Why I can't stand JRPGs anymore.

[Despatche]

Go away, moozooh.

[O. Van Bruce]

Well... I used to dislike RPG's and one day I took an arrow in the knee.

Now I'm playing this and Yggdra Union. I'm planing to play Final Fantasy 8 and 7 and some more... it's a whole new genre for me so I don't have any nostalgia related problems but... what should I be aware when playing JRPG's?

[ryu]

what should I be aware when playing JRPG's?

stay away from games made by gust. atelier iris i can actually recommend, but everything else by them i've seen or played is (more or less) utter shit.

[burgerkingdiamond]

If that's the case Japanese kids must be seriously fucked up.

You have no idea. I find these kids over here bewildering in their tastes, hobbies, and what they do when they think no ones looking. I've had a good chance lately to meet and hang-out with some in taking my boy to different playgrounds, shopping mall arcades, and community centers. Any yes - the high school kids are still frequenting these places.

haaha. It's funny that after 7 years or however long over there you're still experiencing culture shock. I wonder if it ever goes away..

[rancor]

I really don't think it ever will.. haha.. Its just far too different here from how most of us were brought up. I'm still surprised at things on an almost daily basis.

[O. Van Bruce]

what should I be aware when playing JRPG's?

stay away from games made by gust. atelier iris i can actually recommend, but everything else by them i've seen or played is (more or less) utter shit.

Incoming dose of Moeblob:





And here I was considering buying a second-hand PS3 to play this games... Go ahead and hate me/despise me, I don't have spaghettis on my pockets

I'll probably buy it anyway

[mrsmiley381]

Neptunia is the definition of Poe's Law. I seriously can't figure out if it's actually creepy or just one big joke.

[Op Intensify]

stay away from games made by gust. atelier iris i can actually recommend, but everything else by them i've seen or played is (more or less) utter shit.

Don't forget Idea Factory. HG101's review of Agarest War here sums up everything that's horribly wrong about them. And that includes Compile Heart, who are second-party to them.

[RNGmaster]

Neptunia is the definition of Poe's Law. I seriously can't figure out if it's actually creepy or just one big joke.

Unfortunately I am pretty sure it has a fair number of unironic fans. Gust certainly spent a lot of effort in rendering panty shots :V

[professor ganson]

Don't forget Idea Factory. HG101's review of Agarest War here sums up everything that's horribly wrong about them. And that includes Compile Heart, who are second-party to them.

Hilarious review! I have one of these Agarest games lying around, and now I'm sure I should trade it in. I recall trying the tutorial and the art was ok but nothing exciting enough to get me beyond the tutorial.

[BulletMagnet]

stay away from games made by gust. atelier iris i can actually recommend, but everything else by them i've seen or played is (more or less) utter shit.

I wouldn't be quite so hard on 'em: the Mana Khemia games (technically "Project A" games themselves) are good too, and despite the fan servicey-ness I also generally enjoyed the Ar Tonelico series too (though unfortunately the final game is the worst of the bunch). That said, most of the "Atelier" games (aside from Iris) are at least as much "simulation" games as RPGs, so they definitely won't appeal to everyone, but I'd argue that they have a unique appeal to them in that regard.

Oh, and for the record, Gust didn't make Neptunia, though they did lend an anthromorphized character to it (as did a hunk of other developers, Cave being one of them).

[Op Intensify]

The Neptunia games are handled by Compile Heart, who stopped having anything meaningful to do with the original Compile after Moo Nitani left early on. They did get one Puyo-esque arcade puzzle game made; which was localized as Octopuzzle here.

Wasn't Pochi & Nyaa also made by ex-Compile staff?

[Cuilan]

They did get one Puyo-esque arcade puzzle game made; which was localized as Octopuzzle here.

It was called Octomania here in the US, if I remember correctly.

Wasn't Pochi & Nyaa also made by ex-Compile staff?

Yes, it was.

[Remembrance]

My gripe?

When I look at a Cave game on Amazon, and proceed to get flooded with recommendations for various things from the last ten or so posts above.

[Ganelon]

Yeah, in the US, all games with anime visuals, whether RPG (Ys), fighting (KOF), shooter (Cave shooters), or anything else (Phoenix Wright), are purchased by roughly the same pool of people. Unfortunately, it really is a fairly limited audience. The days when Gundam Battle Assault 2 could sell 150k copies are over.

Idea Factory (and its subsidiary Compile Heart) has always been a bad source for games. I think US gamers finally get that too. They do seem to have a loyal audience still supporting them and I'm happy for them but I certainly don't understand how they've stayed alive all these years. I still buy most of their localized games though; I figure the niche market that they're part of (which pretty much includes all the anime style games mentioned above) is worth supporting.

As for companies that haven't lost focus, Falcom still has a good idea of what a JRPG should really feel like while doing its best to keep some semblance of sprite visuals and refrain from using loli art (although there have certainly been compromises necessary). Sadly, the Legend of Heroes: Trails in the Sky experiment showed that even with serious anime visuals (again, as much as possible while still appealing to modern Japan's unfathomable lust for young girls), there's not enough of an audience for a relatively unknown (in the US) game with anime visuals.

[Cuilan]

My gripe?

When I look at a Cave game on Amazon, and proceed to get flooded with recommendations for various things from the last ten or so posts above.

[Specineff]

Hot Pockets? Wow. Will it recommend anything related to Tuna Sashimi after searching for anything Darius?

[iammud]

Now I'm hungry for sashimi.

[Jeneki]

"These cheap thrills might be more enticing if gamers could download them for cheap, but right now Hot Pockets costs the same as The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim."

[BulletMagnet]

Sadly, the Legend of Heroes: Trails in the Sky experiment showed that even with serious anime visuals (again, as much as possible while still appealing to modern Japan's unfathomable lust for young girls), there's not enough of an audience for a relatively unknown (in the US) game with anime visuals.

I'd hesitate to assume how much the visual style had to do with the sales figures for that one...my first thought whenever it comes to low sales of a PSP game in the West at this stage of the game is that, well, it's a PSP game in the West at this stage of the game.

(I didn't buy the game myself despite generally liking Falcom and owning all of Xseed's recent Ys releases for the system, but in my case it was as I mentioned some posts back: even if it's well made, as Trails seemingly was, it still came off as too "generic" an RPG to grab my attention very effectively, though a number of people around here gave me a rap on the knuckles the last time I said that, heh).

[Formless God]

what should I be aware when playing JRPG's?

Suuure a few FFs shouldn't hurt if you have plenty of time to burn. I'd recommend a SNES FF over FF7 though, that game is easy as piss. After you're done,
- Play anything developed by Atlus Japan (Atlus USA has a tendency of localizing irrelevant JRPGs) and never look back again. Play their PS2 SMT games. Play the Devil Survivor games - the combat is naturally better. Seeing as you've already got P3P, you should stay away from the rest of the Persona series.
- Fire Emblem.
- The Ys series is pretty good. Action-based games with bullet hell.
- The Last Remnant is an average but notable game. Decent combat, decent difficulty, crappy level design.
- One more Disgaea game. Just one more.

Lastly, stay away from those moeblob games and their devs. I myself don't have any problem with moeblob (because what I'm playing is a game you edgy manchildren out there; you know who you are). The problem is that the games actually also play like shit. And you could just get porn of Nepgear and Totori for free online anyway.

[burgerkingdiamond]

I remember Golden Sun for GBA being really addictive. That was almost 10 years ago or something though. I'm certain that it wouldn't grab me the same way now. And I wouldn't have the time for it anyway.

[Hagane]

Lunar, the Tales series, and I think Star Ocean did it before Grandia. Other RPGs that have SRPG-ish battle systems are The Last Remnant, Eternal Sonata, Princess Crown, The Last Story, Resonance of Fate, FFXII, and FFXIII/XIII-2.

Wasn't Lunar mostly a DQ like JRPG? I played it a long ago, I don't remember being able to move around the battlefield. Star Ocean was more of an action RPG, same with Tales of Phantasia. Princess Crown definitely isn't an SRPG, haven't played the rest though.

[shmuppyLove]

My gripe?

When I look at a Cave game on Amazon, and proceed to get flooded with recommendations for various things from the last ten or so posts above.

http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j113/ ... ockets.jpg

Too funny. I'm changing my sig.

shumps farm in-jokes ftw.

[BulletMagnet]

Wasn't Lunar mostly a DQ like JRPG? I played it a long ago, I don't remember being able to move around the battlefield.

You kinda could, at least in the PS1 remakes: you and the enemies started on opposite sides of the battlefield, but to hit them with a sword or other non-ranged physical attack you had to take positioning into account, i.e. they had to be close enough for the character to walk up and smack them or else they'd run out of steam on the way over (same went for enemies attacking you).

[Cuilan]

Wasn't Lunar mostly a DQ like JRPG? I played it a long ago, I don't remember being able to move around the battlefield. Star Ocean was more of an action RPG, same with Tales of Phantasia. Princess Crown definitely isn't an SRPG, haven't played the rest though.

In all the games I listed, positioning is important. Though it's true that some are turn-based and some aren't. As for Princess Crown, positioning is rather important for attacks and spell casting.

[Hagane]

Hmm, but it seems more like a limitation for characters rather than something you actively use for strategy. I don't really remember the game that well though so I'll leave it at that.

On Princess Crown, yeah I guess positioning is important but so it is in Super Turbo and that isn't an SRPG either

I'm talking about something more similar to turn based games such as Tactics Ogre / Fire Emblem when I say SRPG.

[Cuilan]

Hmm, but it seems more like a limitation for characters rather than something you actively use for strategy. I don't really remember the game that well though so I'll leave it at that.

I'm talking about something more similar to turn based games such as Tactics Ogre / Fire Emblem when I say SRPG.

Well, you did say RPGs with SRPG elements and mentioned positioning specifically. Since you used Grandia as your example, I decided to mention RPGs with battle systems that reminded me somewhat of Grandia along with others where positioning plays a major role.

On Princess Crown, yeah I guess positioning is important but so it is in Super Turbo and that isn't an SRPG either

I'd say that Princess Crown is a bit closer to an (S)RPG than it is to a fighting game, a traditional fighting game anyway.

[Ganelon]

All of the Lunar games (except the handheld versions before Harmony) feature auto-movement when attacking and selectable movement when defending. Moving around was important because not everyone could move far enough to attack enemies all the way across the screen and some attacks would hit in a straight line or in an area or that spot itself. Another strategy was that you could move a low HP character far away so that the enemy couldn't reach him. Granted, moving probably wasn't essential to beating the game, but it was an option. If you play Grandia after Lunar, one of the first things you'll realize is that the movement system is basically a more limited version of Lunar's (since you can only select from given spots when evade defending). Grandia's battle system is basically a mix of Lunar's movement and Final Fantasy's ATB.

Star Ocean 2 was released quite awhile after Grandia though so it's moot. Remember that Grandia was the SS's counter to FFVII. I've also never heard the terms "Princess Crown" and "SRPG" together. Normally, folks seem to accept the game as an ARPG with beat-em-up elements. It's hard to comment on tactical movement because so many RPGs have so many different variations of in-battle movement. You guys are on a dangerous slope arguing over this when plenty of RPGs with movement systems (e.g. Growlanser, The Legend of Heroes, Rhapsody, Lodoss Tou Senki, Live A Live) will lead you to draw a very grey line for what exactly is a traditional JRPG, an SRPG, and an ARPG. And we're not even talking about RPGs with multiple battle systems yet (e.g. The Legend of Xanadu, Hiryu no Ken, Sword of Vermilion).

[Blade]

It may be just me...but when it comes to Final Fantasy spinoffs...it seems like the plot gets worse while the bosses get harder.

FFX --Moderate Difficulty
FFX-2 --Crazy hard bosses, very bad plot

FFXIII --Moderate to Challenging
FFXIII-2 --WTF!!!!??? *throws controller at screen*

I'm kidding about the last one...but they are genuinely more challenging...which is sadly why I tend to like them more.