Why Hasn't Obama Closed Guantanamo?

[Ed Oscuro]

Once more, with FEELING

One thing I meant to mention in another thread, but fits here too: Some are wondering if the Republican voters won't return for the 2014 midterms. This was a close election, in terms of the popular vote, so it's not inconceivable that we could see yet another freshman Tea Party wave for 2014, if the Republican Party has enough people happy for the crumbs of the House rather than putting forward a good Presidential candidate. Or, if they get smart, they can use up their extremists' enthusiasm in those races, getting out the vote, and then be relentlessly middle-tacking for the Presidential season.

For all the talk about compromise and electoral consequences, I bet that's the course some people are banking on.

Right, I should've remembered from the name.

Why meth, though? Is that meant to kill people off before they devolve into office worker / hippie stereotypes, the lowest forms of drug users?

Because it's cheap and it's as far away from pot as you can get. God, have you ever had to talk to a marijuana legalization activist for more than five minutes? They deserve to be last. Also, their stories are the worst of the bunch.

I thought that was meant to be a continuum, where LSD is as far away from pot as you can get because it's at the other end of the spectrum.

[szycag]

When Obama was on the Daily Show recently he said he still wants to close it but couldn't get Congress to convene about the issue.

http://www.thedailyshow.com/full-episod ... rack-obama (around 15:45)

[GaijinPunch]

Lets face it who ever gets in power puts the handcuffs on straight away its not as if they have much freedom to move anything from where it is. Americans are the most stubborn people on the planet.

You've clearly not spent time in Asia, nor married a Japanese.

They deserve to be last. Also, their stories are the worst of the bunch.

All my best stories involve the harder stuff. Definitely!

[rancor]

Lets face it who ever gets in power puts the handcuffs on straight away its not as if they have much freedom to move anything from where it is. Americans are the most stubborn people on the planet.

You've clearly not spent time in Asia, nor married a Japanese.

Hear hear! I've been dealing with a lot of south Asians / Indians / east Africans in my work lately. There's no such word as "compromise". In these cultures, you either win or lose - there is no middle ground. I think the idea of compromise is a very western thought process. If you think Americans are the most stubborn people, well... Get out a bit more and deal with some non-western cultures.

[GaijinPunch]

I think the whole theme of "America's the most ________" can only be used if you've never left America (which is most Americans). The only one that holds true is if you look at the thought process of the far right and the religious right. In most any other way, America is very middle of the road. We have lower taxes than most of the G8, definitely lower cost of living than most of the G8, and as per the posts above, dealing within westerners on a business level is 100x easier than non-westerners. Sorry to throw that faux racist remark in there but it's true. Japanese are probably the worst offenders in the business world. Political world? Well... Japan is being lambasted on the global front for 20 years of political and economic stagnation. Nothing ever changes.

[neorichieb1971]

I'm married to a Filipino and i've never won an argument to date.

But relationships and politics are different beasts. I'm talking about such things as giving up constitutional rights like guns to save peoples lives. To me thats just stubborn. In the UK if something is bad for your health you put the price up and tax it more. Guns should be dealt with in the same way. Don't make it illegal, just out of the reach of normal people. When I lived in Newburgh, IN I didn't even lock the door of the house. So what use is a gun?

Anyway, back on topic. Not that this thread has ever been on topic

[GaijinPunch]

It's not stubborn. There's just a shit load of people that want guns.

[Ed Oscuro]

Don't make it illegal, just out of the reach of normal people.

Special People Paradise™

[Friendly]

@Ed
Do you agree with my post?

With the original post? Well, it's complex - I mostly do.

No, I meant this one: http://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.ph ... 85#p849585

It's like Americans are living inside some special subset of reality.

[Ed Oscuro]

Well, first I have to say that when somebody calls Republicans "fascists," that also makes no sense with a by-the-book definition at least.

Another thing is that America's circumstances have been unique enough that some issues that seem settled in other nations, by experience, have had little influence on Americans. I would argue the reverse could be true, too - like my example of freedom of expression in France versus in the United States. Despite the abuse of the term "liberal," there is indeed a sense in which the Republicans do fulfill that notion. The Bill of Rights was settled at a time when many people would have simply called the 'liberal' ideal "radical" or "Republican" (small-r republican, these days) as opposed to loyalist, royalist, Tory, or whatever you like; so everybody - not just Americans - tends to forget the roots of American agreement on governmental ideals.

The modern "liberal program" is often much different from that. The ACLU does a lot of work to sustain those traditional rights - I picked up a couple voters' rights pamphlets from them after the election - but it also has a reputation of defending people who don't seem sympathetic, and it also backs some causes that are not universally loved. The American Bar Association lost the support of Justice Douglas after he says he discovered its "true character;" I don't know what he meant yet, but obviously the ABA is more than just pro-law; it also advocates for the profession of advocacy. Then from there you can go to all the other pressure and lobby groups that have a legitimate place in the nation.

What some people call "blind spots" might also be called the results of unique circumstances. I do think the parties have their blind spots. I won't try to diagnose those, but it was interesting and even a bit unsettling to watch a bit of MSNBC coverage during Rachel Maddow's diatribe against Republicans, about the time the results were clearly showing that Romney had no path to the Presidency. It was mostly factually correct, but if there's anything I've learned from internet exchanges, it's that a lot of people are like little girls that need to be told things with love and sweetness before they'll even think about it (and then they still might not).

[Randorama]

Hear hear! I've been dealing with a lot of south Asians / Indians / east Africans in my work lately. There's no such word as "compromise". In these cultures, you either win or lose - there is no middle ground. I think the idea of compromise is a very western thought process. If you think Americans are the most stubborn people, well... Get out a bit more and deal with some non-western cultures.

More than western, "middle ground" is a middle-class/mid size city-based approach to human relations, which we could call a "liberal", educated attitude.

In terms of stubborness and uncompromising attitudes, I always perceived a clear difference between "conservative" (or also illiterate) country hicks and "city dwellers". For instance, the average bogan from the outback is rather western in background, but would never, ever compromise with an outsider. An average discussion with an average dutch, in my Utrecht times, also gave me a general impression that the Dutch are a bunch of country hicks, too, given this idea. And I won't mention Norwegians, or the rabble from my hometown.

I guess that you mostly meet people who grew up poor and in shitty places, of which Asia is full.

[neorichieb1971]

From an outsiders point of view (non American) we all look and say to ourselves "Look, they come up with 1000 reasons not to change anything". I'll give you an example of something that doesn't work when you do nothing. Unsustainable population growth (unfortunately the USA will be one of the last countries to feel the pinch).

By and large, your constitution is a bible and any deviation from it is some kind of American sin. It doesn't matter if it rains gold in other countries that ignore American values. So capitalist and constitutional values clash, or should have at some point. It seems rather unlikely an American voter didn't have to choose between one and the other in 500 years.

Either way, the American system is a train set. The track does a loop and the American train goes round and round. But ultimately it never ventures away from the track. When it does, its called a "Train Crash". The important people in America don't want a train crash, but are happy with it going round and round.

In 4 years, politicians will talk about womens vaginas again like its the biggest issue in the world. And some twat will say its Gods will if a woman gets raped (no intelligent man should say that. imo thats a setup).

Since 1965, the only pioneering American thing outsiders see is the USA NASA Space programme. That is the symbol that shows us that America is great, it has an agenda to lead. But in everything else America is a shadow. I'm sorry to say but only a civil war will stop with left right tug of war. If you don't all pull in the same direction, you'll barely move. Obama shutting this prison down is one such case where doing nothing seems to be better than doing something. Perhaps "stubborn" is the wrong word altogether. Perhaps both sides are uncompromisable or willing to concede. Just to see if it makes any difference. After all, most changes are experimental.

[evil_ash_xero]

There's a lot of red neck/bible thumpers here, man. Mostly uneducated. It's hard to change things with all of them. Strangely, the latino vote is changing that.

[mesh control]

Add a fair amount of anti-intellectualism on top of that, too.


I don't know about the rest of the world, but a fair amount of people here would have happily stayed in the cave.

[antron]

Add a fair amount of anti-intellectualism on top of that, too.


I don't know about the rest of the world, but a fair amount of people here would have happily stayed in the cave.

and why not? they're just passing time until the rapture.

[BulletMagnet]

Saw this a few minutes ago and thought of this thread.

[Friendly]

Saw this a few minutes ago and thought of this thread.

Huh? I think you meant to post it in the other one.

[BulletMagnet]

Heh, can't argue that notion, I suppose...though it would require a thread title edit.

PLEASE VOTE...OR ELSE!

[BryanM]

If you don't all pull in the same direction, you'll barely move.

This is why secession would be best for everyone.

Or well, I guess when Texas flips over to sanity.

[mesh control]

Uh huh.

[BulletMagnet]

I wonder if that's the same guy who did that LOL-worthy equestrian painting of Bush holding bin Laden's severed head.

[Ed Oscuro]

Uh huh.

oh my god Obama uses a desk as his footstool

I can't believe this

/me foams at the mouth after viewing this OBAMANATION

[mesh control]

The repeal don't ask don't tell caption is a personal favorite.

[antron]

there used to be a site with alternate mouseover text to this guys paintings that was pretty funny. I with I could find it now.

oh here it is:
http://www.shortpacked.com/McNaughton%20Fine%20Art.htm

[mesh control]

That hit the spot.

And this for dessert.