would depend on what kind of shooting games you like.

As for myself, I recommend:

-Mars Matrix (fast, 2d, lots of bullets, very reminiscent of Dodonpachi in terms of gameplay)
-Under Defeat (excellent graphics, good gameplay, not really a bullet hell game, but there is a lot going on)
-Karous (interesting cel shaded graphics, and some unusual elements for a shooter, such as it's impossible to beat the game without leveling up your weapons through an experience point type of system, and making use of your sword and shield in addition to shooting bullets at the enemies) Karous gets some hate because it's possible to beat the game by baerly moving your character around, sucking up bullets with your shield, and timing out the bosses - but by doing this, you can't get to the true last boss, so you aren't actually winning the game...
-Chaos Field (personal favorite of mine, the soundtrack is excellent. It gets some hate for its slightly crude graphics, and it was milestone's first shmup, but the gameplay makes up for it in my book)

-shikigami no Shiro is pretty good too
-i find Gigawing 1 and 2, and Borderdown to be kind of overrated. Gigawing 1 in particular hasn't aged well for me, its so slow paced compared to later shmups

Honestly, if you're going to be doing "try before you buy" with cdrs, you could probably just check them all out.

[n0rtygames]

Burn yourself another boot disc, as you'll need it. Only a handful got PAL/US localisations.

http://www.racketboy.com/retro/sega/dre ... d-shooters

Many aren't cheap. I guess Giga Wing is a reasonable starting point, as it's not expensive but still loads of fun.

Excellent resource. Thanks for that!

As much as I'd like to get my hands on legit copies, I suspect you're right about needing another boot disc if I don't want to end up begging on the streets any time soon. So I'll have to purchase them over time. Would it be fair to assume that the most recent boot loaders will handle the titles on that page without any major issues?

Going back quite a few years now, but I did have some issues getting the boot disc to work with a few titles here and there.

[EmperorIng]

Giga Wing 2 is a serious recommendation from me. Fabulous game, and lots of fun to play. It's usually in the $30 range.

Giga Wing is not as fun, imo, but I'm sure there are some people who will disagree. For me, it's the complete lack of volcanons (GW2 players will know what I mean)!

I would say Under Defeat, but it's so damned expensive, along with Border Down, that it's hard to justify spending in the triple digits to acquire them. Under Defeat is a great game though, so if there is a game you would have to burn onto a CDR, there you go.
Or you can just buy the PS3 version that just came out for $30.

Zero Gunner 2 and Gunbird 2 should be on your watch-list - especially Gunbird 2, as it is usually in the $20-30 range. Some of Psikyo's best. ZG2 is really pricey though, so watch for that.

For the Milestone games, it's much cheaper to get them on Nintendo systems. Hell, if you just get the Wii import Milestone Shooting Collection 2, that's every single Milestone game ever made on one disc (sans that crappy DS game they made). Radirgy is probably the best Milestone game though.

[emphatic]

Zero Gunner 2. Play it on a high res screen - it is glorious.

[KAI]

MILESTONE!

[Drachenherz]

MILESTONE!

Mars Matrix was one of the STG milestones on the Dreamcast.

So go play Mars Matrix.

[trap15]

Mars Matrix was one of the STG milestones on the Dreamcast.

So go play Mars Matrix.

I love you.

[KAI]

I hate you both.

Play Radirgy and Karous.

[renardqueenston]

i absolutely adore adore adore Zero Gunner 2. great style and interesting gameplay. Psikyo's transforming bosses translate wickedly to 3D. soundtrack is, as per Psikyo, rather forgettable and sometimes even hilariously unsuitable, but the rest of the presentation makes up for it tenfold.

[casualcoder]

Ikaruga of course. I remember playing Border Down and finding it really hard but now that I'm better at STGs im sure I would love that game.

[shmuppyLove]

People don't like Karous?

WHAT IS WRONG WITH PEOPLE

[EmperorIng]

People don't like Karous?

WHAT IS WRONG WITH PEOPLE

Well, spending $80+ for it on the Dreamcast vs. spending $30 for it on the Wii...

[chempop]

My faves are:

Gigawing 1+2
Mars Matrix
Gunbird 2
Under Defeat
Zero Gunner 2

Didn't care for the milestone offerings, psyvarriar 2, shiki 2...

Border down and Ikaruga are good too, but I never got that into them.

[null1024]

Hrm. I never got that into the DC's STG library.

but I can definitely recommend Mars Matrix, that was my favorite STG for ages, until DOJBL surpassed that for me

And I do like Ikaruga a bit.

It might also just be the horribad DC pad. It looks cool, but actually using it for anything is the worst. I really should get one of those Total Control adapters so that I can use a DualShock... or maybe I should get the one that lets you use Saturn pads on the DC.

[edit]
oh yeah, Triggerheart Exelica is neato, but not that highly regarded

And I really hate Giga Wing and Giga Wing 2. Something about them doesn't click with me at all. Mars Matrix is Giga Wing done right.

[nZero]

The Dreamcast still has the definitive versions of Triggerheart Exelica and Under Defeat.
Psyvariar 2 is another one of my favorite games on the system, although good ports exist for other consoles as well.
Both Mars Matrix and Gigawing 2 are awesomely outrageous.
Some other quality offerings include Radirgy and Zero Gunner 2.

[n0rtygames]

So go play Mars Matrix.

Mars Matrix has just shown me what I was doing wrong with my powerup system in my own stuff. This game fucking rocks hard.

Seriously. <3

[evil_ash_xero]

Ummm....IKARUGA. There's some weirdness going on about that game in these forums, but it is THE game for the DC. So fuck y'all!

I'd also recommend Zero Gunner 2. It's a lot of fun, and has some interesting mechanics.

Mars Matrix is sucked off a lot here, due to Rob's Pro Reviews, but it is a darn good game. It's just kind of ugly, and the music is....well, it's there. It's also a ball buster!

Bangai-O rocks the house, but I don't think it's really a shmup. It's listed as one here, but I deny that. But GET IT.

The G. Rev shmups are also good. Some people prefer Border Down, and some people prefer Under Defeat. I like Border Down more, since it reminds me of G Darius. Under Defeat reminds me of less interesting Zero Gunner 2. Both are worth getting though. The weird check point thing that Border Down has going on takes getting used to.

If you like Psykio(I don't really like them a whole lot), you should get Gunbird 2. It's probably the best "traditional" Psykio game, other than Dragon Blaze.

That's all I really like. I would just skip the Giga Wings and go to Mars Matrix.

SO, to sum it up:

Ikaruga- must have, legendary, best on the system.
Bangai-O- Not really a shmup, but awesome.
Mars Matrix- Go play Mars Matrix. Someone said that once, and it kind of sticks with you.
Zero Gunner 2- More interesting version of Under Defeat.
Border Down- Not as good as G. Darius, but similar.
Under Defeat- Not as good as Zero Gunner 2, but similar.
GunBird 2- Typical Psykio game, but a good one.

I think the DC is way overrated as a shumpping system, but it's got it's moments.

[SePh1r0tH]

No love for NG dev teams games? I think fast striker is great. Under defeat is one of my favorites too. It's got an old school feel with some unique features.

[louisg]

I really like Under Defeat, Ikaruga, and Mars Matrix. MM is indeed better than GigaWing, but I only really play GigaWing now because it's so much more relaxed. Zero Gunner 2 is excellent, but takes a while to get going. And I'd also recommend Border Down if you like Darius or Metal Black, though IMO it's a little uneven.

I'm surprised nobody mentioned Shikigami II. I'm not a big fan, but I know it has its following.

[R79]

Gunbird 2, 100%

One of the last great shooters to be honest, before things all went super extreme. Wonderful 2D art and re-playability on this title, and still a relative bargain. Western, you get the English text, JPN, you get the voice, your choice.

[n0rtygames]

I assume there's no real reason to rush out to get Ikaruga given that I have it on my 360 via XBLA right?

Currently acquiring Gunbird 2 as the next one to try. Very impressed with Mars Matrix so far.

[null1024]

I assume there's no real reason to rush out to get Ikaruga given that I have it on my 360 via XBLA right?

Currently acquiring Gunbird 2 as the next one to try. Very impressed with Mars Matrix so far.

The DC port is just about arcade perfect [thanks to running on near-identical hardware, yay NAOMI -> DC ports!], unlike the rest. No real reason to rush to get it for the DC if you can play it on something else though.

[EmperorIng]

As I said, while I like Ikaruga and the Milestone games (that I've played) a whole lot (Ika indeed almost made my top-25 ballot), there's very little reason to spend literally hundreds of dollars on each title when ports to other systems are going for about 1/5th of the DC ebay prices.

If you have a wii, it'd just be cheaper to get the Milestone collection and the GC port of Ikaruga; if an xbox360, the XBLA Ikaruga (and Radiant Silvergun too... and Strania!).

For DC shmups, after about $70 it needs to be one damn gem of a game, like Psyvariar 2, to justify the price (and Psyvariar 2 is usually around $60, which I think is a fair price).

[Jeneki]

I would play Mars Matrix more often if I didn't have to un-tate my display to do so.

Although there is a bunch of cool stuff for hori displays. Zero Gunner 2, the Giga Wings, Border Down, and Fast Striker are fun.