CAVE staff quitting

[Tokyo-J]

This is non news.

Obviously there was a difference in opinion as they cannot make their minds up what they are doing.

One day its 360 , then IOS , windows phone , vita , android, oh wait nevermind on Vita , 360 , oh nevermind on 360, wait 360 again , IOS lets milk them for extra modes , type x , no more xbox 360 , wait more xbox 360.

The company is not streamlined correctly. The fact they showed Dangun on Xbox 360 and then never released it proves they don't know what the hell they are doing.

They should just open polls on forums and let fans vote on which games to bring out like they did before. I thought their stuff sold well online. And the Xbox 360 titles usually sell out within a few months although they have a limited print.They should focus on merchandise again. And porting some of their legacy titles.

No one gives a crap about cell phone games or social crap. That ship has sailed. Time to get back to the Bread and Butter. Arcade titles and ports of them to as many systems as possible.

Time to make some damn money Cave!

[BIL]

The CAVE is collapsing, everyone man the Esteboats.

[Cuilan]

They should just open polls on forums and let fans vote on which games to bring out like they did before.

I agree with everything except this. They shouldn't pay attention to anything other than what their fans actually bought (and didn't buy):

"Hmm, what sold the most for us? Deathsmiles 1 and 2, Mushihime-sama Futari, and Espgaluda 2? Ok, let's make more games like those. So, what sold the worst for us? Instant Brain and all the games Yagawa was heavily involved with? Ok, let's not throw away any more of our money on that stuff."

[SuperSoaker360]

Windia's onahole will blow their profits through the roof.

More like Casper's.

[shmuppyLove]

Time to over-react and find a new hobby

(╯°□°）╯︵ sdɯnɥs

[Obiwanshinobi]

I wonder why 1vs1 fighting games are still pretty big all around.

[BIL]

Because you can't credit-feed a better player, obv. "Tokido's fun for what he is but you'll have beaten him in thirty minutes, rental material only."

[KAI]

So, what sold the worst for us? Instant Brain and all the games Yagawa was heavily involved with? Ok, let's not throw away any more of our money on that stuff."

lol

[Obiwanshinobi]

Hm... It's not that people out there wouldn't buy 2D shooters, but the idea of buing such games on discs at full prices seems pretty outlandish to most, whereas fighting games released this way still don't raise many eybrows on the internet.

Because you can't credit-feed a better player, obv. "Tokido's fun for what he is but you'll have beaten him in thirty minutes, rental material only."

I've been playing some Saturn shmups lately, credit-feeding happily, and with the amount of credits given to me I wasn't able to beat any of them in under an hour. Unlike Ibara that comes with infinite continues...
I'd say S&P2 got the balance right. 1cc is probably of about typical arcade game length, but I doubt even fairly skilled gamers found the game too short (or too easy for that matter) despite the infinite continues.
It can't be that difficult to make sure everybody will get their money's worth.

[trap15]

Exactly how I'm seeing it too, Cuilan.

[BIL]

Hm... It's not that people out there wouldn't buy 2D shooters, but the idea of buing such games on discs at full prices seems pretty outlandish to most, whereas fighting games released this way still don't raise many eybrows on the internet.

Because you can't beat a fighting game in thirty minutes.

[Marc]

Hm... It's not that people out there wouldn't buy 2D shooters, but the idea of buing such games on discs at full prices seems pretty outlandish to most, whereas fighting games released this way still don't raise many eybrows on the internet.

Because you can't beat a fighting game in thirty minutes.

Sadly, this is absoultely correct, at least to a mainstream reviewers eyes.

[shmuppyLove]

Because you can't beat a fighting game in thirty minutes.

lol fighting games

[trap15]

To be completely honest, I think a little thing that would make a big difference is to not give infinite credits out of the box. For some reason, people would prefer being forced to take the challenge rather that doing it on their own. Basically, THEY NEED TO DO WHAT IKARUGA DID.

[KAI]

The answer: Cave+ZUN+3D HD backgrounds

[IseeThings]

To be completely honest, I think a little thing that would make a big difference is to not give infinite credits out of the box. For some reason, people would prefer being forced to take the challenge rather that doing it on their own. Basically, THEY NEED TO DO WHAT IKARUGA DID.

Ikaruga looked drop dead gorgeous tho, and that, as I've said before, is half the battle. It was also family friendly and entirely inoffensive, something which boobs-everywhere games are not.

SDOJ 360 might not even make it out if things are as grim as this picture paints, for all the talk of it being a swansong it isn't *cheap* to get any game to market these days because you're having to throw money at the likes of Microsoft at every corner.

[Obiwanshinobi]

Because you can't beat a fighting game in thirty minutes.

Some time ago I started Soulcalibur II as Link for kicks and what do you know, finished it in about thirty minutes. Easily the shortest game (in a sense) I've ever bought as a disc.
Well, maybe Psyvariar was even shorter in this sense.

[Aliquantic]

Playing fighting games in singleplayer only is as wrong as infinite credit feeding a shmup and calling it a clear But they're completely different from shmups, and with a much clearer appeal factor.

I do wonder why the 1vs1 shmups (both arcade and doujin games) haven't really taken off, though... little visibility and no established scene, I guess.

[Op Intensify]

To be completely honest, I think a little thing that would make a big difference is to not give infinite credits out of the box. For some reason, people would prefer being forced to take the challenge rather that doing it on their own. Basically, THEY NEED TO DO WHAT IKARUGA DID.

I think Ginga Force really has the right idea for keeping players who would normally credit feed through Cave games interested.

The game's story mode is much longer than a typical modern shmup's. You earn credits through your performance that can be used to buy parts and upgrade your ship between stages. Players can feel a real sense of progression that extends beyond the overly abstract concept of scoring. You can also save between these stages. I would say it's very likely that the game will not allow on-the-spot continuing, otherwise all this would be rendered moot. If I was designing it, I would use checkpoints and give a small number of continues for each stage. And when they run out, you'd have to reload your last save.

(Eschatos let you continue on the spot, but you at least had to unlock credits, which took quite some time.)

Basically, I want shmup ports to be more like Metal Slug 3 (original Xbox), if not quite that brutally unforgiving.

Playing fighting games in singleplayer only is as wrong as infinite credit feeding a shmup and calling it a clear

Yeah, until the advent of netplay, 2D fighting games were regularly slammed by the mainstream press for most of the same reasons shmups are.

[IseeThings]

Yeah, until the advent of netplay, 2D fighting games were regularly slammed by the mainstream press for most of the same reasons shmups are.

once the PSX sprouted up pretty much all *arcade* style games (start at the start, simple control systems, no saves, can be played through in a 30min-2hr session) started getting slammed by mainstream press.

if anything the 2D fighters were the only real exception because they were still seen as social games, to get your mates over and play and a good number were considered iconic even in the PSX / Saturn era (the Capcom ports)

[BIL]

Some time ago I started Soulcalibur II as Link for kicks and what do you know, finished it in about thirty minutes. Easily the shortest game (in a sense) I've ever bought as a disc.
Well, maybe Psyvariar was even shorter in this sense.

Oh, lord. I thought this was obvious enough. I'm sure people who consider fighting games "beaten" when the singleplayer stuff is done raise plenty of eyebrows at the idea of retail disc releases, too.

[Op Intensify]

Soul Calibur II had a much longer single-player quest mode that was actually pretty awesome, though. Lots of crazy win conditions and stage effects.

[BIL]

Singleplayer is still retardedly far from the basis of the genre's popularity. Shooters have been entirely about singleplayer (read: score competition) for years.

lol fighting games

More like KAISER KNUCKLE

[O. Van Bruce]

Singleplayer is still retardedly far from the basis of the genre's popularity. Shooters have been entirely about singleplayer (read: score competition) for years.

lol fighting games

More like KAISER KNUCKLE

We need a paradigm shift then...

[BIL]

I don't.

[IseeThings]

Singleplayer is still retardedly far from the basis of the genre's popularity. Shooters have been entirely about singleplayer (read: score competition) for years.

Exactly, 2D fighters are competitive sports games which game with enough complexity in their original arcade form (all the secret moves, combos, timing requirements etc.) that they survived.

The pure 2D scrolling beat 'em up faired less well in the 32-bit era because they were closer to the single player experience of shooters.


Shmups as a sport would be more along the lines of something like shot put or javelin, where really you're only ever trying to outdo a number, not outwit another player.

[O. Van Bruce]

a Dynamic AI that changes the patterns and the way enemies behave to a more efficient way? something like an upgraded Arrange A from DFK?

[Op Intensify]

something like an upgraded Arrange A from DFK?

Aren't you thinking of Arrange B?

[O. Van Bruce]

something like an upgraded Arrange A from DFK?

Aren't you thinking of Arrange B?

asdasdasasd...

I allways end up confussing then

developing the idea a bit more... what could be done it's an AI that recopillates data about the player behaviour and set him traps accordingly

[antime]

Ikaruga looked drop dead gorgeous tho, and that, as I've said before, is half the battle. It was also family friendly and entirely inoffensive, something which boobs-everywhere games are not.

Ikaruga's base mechanic was also very simple to understand, and helped starting players progress through the levels. Shelling out fourty bucks just to be stuck on the first level is asking a lot.