Resident Evil 6 - Better than Resident Evil 5?

[Strider77]

Yeah I really enjoyed 5 also... played many a times by myself and with a buddy.

[replayme]

Some people have been criticising the game's focus on multi-player co-op, and saying that the one player campaign seems broken if the other player is controlled by the AI. I guess they just haven't played games like Left 4 Dead which are also extremely hollow affairs if the player doesn't have an internet connection.

RE (now) is best enjoyed with other people. That's not a case of broken game design, but players having broken-ass wallets. Nobody complains about Apple and their extortionate prices - especially in reference to iPhone IOS games, so I don't see why players complain about getting a lesser experience because thry don't have, or don't want, the internet.

Some gamers just need to get with the program, or shut up and go back to their speccys. Likewise, there will always be games like RE 1-3 which will help them to rekindle their nostalgia. As for me, I only ever really stepped on to the RE boat once the franchise jettisoned the horror and started focusing on the action.

Maybe RE 7 will be the game that will alienate me too. In the meantime however, I'm enjoying RE's emphasis on third-person action adventure, and look forward to what RE 6 has to offer me when I get round to playing it tomorrow/Thursday (although Friday might be the only day when I can realistically spend any real time with it).

[trap15]

Aaaaand that opinion is, to put it simply, wrong. Resident Evil was never about the action really. If you want to play an action game, go play one; don't poison Resident Evil because you didn't like it. Many many people liked the survival horror ones (myself included), and hate that the series has become just another generic action game.

Also your opinion of "hurrdurr it's a MP game now, if you don't like it fuck off" is also wrong. You're on a forum dedicated to a single player genre, and you criticize those who would prefer to play single player? I don't even know how you thought that.

[replayme]

RE 5 sold a bucketload because of its heavy emphasis on action.

I doubt the franchise would still be raking in the interest from mainstream gamers if it decided to keep its setting in some dis-used mansion. Static camera angles worked then because of a technological necessity. They don't work now.

You talk about people like me poisoning the franchise, but if it wasn't people like me, then the franchise would have been dead in the water years ago. It would have been in the same state where shmups are right now, which probably explains why companies like Cave are struggling so much, and why a "sell-out" game like Sine Mora raked in the numbers (and the cash).

[KAI]

Sometimes you can satisfy the masses whit the cheapest thing.

[Despatche]

you have good points but how you arrive at the points are flawed. whether this invalidates them is anyone's guess.

re4 is your paradigm shift. at that point resident evil stopped being what it was and became something different. and i'm not going to say it's better or worse, because most people love re4 as much as the older games. but i will say that those "unnecessary static camera angles" have become a part of the "old resident evil" and there are people that just want another such game. (as you can see, there's no point in arguing for or against co-op.)

cave is doing poorly because the jp economy is more of a wreck now than ever before. they actually have plans that aren't just shmups and those plans are working! the only reason sine mora is getting anywhere is because it seems "fresh" (whether it is or not) and everyone just compares it to ikaruga. what they don't understand is that ikaruga is a much better game and that sine mora should be compared to the likes of soldner x instead (and i'm not saying that game is bad, because the first one's alright).

[TransatlanticFoe]

Some people have been criticising the game's focus on multi-player co-op, and saying that the one player campaign seems broken if the other player is controlled by the AI. I guess they just haven't played games like Left 4 Dead which are also extremely hollow affairs if the player doesn't have an internet connection.

RE (now) is best enjoyed with other people. That's not a case of broken game design, but players having broken-ass wallets. Nobody complains about Apple and their extortionate prices - especially in reference to iPhone IOS games, so I don't see why players complain about getting a lesser experience because thry don't have, or don't want, the internet.

Some gamers just need to get with the program, or shut up and go back to their speccys. Likewise, there will always be games like RE 1-3 which will help them to rekindle their nostalgia. As for me, I only ever really stepped on to the RE boat once the franchise jettisoned the horror and started focusing on the action.

Maybe RE 7 will be the game that will alienate me too. In the meantime however, I'm enjoying RE's emphasis on third-person action adventure, and look forward to what RE 6 has to offer me when I get round to playing it tomorrow/Thursday (although Friday might be the only day when I can realistically spend any real time with it).

Eh? So you should only be able to enjoy a game when someone else wants to play with you? Players want a single player game, because that shit won't get turned off (yet) like online services and multiplayer servers. So yeah, it's only fair that solo players have a shot at the same experience.

The problem with 5 wasn't so much the presence of the AI, but how dumb it was half the time. Sure it was great at managing ammo for the submachine gun, but it also healed you ALL the time and frequently ignored objective points in favour of fighting. Less broken partner AI = more enjoyable. It brought frustration with little benefit, so yeah people will moan about it.

Everything's a third person shooter affair these days - so why shouldn't Resi fans be able to lament the franchise sticking to that path? It'll probably be a fun game but I won't find out until who knows when because as far as I can tell there still isn't a PC release date.

[replayme]

The AI in L4D is even more broken. Trust me on that... You can't enjoy it as a single-player game. The AI is just far too dumb.

RE 4 was a necessity. Luddites and traditionalists need to accept that. RE 5 continued the tradition, whilst RE 6 is just a continuation of what has gone on before. It's an evolution and an iteration of something that I already enjoy. In fact, I'm just going to treat RE 6 like glorified DLC - it's just giving me more of what I already want.

[mesh control]

RE (now) is best enjoyed with other people. That's not a case of broken game design, but players having broken-ass wallets.

...

The AI in L4D is even more broken. Trust me on that...

You can't enjoy it as a single-player game. The AI is far too dumb for that.

[drauch]

RE 4 was a necessity. Luddites and traditionalists need to accept that. RE 5 continued the tradition, whilst RE 6 is just a continuation of what has gone on before.

what.

[Hagane]

Resident Evil was never about the action really.

Yeah Resident Evil was about crappy controls and awful puzzles. Oh, and the horror and atmosphere, of course!

On RE5's AI. The only bad thing about Sheva is that she wastes healing items, something solved by having those items yourself. As for ammo, if you feel she wastes it just give her a sniper. She has near 100% accuracy with that and the slower fire rate ensures she won't run out of ammo. But complaining is always much easier than figuring out solutions.

On the current path RE is following: you could retain a survival horror feel while still going the action path by doing what RE5 was supposed to do (and did to an extent in the PC version in mercenaries): overwhelm you with with hordes of zombies, so you have to balance the killing with the running away. But current gen consoles aren't powerful enough to put that many enemies on screen (with that graphic detail) at the same time.

[trap15]

Yeah Resident Evil was about crappy controls and awful puzzles. Oh, and the horror and atmosphere, of course!

Now you're getting it!

[dan76]

On RE5's AI. The only bad thing about Sheva is that she wastes healing items, something solved by having those items yourself. As for ammo, if you feel she wastes it just give her a sniper. She has near 100% accuracy with that and the slower fire rate ensures she won't run out of ammo. But complaining is always much easier than figuring out solutions.

The worst thing about Sheva was that she would get into trouble way more than Ashley in 4. At least with Ashley you knew where she was. Also, what fun is there to be had in watching an AI partner kill enemies? Where is the skill involved. How is that a game? I don't want to watch it, I want to play it.

The partner AI is better in 6 (unfortunately Lone Wolf doesn't stop you partner firing at enemies - some douche lied on the internet, who knew). You don't have to rescue them so other than occasionally getting in the way they're not much bother.

I never liked 5 much so 6 is already better for me, based mainly on the setting and atmosphere. At least with this game there is an attempt at spookiness - and puzzles!

Almost through Leon's chapter 2 - might have made a mistake starting out on veteran.. I've died a hell of a lot.

[EmperorIng]

I'd say the original trilogy of RE was a lot more about giving you limited ammo to deal with large numbers of enemies (at least in RE2 and RE3). The tension came from how you could easily (if you didn't know what you were doing) run out of ammo and save items when there were still huge swarms of zombies (or worse) around.

A classic RE feeling is that "Oh fuck" you begin to feel as you just put 8 rounds of a pistol into a zombie when there are still 3 more shambling in the room. That "oh fuck" is the realization that you will not have enough ammo down the line if every single enemy takes so much to kill. The controls coach you to avoid getting close and personal to zombies, because you simply don't have the reaction time to avoid them grabbing you. And once your health gets down into the yellow and red, avoiding the zombies just gets that much harder.

Mind you, my first RE game was RE4 - only afterward did I go to the first entries, and I had a blast. RE2 is currently my favorite of the series.

The inventory management of the first games were an incredibly refreshing change of pace, and when I played them years previous, it seemed to me novel, growing up in the game environment I did, that the game would punish you for trying to kill every single enemy in the game! If RE4 didn't have ammo pickups, just imagine how tense it could have been! The game would have needed a huge overhaul, but it's an interesting thing to think about - great controls and atmosphere + survival-horror item management.

As for the story - the story was always a goofy take on b-movie horror, amplified by hilarious voice-acting (Mikami loves bad English VA). The plot of RE started getting bad when they started taking it seriously!

Also, I'm having a hearty lol at replayme's militant posts. the "GET WITH THE PROGRAM" mindset is a pretty laughable defense in and of itself, especially when you start acting like a douche and call everyone (who is not you) "luddites." Here's a pointer: when you get old enough you'll realize that people may and may not enjoy whatever they fancy. If you really cared about being "hip" and "with it" you wouldn't even have given Resident Evil the time of day.

My gripe with action-oriented REs are that as action games (going by RE5) they aren't especially good ones. The loss of the item-management, claustrophobia, and dread make the series lose a crucial part of its identity. Even the action-packed RE4 had plenty of memorable set-pieces and tense moments (like the cabin attack, or castle sewer bit) - those were actually parts I preferred, as opposed to the overly bombastic gigante fights, which get old after the 15 or so playthroughs of RE4.

From the reviews I've read of RE6, the series has an incredibly major identity-crisis on its hands, and if the quick-time events are anything like what they write about, I want to stay far away. I hated the quick-time events in RE4. Hated them in RE5. Don't know why they keep on putting them in. The camera looks awful as well. Everyone I know who has played the game complains about the constant tripping over dead bodies (why even include this?) due to camera issues. That does not sound like good game design.

Again, I'll reiterate and say that this game in no way appeals to me, and I can continue hoping for a "return to form" for the franchise.

[Ed Oscuro]

L4D's AI partners isn't good enough for expert or survival runs, sure. You're also not likely to squeak out the Nothing Special or Untouchables achievements with them. I did better playing with some random Brazilian fellow recently, because a real person will get some high-level concepts the AI won't.

All that being said, I bought the game to play essentially single-player (wow, that was back when Rob was still around, too...) and I had fun with it. They've ported most of the content to L4D2 and yet I have L4D installed at the moment instead.

A classic RE feeling is that "Oh fuck" you begin to feel as you just put 8 rounds of a pistol into a zombie when there are still 3 more shambling in the room.

The "Oh Fuck" in RE6 is the realization that you're going to have to melee the next 50 zombies.

Yeah, stuff like getting corpse-juggled (I never thought I'd write that about a game) or even APC juggled (the beginning of Chris' game) just makes no sense.

From what I saw of RE6, its environments were hastily slapped together. Apparently there is good stuff in Leon's game later on, but the demo area looks slapped together and bad.

[replayme]

Also, I'm having a hearty lol at replayme's militant posts. the "GET WITH THE PROGRAM" mindset is a pretty laughable defense in and of itself, especially when you start acting like a douche and call everyone (who is not you) "luddites." Here's a pointer: when you get old enough you'll realize that people may and may not enjoy whatever they fancy. If you really cared about being "hip" and "with it" you wouldn't even have given Resident Evil the time of day.

My gripe with action-oriented REs are that as action games (going by RE5) they aren't especially good ones. The loss of the item-management, claustrophobia, and dread make the series lose a crucial part of its identity. Even the action-packed RE4 had plenty of memorable set-pieces and tense moments (like the cabin attack, or castle sewer bit) - those were actually parts I preferred, as opposed to the overly bombastic gigante fights, which get old after the 15 or so playthroughs of RE4.

From the reviews I've read of RE6, the series has an incredibly major identity-crisis on its hands, and if the quick-time events are anything like what they write about, I want to stay far away. I hated the quick-time events in RE4. Hated them in RE5. Don't know why they keep on putting them in. The camera looks awful as well. Everyone I know who has played the game complains about the constant tripping over dead bodies (why even include this?) due to camera issues. That does not sound like good game design.

Again, I'll reiterate and say that this game in no way appeals to me, and I can continue hoping for a "return to form" for the franchise.

I don't give a shit about what RE "purists" think. That's like trying to defend Sensible Soccer or Kick Off in the face of PES or FIFA - great games though they were, there's a reason as to why they're not around anymore. They reached their sell-by date once the tech became capable of outputting a more realistic footy game.

Same with RE: the series that so many traditionalists hold on to, died with RE4. I've never really cared for RE - even when it tried to have all those flamboyant and OTT cut-scenes for RE: CV. The series has just never appealed to me. Whilst I agree with you on RE 2 being a very good game - it was also a more action oriented affair as opposed to RE 1.

If I wanted to be hip, I wouldn't have defended RE 5 or RE 6 after the games had been released and had been trashed by pretty much everyone. I liked RE 5. More so than L4D in single-player. And attempting to defend 1-player L4D is akin to defending 50hz games during the 16bit era. They were functional, but one was sorely missing out on an infinitely more grand experience.

I see that you've already made your mind up, as have I. You sound like the kind of person who preferred FIFA during its isometric era in the age of the Sega Megadrive. As for me, I appreciate RE for what it has evolved in to. It's now the action-oriented Aliens (done by James Cameron), as opposed to being the claustrophobic experience that Alien (by R Scott) was. And I certainly wouldn't describe the Alien franchise as having lost its identity once it jettisoned claustrophobia and the feeling of dread. Aliens was great!

Oh, and I never liked Alien that much either - good, but over-rated imho. And don't get me started on the abomination that is otherwise known as Prometheus.

[drauch]

So you don't like horror. Okay. And your "Alien(s)" analogy is terrible, because no one gave a shit about 3 and Alien Resurrection.

[EmperorIng]

You were close - I'm the person that never played a single FIFA game nor want to because sports games suck. Insert coin, try again.

And I do prefer Alien to Aliens, but we could have a discussion on that some other time. Love both movies (even like Alien3 for its atmosphere and music). While you are right that the series didn't lose its identity (only started to in the third movie, and full on went to shit by Resurrection - which was action movie done in the wrong way), I felt it cheapened the xenomorphs by making them really easy to kill (much like how Predator 2's Predator is such a fucking loser compared to the first one - and don't get me started on Predators). That's better though, than the cheapening of the Space Jockeys done in Prometheus. Rewatching Alien made me a little bummed because the cool mystery behind the thing was gone because now we have bald space men that are actually Jesus.

I think it's odd that you say RE2 is a good game yet you never cared for the series. Unless you played RE2, said "man this is a good game" and just like, forgot about the series until RE4. I agree that RE2 is much more action-packed - each game of the original trilogy has its own feel and style, indicative of Mikami trying out different things (RE1: Horror b-movie, RE2: bombastic hollywood action, RE3: fleeing a powerful stalker), and each are very good games in their own right, with tight design and controls. People are definitely free to dislike the older RE games because they have off-kilter and peculiar design but I will argue that they are very good games and very well-designed games.

The second half of every RE game has always been action, as well (especially RE2!), because at that point the game throws every wacky enemy at you and gives you a shitton of ammo, making it all fun. But it follows from the progression of the game - the cathartic moment of finally being able to fight back against the game's enemies is all the better when remembering those tense, nail-biting moments. I would say that those are the best moments the series had to offer.

I am a bit curious as to your continual mentions of L4D single-player. Since I've never played the game I can't comment, but if you are saying that single-player games aren't "the full experience" then I think that's a seriously mistaken perspective. Remember the tacked on multiplayer of Metroid Prime 2: Echoes (my namesake)? Remember the completely multiplayer-focused and forgettable Metroid Prime: Hunters?

[Skykid]

RE4. Best thing ever.

Just saying. Again.

[Ed Oscuro]

Quite possibly the "original" RE formula reached its peak with - well, RE2, Code Veronica, REmake, Zero, and the first two Dino Crisis games. (I don't know what I think about RE3 yet.) That's a pretty good run. RE4 was definitely a change for good. It's an action game, is focused on action, but is a specific type of action. The difficulty level really isn't that high but it does a specific kind of thing well, and the major problem with the current game is that it is trying to be more-action oriented, but simply not pulling it off. If this game succeeded in doing what it had set out to - I think the complaints would not have surfaced. As it stands the traditionalist vs. RE4 player "debate" is just a red herring from the real source of the series' revived troubles. Kind of like talking up FIFA or Alien/s, which have nothing to do with anything (ditto L4D single player - a choice made by many because they tired of playing with shrill, whiny babies online).

[Khan]

Ive played most of the RE's as and when they have been released and with the exception of the gun survivor series ive completed most of them. My main gripe with the series has always been the lack true horror feeling I wanted to be scared out of my pants but unfortunately after RE4 they have shifted the focus of the game into an action title. I still yearn for a Resident evil with the survival horror element being the main focus imo maybe when Capcom get done milking the series and people get tired of this new formula we will get to see oldskool RE.

[evil_ash_xero]

This game is ass.

[Ruldra]

Initial Shipments of "Resident Evil 6" Surpass 4.5 Million!

- Shipments set a new record for Capcom backed by the strong worldwide response to this high-quality title that offers the best gaming experience possible -

http://www.capcom.co.jp/ir/english/news ... 21004.html

Massive bomba incoming?

I'll give the demo a try tomorrow, I'm curious to see what the backlash is all about.

[UnscathedFlyingObject]

I expect the rather average reviews to have an impact on sales and the game will drop in price in a couple months. Then, I'll buy it for cheap and see if it is just naysayers who are butt hurt 'cause it's not like the old RE games and give the game a bad review. It could be less than great, but I seriously doubt it's a 4 out of 10 game. I'm not getting my hopes up with this one, so maybe I'll be surprised.

The only original-style RE game I'd consider a horror game would be REmake. REmake on hard is a bitch to beat due to the very limited supplies. All the others, I don't really have trouble beating on any difficulty and usually kill almost everything in sight. RE has ALWAYS been more action than horror! I think RE5 was a disappointment but it has nothing to do with it being more action oriented. I liked it when playing with others, but I can't stand the game when playing by myself due to Sheva AI and the single player campaign didn't feel as good as RE4.

[Friendly]

Actually having played the game (Leon's campaign) for a few hours yesterday I really don't think it's bad. On the contrary, I quite enjoyed it. Yes, it's not your Resident Evil of old; it's no "survival horror". Yes, there are some problems. Yes, the story is nothing to write home about, but surely you didn't expect Shakespeare? It feels much improved over Resident Evil 5, especially the way items are handled and the way you control your player. The A.I. of your partner (and other NPCs) is almost always smart and she doesn't get in the way, levels and zombies are varied, graphics are good. It's entertaining popcorn-action. As such, the game totally succeeds. Maybe they should have included a directly selectable hardcore-mode with unforgiving enemies and very little ammo and health, so the butthurt nostalgics wouldn't be quite as butthurt.

My suggestion: Avoid any further spoilers. Ignore the bad reviews. Don't play the demo. If you are worried that it won't provide $60 USD worth of entertainment, rent the game and give it a try (play beyond the scripted beginning). You may find that you actually like it.

[Ed Oscuro]

Don't play the demo.

Do you bel~ieve in maaagic

[dan76]

Slight SPOILER as what foillows is an opinion of one of the campaigns.




Having finished one of the campaigns my opinion of 6 being better than 5 has taken a real dent.

Christ the scripting. There's isn't actually that much to play. When it lets you play it ok, good even, but it doesn't want to do that. I think this is where the comparisons with CoD are coming from, as you can only do one thing, follow the narrative at a set pace.

Within Chapter 2 of Leon I was loving it, forgiving the game of it's many faults. There is stuff in this part that were it to control like 4 / 5 and be single player would exceed 4 in terms of setting and enemies. Unfortunately it doesn't really maintain that level of RE, it doesn't want to. That's the frustrating thing, there is potential here for a great game, it's just that what Capcom thinks is a great game isn't what I think is a great game (!) - who'd have thought.

Mercenaries is good though -

[SuperSoaker360]

After playing through Leon's campaign, I want RE2 Remake more than ever now.

[Friendly]

Having finished one of the campaigns my opinion of 6 being better than 5 has taken a real dent.

Finished Leon's campaign as well. It's a mixed bag. Some levels are really fun, others are mediocre. The most annoying part was the never-ending boss fight.
I felt more positive about the game around chapter 2-3 than after finishing the campaign. I would have appreciated one or two larger levels with free roaming and more complex tasks to solve, and slightly higher difficulty. Resident Evil 6 feels like it could have been much more with a better director.
Anyway, it's not the total bomb that some would have you believe. It's just not great. Much like an enjoyable summer popcorn movie. So far I'd say it's a 6 or 7 out of 10.
I'll check out the other campaigns later.

[replayme]

Started playing this today. Initial impressions: too many QTE moments (which take away from the immersion and the experience), and too much melee combat.

Still liking the game though. Even if the quality isn't meant to be consiatently high throughout the campaigns. And having said that, I don't really understand all the negativity and hate that the game's been getting.

Capcom should have marked the birth of RE's new direction by proclaiming it to be a new IP and calling it something else. But hey, what do I know. I'm not a fanboy. I just like good action games.