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 Post subject: SNES Mini abnormal slowdown?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2012 4:23 pm 


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I'm noticing slowdown on this particular hardware that I don't remember seeing in the earlier system.... but can't seem to find any real documentation for this online. Starfox 1 and 2 (a repro cart) have really dramatic framerate drops as well. I can say for certain the first Starfox never had this problem on the original console.

Oddly enough, Super Aleste, with a whole lot of action onscreen, doesn't seem to experience slowdown... although the difference might be slight.


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 Post subject: Re: SNES Mini abnormal slowdown?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2012 4:53 pm 


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OdiousTrident wrote:
Starfox 1 and 2 (a repro cart) have really dramatic framerate drops as well. I can say for certain the first Starfox never had this problem on the original console.

Haha, you (and I :() wish... Starfox 1 runs at like 10 fps, if even that...
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<S.Yagawa> I like the challenge of "doing the impossible" with older hardware, and pushing it as far as it can go.


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 Post subject: Re: SNES Mini abnormal slowdown?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2012 8:40 pm 


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This is completely unplayable you have to see it to believe it. There are videos online of Starfox running on the original SNES that confirm I'm not misremembering. This wouldn't be a problem with the specific unit I bought right?


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 Post subject: Re: SNES Mini abnormal slowdown?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2012 9:03 pm 


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Hmm, interesting. Do you have Yoshi's Island, or any other game that uses SuperFX? It's possible (albeit unlikely) that the clock being sent to the cartridge isn't the typical SNES master clock, but I don't know anything about SNES Mini. Do you have info on the unit itself (or a site with info, or whatever)?
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<S.Yagawa> I like the challenge of "doing the impossible" with older hardware, and pushing it as far as it can go.


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 Post subject: Re: SNES Mini abnormal slowdown?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 4:55 pm 


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Master clock is the same: 21.477 MHz.

Overclocking the Super FX in each game will give you a nice speed boost.

Easy to do in most games. All you have to do is swap out the crystals. For Starfox, you have to intercept the master clock and wire up your own oscillator.

Example: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xB7180J4ocY


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 Post subject: Re: SNES Mini abnormal slowdown?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 8:23 pm 


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Yeah, but it sounds like he's getting more slowdown as usual (which is why I suggested maybe the master clock going to the cart is wrong, since the SuperFX is where Starfox gets most of the slowdown). Again, I can't really say anything until I know if it's actually slowing down abnormally...
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<S.Yagawa> I like the challenge of "doing the impossible" with older hardware, and pushing it as far as it can go.


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 Post subject: Re: SNES Mini abnormal slowdown?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 8:24 pm 


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I have a couple SNES Minis, an original SNES, and a Yoshi's Island (I think...it's one of the Super FX games definitely), something else to add to the pile of "to do" items today.


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 Post subject: Re: SNES Mini abnormal slowdown?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 9:08 pm 


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Confirmed with a frequency counter. Master clock is the same.


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 Post subject: Re: SNES Mini abnormal slowdown?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 9:16 pm 


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Ah ok. Wonder what the problem is then? I'm starting to think that there isn't one :P
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<S.Yagawa> I like the challenge of "doing the impossible" with older hardware, and pushing it as far as it can go.


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 Post subject: Re: SNES Mini abnormal slowdown?
PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2012 7:42 pm 


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Just played Pocky & Rocky on both a Retro Duo and a Mini to tests things out. The Duo had more consistent slowdown but the Mini definitely dropped in framerate to a larger degree in certain spots. I don't have a good eye for fps, but looking at a youtube video of Starfox 2 on original hardware - the Mini running this particular repro cart looks nothing like it. Maybe it's less than 10 fps... I don't know really.

I have a "standard" SNES system in the mail. Hopefully then I can confirm I'm not imagining things.. I'm convinced there is a difference here.


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 Post subject: Re: SNES Mini abnormal slowdown?
PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2012 8:50 pm 


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I'm 99% sure the Retro Duo is not original hardware, and I'm 99% sure the SNES Mini is. It's entirely possible that the Retro Duo is too fast, so the comparison feels wrong to you.
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<S.Yagawa> I like the challenge of "doing the impossible" with older hardware, and pushing it as far as it can go.


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 Post subject: Re: SNES Mini abnormal slowdown?
PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2012 8:55 pm 


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You can't compare a system that essentially emulates via a cheap ARM-based SoC with original hardware.


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 Post subject: Re: SNES Mini abnormal slowdown?
PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2012 9:02 pm 


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I compared them because the RetroDuo is known to have more slowdown than the original hardware. The Mini's slowest points were worse than the RetroDuo's in this case, but the latter had more slowdown overall. Will check with the original system when we get it.


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 Post subject: Re: SNES Mini abnormal slowdown?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 2:18 pm 


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I just compared Starfox on both the Mini and an original SNES back-to-back several times. The screen is definitely scrolling at a slower pace on the Mini and the enemy models seem to move at a different rate when the screen gets busy. That being said, the cartridge on both systems looks pretty choppy as someone on this thread indicated would be the case. The Starfox 2 repro might have a touch more slowdown on the Mini but I really don't have a good eye for these things unless it's obvious. I haven't looked at Pocky & Rocky yet but that seems like a good barometer for slowdown as well.


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 Post subject: Re: SNES Mini abnormal slowdown?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 7:43 pm 


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if someone got passion, I'd love to see a video - I can't compare myself.

Pretty shocking if true. :!:


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 Post subject: Re: SNES Mini abnormal slowdown?
PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2012 2:01 am 


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Is it possible this is a difference in output? I am not using S-Video for either system and am not tech savvy enough to know if that would create a change in perceived speed.


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 Post subject: Re: SNES Mini abnormal slowdown?
PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2012 2:39 am 


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I wonder if the 1 chip SNES systems also have issues. There is an odd slowdown on the title/intro for Soul Blazer when the title scrolls across the screen. I havent checked with a 2 chip yet.


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