Just a low down, dirty rotten shame.

[JBC]

Man, alot of things in the gaming industry seem to be a shame lately. Just a low down, dirty rotten shame.

There's this stuff with Diablo taking 7 hours to complete, the Mass Effect 3 ending, on disc DLC with Capcom, EA being named the worst company in the world, Gamestop still existing, that hacking junk that happened with PSN so many months back, Japan threatening to go the way of the Dodo, and probably a bunch of other stuff I've blocked out.

Dark days. What did I leave out?

[mrsmiley381]

The part where video game characters were heroes. Now they're just as important as AI NPC characters, like in Syndicate.

Great game, great game world, terrible player involvement. You're half there, at most. In Actraiser, you're God. Motherfucking YHVH, as Shin Megami Tensei would put it. You slap Satan's shit then leave the world to its own devices. There's all sorts of symbolism and implied badassery. In Syndicate you're some prick you got incredibly screwed over by more than one party. Jesus Tap-Dancing Christ snorting coke off a crossdressing hooker's ass, let me feel like the character I controlled did something important. Even Phantasy Star Universe, as terrible as it started, ended with the player seeing his or her character become the most badass single fucking character in the entire story to the point where Ethan and his space elf slut didn't even matter any more.

Does D3 take seven hours on the first try, seriously? What an embarrassment. I'm fucking inches from going off the gaming gird. I'm talking ninety-percent Dreamcast with a side of PS2 classics and rom-hacked fan translations, with maybe some current Sega just to pretend like I know what's going on.

Edit: I didn't mean to angrily call Karen Erra a space elf slut. Apologies to the PSU writing staff.

[trap15]

Cave is dying.

[louisg]

Sorry, I can't hear you over my collection of rockin' 16-bit games

[Vexorg]

Well, these are obsessed Korean powergamers we're talking about here, and they've probably spent about haif a zillion hours in the beta already.

[Blackbird]

I kind of know what you mean. It feels like almost all the developers I admired when I was young are either defunct or amalgamated into EA or Activision. Sometimes it feels like almost all the developers in NA have been amalgamated, actually. I feel like it's the "Evil Empire" and you can only pick bad or worse.

Then I remember that I can just ignore them and play indie games or any number of titles from a few decades of classic gaming.

Probably what I miss most is joining into the currently popular multiplayer games and playing in a more social way, but I won't do that if it means buying from the rEApers or Kotick.

[Kaiser]

I kind of know what you mean. It feels like almost all the developers I admired when I was young are either defunct or amalgamated into EA or Activision. Sometimes it feels like almost all the developers in NA have been amalgamated, actually. I feel like it's the "Evil Empire" and you can only pick bad or worse.

Then I remember that I can just ignore them and play indie games or any number of titles from a few decades of classic gaming.

Probably what I miss most is joining into the currently popular multiplayer games and playing in a more social way, but I won't do that if it means buying from the rEApers or Kotick.

Multiplayer gaming is overrated, the only time it's good is when you play it with friends. I spent a year playing BF Bad Company 2 with friends, BF3? None, as no one got it due how shit it was.

[Skykid]

Sorry, I can't hear you over my collection of rockin' 16-bit games

[RGC]

Don't think I'd be at all bothered if no new games were produced for the next 5 years. Movies either. And I'm quite a big fan of both. Indeed, a 5 year hiatus would probably help generate some fresh creative ideas.

[Ruldra]

What did I leave out?

Online passes, day 1 DLC, games being a broken mess at launch and requiring months of waiting for patches.

However, despite being in the "dark ages", I still have no problem finding games I want to play. My backlog is big enough to keep me busy for years to come and there are still a bunch of quality games I intend to buy (Dark Souls, Skyrim, PS3 Wizardry, MotoGP 10/11, possibly Test Drive Ferrari Racing Legends). All the stuff you mentioned sucks for a lot of people, but it doesn't affect me at all as I simply stay clear of them and look elsewhere.

[JBC]

Same here. I actually don't feel too negative about all the stuff I named off. Maybe it will lead to a renaissance. You're gonna really like Dark Souls.

[Op Intensify]

Dark Souls managed to break 1.2 million copies sold (and the PC version will sell more), so that at least proves there's still a market for deep, challenging RPGs that don't hold your hand like Skyrim or try to be online casinos like Diablo 3.

I wish we could return to the days when someone like Ubisoft was willing to publish Senko no Ronde and rescue Armored Core: For Answer's US release when Sega passed on it. Even Activision, the company of CoD and WoW, was bringing over some fairly niche Japanese stuff (Tenchu) at one point.

[Teufel_in_Blau]

Maybe not exactly related to the OP but still worth a read:

http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/1704 ... lapses.php

The decline of software sales after such a long time is nothing new or shocking. Well, maybe the fact that we have to wait at least another two years until a new PS or Xbox comes out but this two particular pieces I find very interesting,:

As Wedbush Securities analyst Michael Pachter said to me in a recent email, "casual gamers are never buying consoles again."

So, for example, offering a broader variety of video-on-demand providers and add-on services could help make the HD consoles more attractive to the casual consumers, increasing the audience for everything that the console has to offer, including games.

Let me be clear that even with price cuts and new services, none of this is going to revive the software situation at retail. Those graphs at the top of this article, the ones showing the dire year-over-year declines, are the same pictures we're going to be seeing for retail software, likely for years.

So the retail market will likely shrink, no matter what. The future will be that big games will be released in retail and milked via DLC to hell and back, while the small devs will likely end as download only.

This gen actually brought me tons of great games but on the other hand it is the very first time that I fear the next gen. Usually I was always very excited about a new console generation, seeing the advancement and new ideas. I'm starting to understand those old farts who are always complaining how in the past was everything better, but on the other hand I guess I just have too much information these days. When I was small I was so happy to get a cheap console while going into a small game store where I could buy used Sega games for less than an apple, not knowing that Sega was actually fighting for life. Today I feel bad for buying my games cheap.

[Friendly]

As Wedbush Securities analyst Michael Pachter said to me in a recent email, "casual gamers are never buying consoles again."

The guy is a moron. 3/4 of his predictions turn out wrong, the rest are platitudes, like "New consoles will be released in 2013". He doesn't have a clue about the video game industry and market.
People need to stop quoting him; he's less of an expert than most users of this forum, myself included.

[Teufel_in_Blau]

I know what you mean, Friendly. I'm also not a fan of Pachter, but he do has a point. What reason has a casual gamer to buy a new console if they can get most of their playtime out of Facebook and/or Iphone games? As a media device? Maybe.

I read that many North Americans actually bought a Wii just because they could use it as Netflix box. In a big media store here in Germany the Wii was and still is advertised as a Yoga training box via a gigantic setup. If you want to see the Wii games you have to go to the other site of the store, which is is huge. It would be very interesting to know how many fat women bought a Wii just for this, not knowing that it also can play games. At least this would explain a part of the bad Software sales on this console (aside from the first party Nintendo games).

[louisg]

Maybe not exactly related to the OP but still worth a read:

http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/1704 ... lapses.php

The decline of software sales after such a long time is nothing new or shocking. Well, maybe the fact that we have to wait at least another two years until a new PS or Xbox comes out but this two particular pieces I find very interesting,:

I wonder how much of it has to do with that we're basically in-between generations. There was a lot of talk about how this generation is "future proof" and would last forever (or at least for an entire decade), which seemed like a ridiculous assertion to me.

I know what you mean, Friendly. I'm also not a fan of Pachter, but he do has a point. What reason has a casual gamer to buy a new console if they can get most of their playtime out of Facebook and/or Iphone games? As a media device? Maybe.

Yeah, flashing back to 2006, there wasn't a lot of competition for the attention of casual gamers. Now there are all sorts of distractions. But casual gaming is also pretty big, just in general. Look how huge something like Angry Birds is. The big trick is figuring out what you can offer that's new in terms of hardware for that audience (if at all).

[Mischief Maker]

If you're looking to wash the taste out of your mouth left by Mass Effect 3, Dragon Age 2, and the other "AAA" good-enough-for-government-work efforts of late, might I suggest Witcher 2?

[Hagane]

The first part was Gothic lite (worse combat system and exploration) with tits and lots of boring fetch quests, is the second any better?

Also haven't played Mass Effect 3, how does it compare, system wise, to the second (which I enjoyed, stupid minigames and mineral grinding aside)?

[TransatlanticFoe]

Yeah, I'm considering sitting out the next generation like I did when the Dreamcast went under until I got a Wii and a gaming PC a couple of years ago.

Talk of more DRM just wants me to walk away again. The Wii, with the controls for FPS I always wanted, some fun rail shooters and the odd excellent other game, that really brought me back into gaming. The PC stuff less so because it's all pretty much the same with a different story bolted on and half the time it's scuppered by horrific DRM. Wii U has to continue what worked motion control-wise on the Wii or I'm sitting it out - I'm not playing exclusively on an oversized gamepad with a honking big screen in the middle.

Mass Effect 3 I'm actually waiting to see if they bring out a "gold" edition with the new content included. But faffing around with multiplayer, integrating it with single player and then rushing out an unfinished product is nigh-on unforgivable. Fuck off with your obsession with multiplayer games!

[Despatche]

There's this stuff with Diablo taking 7 hours to complete, the Mass Effect 3 ending, on disc DLC with Capcom, EA being named the worst company in the world, Gamestop still existing, that hacking junk that happened with PSN so many months back, Japan threatening to go the way of the Dodo, and probably a bunch of other stuff I've blocked out.

i'm gonna assume you never played d2, know nothing about diablo, and know nothing about the people who've beaten this game in 7 hours

most of the other stuff is either wrong or stupid to mention at this point

these are not the god damned dark ages, what is wrong with you people? you have it a lot better today than you ever have, and this is coming from the guy who wants the '80s and '90s back

[JBC]

You're gonna assume wrong, chill out.

[Blackbird]

these are not the god damned dark ages, what is wrong with you people?

Games are arguable. Companies are not. I can't even buy half of the games coming out now because the publishers install spyware in them, lie to their customers, or blackmail their own developers.

Your head is in the sand if you think these aren't the dark ages.

[Despatche]

your head is in the sand if you think this is a recent thing, never mind that you're refusing to buy some games for practices you (and most people) don't actually care about.

You're gonna assume wrong, chill out.

oh no, i don't think you know this series very well. it is not an achievement to beat the first difficulty of these games in under 7 hours, especially when its being done by what may as well be "professionals" of these games. that tends to apply to clones, too.

[ShmupSamurai]

This thread had not better turn into another string of inane arguements....

*Ahem* Back on topic, does anyone feel the industry is heading for another crash, like in the very early 80's?

[Despatche]

funny how you complain about "inane arguments" and then bring up everyone's favorite "TIME FOR ANOTHER CRASH"

[Blackbird]

your head is in the sand if you think this is a recent thing, never mind that you're refusing to buy some games for practices you (and most people) don't actually care about.

I love it when people tell me what I do and don't care about . I do care about it. That's why I brought it up. I actually work on games, and putting myself in their shoes, I'd be pissed if my bosses witheld my pay. A company like that shouldn't be supported, no matter how good their games are.

If customers cared more about what the companies do (enough to actually man up about boycotting), then they would get away with less bullshit. Principles matter.

[Despatche]

this isn't something against you (actually i tend to like you), it's something against a lot of people. i don't think anyone has the guts to tell people what they "care about" besides me, and that's probably the whole issue. it's actually really painful that you're correct here.

[Blackbird]

I can appreciate your point. There are plenty of times when people are expressing opinions and, inwardly, you think "Yeah, this other person is sandbagging/trolling just to be contradictory, he doesn't actually care."

I try to be in this camp as little as possible.

[GaijinPunch]

I'm starting to understand those old farts who are always complaining how in the past was everything better,

We need a thumbs up smiley.

I wonder how much of it has to do with that we're basically in-between generations. There was a lot of talk about how this generation is "future proof" and would last forever (or at least for an entire decade), which seemed like a ridiculous assertion to me.

Yeah, I wanted to see the graphs against PS2/Xbox mid-cycle. The economy sucking ass isn't going to help. But, I think the overall theme of this thread, especially what Teufel_in_Blau has been saying, is true. The days of retail packaging are numbered, and even then, buying the package isn't going to be the last stop. What sucks about games is when the console finally goes DL only, you can't have some renegade programmers making wicked retail packages for it. The upside to some creative record labels is you can still buy some nifty vinyl packages... or CDs if that's your thing.

RIP: Gaming as a hobby.

your head is in the sand if you think this is a recent thing,

Maybe not new but hasn't been around for ever. There are tons of translations out there of interviews with developers that have been around since the 80s. Working for even large-ish dev houses (Sega, Data East, Taito) was apparently a delight.

[Blackbird]

I fully acknowledge that nostalgia colors my opinion, but some of the ways that games are monetized now weren't even possible back in the 90's. A real money auction (Ebay/PayPal -_-) being directly integrated into the game itself (Diablo 3) would have been completely impossible as recently as a few years ago.